Why Prevent Suicide? Here Are My Reasons.

 “If someone’s life is so awful that they want to die by suicide, why stop them?”

I am frequently asked some variation of this question, even by mental health professionals. Once, a therapist told me about a client of hers with schizophrenia. “He is miserable, and he will always have schizophrenia. I think letting him kill himself is humane.”

I am passionate about suicide prevention. My stance often draws the ire of people who think that people should have the right to end their own life without interference by well-meaning others.

To my mind, there are many reasons to stop someone from suicide. (I am not, by the way, including “death with dignity” or “hastened death.” That’s grist for another discussion.)

Before going into those reasons, I want to make clear that I don’t take intervention lightly. I don’t call the police if someone discloses suicidal thoughts. I don’t think people should be involuntarily committed to a hospital except in the most extreme circumstances, like if someone has a gun in their car and tells me they are going to shoot themselves when they leave my office, without any desire or will to come up with an alternative (like, say, having someone hold on to their gun for them). I consider myself to be a therapist who doesn’t panic about suicide. 

But I do believe that therapists should never give up helping a suicidal person to stay alive. The most important reason to prevent suicide is that suicidal crises, though formidable and painful, almost always are temporary. Even if the person continues thinking about suicide, the intense suicidal intent usually subsides. Consider that 90% of people who survive a suicide attempt do not go on to die by suicide. That number is very revealing. Even among people who wanted to die so strongly that they tried to end their life, most ultimately chose to live.

As long as a person is alive, things can change for the better. Situations change. Even if their external situation is unchangeable, they may discover things that make their life worth living. There is always the possibility that they may find ways to cope. Or they may come to appreciate different things in life. They may even find a purpose in life that gives their loss or trauma meaning.

Kevin Hines is a suicide prevention advocate who, years ago, jumped off of the Golden Gate Bridge, the site in the U.S. with the most suicides every year. Death is almost certain when one jumps from the bridge. More than 1,500 people are known to have jumped to their death, and only 30 or so are known to have survived. So when Kevin jumped from the Golden Gate Bridge, he was absolutely intent on dying. And yet, even with that intention, the moment he jumped off the bridge, he instantly regretted his decision.

His experience is one of many (including my own story) that illustrates that the wish to die is fluid. It comes and goes to varying degrees. A great many people who are saved from suicide are thankful, sooner or later, to be alive.

Another important reason to prevent suicide is because, proponents of rational suicide notwithstanding, in almost all cases suicide is decidedly irrational. Research consistently indicates that 90% of people who die by suicide had a diagnosable mental illness at the time of their death. Mental illness distorts thinking. What is bad can seem good, and vice versa. Often, very often, when a person’s mental health improves, the wish to die goes away.

Some people contest the high estimates of mental illness in suicide. Even if we presume the 90% figure is correct, not everyone who dies by suicide has a mental illness. Other things besides mental illness can also distort one’s thinking, such as substance use, sleep deprivation, and trauma.

When people address these issues, they often join the legions who seriously considered suicide or made an attempt, and who many years later live to tell about it.

Revised on May 30, 2017, this post was originally titled “If Someone’s Life is So Awful that They Want to Die, Why Stop Them?”

© Copyright 2013; 2017 Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW. All rights Reserved. Written For: Speaking of Suicide. Photos purchased from Fotolia.com

 

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  1. Aaron says:

    It should be a case of being able to buy a £200 bottle of nembutal. That’s how easy and cheap it should be, in fact even cheaper, £100. I can buy it cheaper than that if I were to travel to Mexico or Peru etc. In fact risks of bringing it back to the UK aside it would still be cheaper than, for example Dignitas, to fly to mexico, buy the nembutal and fly back to the UK.

    Once again, despite the fact that we have no choice over whether we come into this world, the choice to leave it is stifled by those who worship money or those who believe a few statistics from Psychological research are the be all and end all. Research and stats by the way that are possibly heavily flawed. That 90% figure for example. I would like to see if the researchers continued to keep track of their case studies to see if they had attempted suicide since? Have they achieved it since? How long a period were the studies conducted over? How many people took part? Every suicide attempt in the world (obviously impossible)? Anyone got the answers to all this for me? No. spouting a few numbers means nothing, absolutely NOTHING.

    The Kevin Hines story is all great and lovely, but it’s one in an ocean that are untold and is not conducive as proof that the person who wrote this article is right and that all regret the decision to attempt suicide. Many, many people do go on to attempt it again and die.

    It really annoys me, these people are as self righteous as the religious crowd who say Suicide is punishable by eternal damnation when in my opinion God/Allah etc don’t exist anyway, neither do heaven or hell, therefore I have nothing to worry about.

    Besides if someone dies they won’t care anyway because they will be no more, they won’t feel pain or loss, they will feel nothing and neither will they care because they will not exist to care. What bliss.

    My reasons for wishing to get it over and done with are many including a couple of losses both recently and in the past year (just under) that I can’t get past nor can I reverse (I think at least, pretty sure though), constant mental struggles that the mental health services are failing to diagnose time and again, despite the fact I am sure I know what my problem is and have told them, financial ruin, not knowing who I am anymore and that’s to name a few. Suicide is not even illegal, yet accessing a peaceful and painless means of doing so is made so difficult it’s unreal. I’m trying to import nembutal as we speak, but it’s proving difficult. I have found a source who will ship a bottle of liquid nembutal to me, from Mexico, for a total of around £400 and whilst expensive in my opinion, it’s a damn sight cheaper than Dignitas and others and preferable to continuing this existence.

    Thankfully there are people like Dr Philip Nitschke of Exit International who believe it is the right of all to have access to a safe, reliable and painless means of exit. He believed it should be the right of all adults who make the decision logically, of their own volition and not restricted only to those who are terminally ill.

    To those who believe these things are temporary, please don’t patronise me. This is my choice and no one else has any say in the matter. How dare anyone try and insinuate otherwise. In the words of John Stuart Mill;

    “Over himself, over his own body and mind, the individual is sovereign”

    Couldn’t have put it better myself. This whole topic makes me so angry and frustrated.

  2. Ellen says:

    This is great. And I respect your position however. I have an incurable Disease which is driving me to financial ruin to the point of choosing if I can in fact continue treatment. I cannot simply because money has run out. I need to end this agony. I’m facing financial destitution. When it’s like this I have to think of more than myself. I cannot leave my family homeless when there is nothing more we can do. I’m over this. I’m the one suffering daily. I’m the one stacking up the overwhelming costs. So no. I’m not interested in help for saving me but help to complete the task at hand.

  3. me says:

    you say you would care but you wouldnt even know

  4. Paul says:

    When someone is suffering and it is growing worse all the time then it is natural to want to go, and that is why Oregon has an assisted suicide law. The thing that makes it good in my opinion is that doctors are required to do something to help with the suffering so that they are given a chance at life. It is the suffering that makes the mind think such thoughts as I should not be here. The same thoughts that most animals have before they die, we even are encouraged to give our pets a peaceful farewell when they are suffering and there is really nothing that can be done to help them any longer. However being the litigious society that we are and also because too many want the government to be their daddy when they are not able to solve problems on their own. People generally suffer needlessly, and there are exceptions for things such as hospice care for stage 4 cancer for those that live in some of the major cities, and they can get high levels of morphine till they decide to checkout on their own. I refer it this way as they are almost gone and just want to spend a last few minutes with someone before they go. However, those that are not close to San Jose and other places with the best of care. Those people suffer the worst. In Russia for example, military people with terminal cancer are not able to get the pain relief due to international restrictions and restrictions in Russia as well. This is a world wide problem, and the best country to die in from what I read is England and the UK, the USA is in the top 5, so is Australia, and New Zealand, France, Switzerland, Canada, etc. Basically the countries that are at the top for use of pain medications. There are some parts of the world were there is no relief from pain other than what is available from drug dealers at a high cost, according to multiple sources on palliative care. This is mostly due to the enforcement of drug laws to stop trafficking in narcotics. Part of the law at the UN was to make sure that there was legal access, but the cost to do that in most countries is prohibitive. It is very difficult in Mexico as well I know someone his mom is going through what I am however I have a good pain doctor helping me, something that she does not have access to. As my wife used to put it (till I lost my job), be careful at work, you know they shoot horses when they become disabled. As in Animal Farm, and this is a good reading about the problems of socialism and over reaching government written by George Orwell. There are many other short books that do give this problem a perspective, and they have unsurprisingly all been written in the last 100 years. Back then most things that are illegal and regulated today were quite legal and easy to get, then came the outlaw of liquor then it all changed for the worst things have been going downhill for the common citizen since then. Just as the old saying absolute power corrupts absolutely. Also there are no checks and balances when it comes to government agencies, they set their own rules and enforce them. Only rarely does congress even question them on the things that they do that harm many. Does Senator Joe McCarthy ring a bell to anyone? He basically ran the UN-American activities committee, and many people lost their jobs and were unable to find work because they were suspected communists, and there were a few but most were not. That really does not matter to the average person till they loose everything because they were called into be a witness in a witch hunt, and then they find out that they are also suspect. That is the out of control war on drugs, it can’t be won… it is a power play where most are the looser, same with the war on terror, it is something that also can’t be won but there is trillions to be made for a small number of companies, and all of us loose our civil rights as a result. Personally I have no fear of terrorists in the USA, as they are very unlikely to kill me or even harm me or anyone that I know. We are more likely to be struck by lightning. However there are some that are targets, and some places that are targets. Basically anything that calls out to foreigners, Corporate America if you were to get a job at such a place you would get paid tax free many times what you could earn doing the same job at home… However you would have to watch your back at all times when there including travel to and from the work site, and also in and out of that country. Usually people that take such jobs are retired military, that are still quite young. They have put in their number of years that they signed up for, and they can go back and earn many times more. As all of those jobs require a security clearance, and that is one of the benefits that people get in the military, at least from all of those that I have talked to with an honorable discharge (while we are taking classes together in college).

    One of the hard realities of the world that we are never told about as children is what the real world is like, and quite often our parents do not even know the most of it, but I will leave that with there are many loosers in any conflict and often it is those that were not even involved. Also determine the source of the message before paying attention to it, as this tell you the slant that they are giving the message, and lastly it comes down to that the only person that you should fully trust is yourself, as others under certain conditions may use what you tell them against you no matter how subtle. This holds doubly true when talking to those that are employed by the government, and above all most people consider most of their work just a job and for the most part are interested in covering themselves for legal liability. However there are exceptions to this, and you will know because they will do things to help you when others will not. Also those most helpful never ask leading questions so they can get something out of you, but are most likely to say not to mention something to others for your own benefit. Also how you appear in attitude is more important than how you actually feel, and this goes along with what someone sees from you in the first 10-15 seconds determines how they actually see you, no matter how false that it really is. Sadly quite often the only person that can do the most to protect you is yourself, and it also helps to know and have a personal relationship with a psychologest in your medical plan as that can save you and your family lots of greif in the future. It also helps to have a good lawyer, as those that are innocent need a lawyer more than those that are guilty of a crime. That is because innocent and guilty are decisions of the court and really makes no difference if you committed a crime or not. That is because it is far easier to get a confession out of someone that has not committed any crimes than someone that has in the past and knows what not to say so they can stay free. As quite often most guilty verdicts do not involve a trial and also evidence that you did not do it is often suppressed. To prove my point look on YouTube for a video called something like “Why you should never talk to police” also “you can’t talk yourself out of a ticket”. The best ones are done by law schools, lawyers, and former police officers. Keep in mind that most police are good, but all it takes is one bad one to ruin your life. I am bringing this up mainly because of the name of the topic here, and you do not want the police to take you away on suicide watch. They will if you are seen as an immediate threat to yourself, and that is exactly why I mentioned most everything that I have. You are in the clear if you say you fear for your life due to your poor treatment by someone or some company etc, and it sometimes helps to say that you have people that will likely die due to they are disabled and unable to function well enough to care for themselves if you are not able to etc. also that you fear for their life. Basically what I am getting at is don’t talk your way into a situation that it takes a team of lawyers and a couple of outside psychologists to get you out of. That being giving a date that you might end your life etc. Those kind of statements get people all the time, and I have heard a read a few. Also as the old saying goes most people will do the easiest thing they can to complete their given task, that is unless they will get paid more to drag it on, and most police during an investigation can and do look for that overtime pay. I know because I have known a few police officers over the years, and also went to school with a few. The agenda is not your safety as much as society as a whole, and as such they look out for fellow officers first.

    • Aiah says:

      Paul, thank you for your detailed comment. I feel most will misread what you’ve shared, but there’s nothing any of us can do about this. I am a board certified neurologist and regularly do psychiatric consults (when behavioral aberrations are likely the consequence of physically identifiable neural pathology or trauma). I’ve posted elsewhere in this and other threads on self determination over the years largely as a counter-voice to the prevalent–and severely misguided, both philosophically/ethically and scientifically–psychological pathology model of mental health. What I express never goes over well and has been strongly censored by members of the professional psychiatry/psychology communities. It is only my standing as a department chair and a well published professional myself that has saved my career from unabashed threats from those who cannot produce any empirically sound arguments or evidence objectively defending their platform of psychological pathology, including their fabricated definitions of mental illness wholly uncorroborated by any rigorous causal arguments the rest of the world of science requires in order to substantiate claims.

      This is relevant because the perspectives and sentiments and values of these psychological professionals are then used to exploit public gullibility (the public largely believes or acts in accordance with what credentialed professionals say) and manipulate laws and policy (so what free citizens can do is circumscribed by the UNempirical, scientifically UNsound pronouncements of a few–despite the blatant conflicts of interest; maybe you’ve read the reports of the recent internal memos from Goldman Sachs about what poor business practice curing patients is). Still, our culture sacrifices personal freedom on the altar of the appearance of ethical responsibility. Never mind that very many of the precipitants of suicidality have their genesis in government policy and the way communities treat the vulnerable. We can’t or won’t change society, so we’ll instead vilify or pathologize those who succumb to society’s treatments, thereby alleviating the rest of us from any culpability.

      People need to understand what you’ve pointed out about law enforcement–that it is NOT there to protect the individual (but rather the State), and that in psychiatric settings, as elsewhere, what one says–HOW one says something–provides fuel AGAINST oneself. Yes, everyone should have a trustworthy lawyer. As much as that’s an apparent oxymoron, it’s also financially beyond the means of most citizens. Which is all the more of a reason for people to protect themselves by not saying things likely to have their rights removed. I have been present in clinic many times when innocent statements by reasonably bereaved patients or family members have resulted in unconscionable incarceration (“civil commitment”). And you are dead correct that it takes boatloads of cash, time, personal fortitude, and exceedingly competent and willing legal help to TRY to undo such damage. Many such victims, including a psychiatric nurse whom I’d known since my own medical residency, find their careers over after a long and costly and bitter legal battle. All because someone said a few wrong words aloud. Talk about the thought police.

      I’ve said it frequently before: psychiatry/psychology have become the modern State-religions. We no longer burn people at the stake for being witches. Instead, we figuratively set them on fire for thinking in ways the rest of us–or more accurately the unreasonably powerful psychiatric/clinical psychology lobbies–deem inappropriate. All this despite our hollow rhetoric about personal and intellectual freedoms. I cannot agree with you more: we must all protect ourselves as best we can at ALL times. Unfortunately, as it probably was gravely dangerous to let slip a disbelief in god during the functional theocracy of the early Colonies, it is today often dangerous to let slip any comment betraying one’s commitment to one’s self-ownership and one’s disavowal of the absurd, unscientific postulating of the new church of professional psychology.

      Thanks, again, for your comment and for your patience with my reply. As always, I should also thank this blog owner for her courage in NOT censoring comments diametrically opposed to the prevalent, official policies and practice of modern psychology and psychiatry.

  5. Lem says:

    You don’t have a clue if you aren’t living it! Especially if your husband and daughter want nothing to do with you!

  6. Dante says:

    I am so goddamned sick of that Kevin Hines story. It’s been more than 20 years of me wanting to die and having to hear about that response.

  7. Theresa says:

    Thank you for your comment. Since i found out i was born in the west indies with an american father who has cherokee ancestry. I am a mixture of all races and i have had only one doctor to actually help me with only three neds. One migraine called fiorecet as needed and hydrocodone as needed and diazapam for muscle spasms as needed. He retired early because of the government. He tried to fight for us chronic pain patients but the other docs were chicken. My pain was controlled and i was told to go ahead a fill every prescription and lock them up and i did and had 5 years of meds i never got dependent on until they forced me to take the crap every day. Now im on 9 prescriptions. My condtion flare up have progressed into now joint pain as well. I keep fighting but sometimes its hard. Damn this pain. I want to live but not suffering or slobbering all over myself. No im not sad nor depressed. Just relentless pain. Which my psych eval proved nothing wrong with me mentally Happy usually as long as i can control the pain in my body. Without this every single day pain. I make others smile. I am a CNA

  8. Theresa says:

    Please dont misunderstand this. So many people including myself have chronic pain issues without cures. Think about waking up every day in a pain that drs dont believe is there because all test come back normal. So they assume its all in your mind so they send you to a psychiatrist and they put you on all these antidepressants which still the pain is there and instead of never been depressed a day in your life. Yes people get sad. A death in the family a marriage or relationship break up. It is truly makes you sad. Most people as like myself the sadness goes away after exceptance of this life changing experience. My father suffered with cancer and fought so hard to live but lost his battle. I was in church the following day not sad because we were expecting this outcome. I knew my Dad fought as hard as he could and yes i missed getting up that morning without him but he was not suffering anymore. He is the reason i am who I am today. I help those that can’t do for themselves anymore but i suffer also in Chronic pain for the past 20 years. My husband now has watched me suffer in so much pain. I beg God to take me home soon. Do i want to die of course not. I love every thing the sunshine on my face. Long walks around my neighborhood and going to the beach. Out on our boat. Cook outs. The night air and star gazing. I also love to write. So if chronic pain suffers cant get relief and my husband has watched drs put me on antidepressants and had to tell them not put his wife on any more because they do nothing but cause me to be depressed. He saved me from that nightmare and my evaluation the following visit was great. In moderate pain back then and no antidepressant. I had a great childhood loving parents and 20 years ago i caught a bad flu virus. It was def the flu and took the tamaflu med and soon was better. Then a couple of months later i started feeling over tired. So i added some vitamins changed my diet for a while. Then insomnia started. I had always had migraines as a child and also a slow digestive tract. They assume now that it was caused by my birth mother being poor and i was extremely malnutrition. My father and step mom took me to the states and i was never really ever sick. So depression did or hadnt started any of tbese pain conditions. I was super wife and mother but my second marriage broke up because of a dr. Telling my ex i was lying about being in pain. I was just being lazy. Even though xrays showed degenerative arthritis in my neck that would leave me in the bed staring at the ceiling because my head was so heavy it hurt to lift it off a pillow and on occassions i have use a soft neck brace when my neck gets inflamed. Then an mri showed two bulging disk in low back. That was found after i couldnt walk myself to the bathroom one morning. I can handle both those issues and the migraines at once without anything but some advil. At least back in the day i could. I dont like medications and i def hate to have a needle poked me to ease my pain off. Before my son was born i found at 20 weeks i needed to terminate my pregnancy so they could deal with my cervical cancer. My child had a chance and i believed Jesus could and would save us both so i got procedures done to keep cutting away at my cervics and ended up on bedrest the remainder of my pregnancy from june 15th to aug 5. I spent in the hospital due to constant hemorhaging. Horrible because arthritis stffens a body up if you are not allowed to get up and move around and in very terrible pain so a team of physicians had to find sometbing safe for my baby that i could take. I didnt know the difference between an opiet or asprin to be honest back then. I just knew i trusted my docs. They had me on a narcotic and while in the hospital i got to go home for two hours before the bleeding started and passed out on the comode and back to the hospital. I had started feeling tbis pain all over my body in the hospital. I thought it was because i wasnt my active self anymore. I had five kids at home and missed home terribly. My son was born the 3rd induced labor to save both of us. Something was seen on the ultrasound. So they gave me the shots to speed up his lungs but only one matured fully. One had some catching up to do. He stayed in nicu for 12 days and they made me nest because they tested me for drugs the day of admission the social worker said and i tested positive for opiets. I asked her what was an opiet. She called me a liar and i asked to be released immediately. I asked her which day of admission and i said lady did you even read my chart because if you had all drugs came from that hospital that they had given me day of admission was the same day i was released for two hours i was away from their staff. I was labeled because no body fully read my chart. Also because of a nurse mixing up urine samples i got another label. Believe it or not but it happens and they wouldnt retest me either. Which was so unfair. With trying to work in pain losing my family because of someones elses opinions and mistakes. I think if a person is in chronic pain and its constant and it burts just to move. We should have a right to end it. Im still fighting fibromyalgia and the flare ups are getting worse and no do i want to die. No i am like so many suffering endlessly and i can handle pain two kids no drugs 8 kidney stones. But fibro pain is all over the body. It never ends. You only get partial relief from it but flare ups its an er visit. So im still not depressed. This is my life and im still fighting but i pray God takes me home soon because its worse than having a baby. At least you lnow that pain ends. So dont judge medical issues you dont unferstand or test dont show it. God knows i want to live just in a little less pain. Dont blame all pain issues you cant find on depression. Suicide will definely be on the rise the for chronic pain patients because drs dont have the balls to fight for us against congress and the stats are wrong. The cdc doubled the opiet epidemic. Its heroine and fentanil killing our people in the US. That woman on tbe news said her son started with pain pills from her cabinet. I doubt it. I am sorry for their loss but everyone knows what goes on in high school and omg really the college parties. I live in a college and beach town. These kids when they get caught they arnt going to tell on their dealers. Has the whole country lost their mind God gave them. Why go to college all those years to practice medicine and try to cure folks and if they cant at least make their life as comfortable as possible so they have some quality of life. I just lost a fibro friend. Her fight is over. Mine will be over. I have a great busband now. My children are grown and just trying to enjoy my grandbabies. Fibro pain does progress then they give you a new diagnosis complex pain syndrome. Have a wonderful nigjt.

  9. Brittany says:

    here took it from the author If you need immediate help, please call 911 or the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 1.800.273.8255 (TALK) in the U.S., or the emergency services in your area if you live elsewhere. You can also check out the Resources page for a list of other places where you can receive help by phone, text, email, or online chat.

  10. Anonymous says:

    It comes and goes, but not really. I mean, the desire to die, at least for me, is always there. It’s just sometimes it’s quiet enough that I’m not actively thinking about doing something about it. If I ever got the nerve to really do it and someone stopped me … I mean, I know it would make that person feel really great about themselves, but what about me? Then I’m back to living in this hell every day. Is that person who “saved” me going to help? Going to make my life more bearable? No, they are off feeling that they “saved” someone and are a hero and I’m left here to suffer.

    • Tom H says:

      I very much appreciate your comment in particular because it addresses something staunch anti-suicide advocates fail to. While SOME people who at one point were suicidal express gratitude for others’ intervention and for having survived, this is just not true about all people who were unsuccessful at committing suicide. More to the point, the assumption that the risks of perturbing people like you are worth it because most (assumption) suicidal people are glad not to have succeeded in their attempts is statistically unfounded, as we are learning is true of very, very much “psychological research,” because, for one thing, many of the reports of how people feel post-intervention are lost to distant follow-up. Yet more, other reviews of psychology dogma disclose strong professional and individual therapist evaluative biases that transfer onto both patient and the community at large–we tend to accept and echo professionals’ sentiments even when, otherwise, these are not authentically our own because we feel these professionals are “right” so we should follow their lead. Worse, many of these professionals’ sentiments are scientifically and philosophically untenable.

      You are ultimately correct: “it would make that person feel really great about themselves, but what about me? Then I’m back to living in this hell every day. Is that person who ‘saved’ me going to help? Going to make my life more bearable? No, they are off feeling that they ‘saved’ someone and are a hero and I’m left here to suffer.” Absolutely NO human being–president, physician, therapist, law enforcer, court official…–should have the power to impose moral or life-evaluative judgments on another free adult citizen. It baffles my mind that educated adults in this Western society founded on ideas of personal liberty presume otherwise.

      Thanks for the reminder and best of luck to you.

    • Paul says:

      Anonymous, I do get what you are saying. There is a reason that you are suffering and it is even without knowing you it is because you do not have enough money to solve the problem or are not in an area that people of low means are able to even get help. The God in the USA is not one in heaven even if heaven were here on earth. The God often worshiped is Mammon or as many know it money. This is just a fact of life for all of us, and does go against the ten commandments in the bible and against the Quran as well. I only mention this as it does help to explain why you, me and many others in this world suffer, even Buddha said that life itself is suffering, as for one thing to live something else suffers. That is why a religious sect called Jain does not eat meat, they do not want to cause the suffering of animals for their benefit. I mention all this about suffering to help explain the human condition, All animal life on this planet eats something, and humans are no exceptions. However humans are the only ones on this planet that feed off of the suffering of other humans. This is not usually done by killing, but when the killing happens it is usually with knifes, guns, hammers, poisons, it can be the result of wars declared or undeclared. We often feed off of the work of others. This is for the most part done in a socially acceptable way and when not is sometimes ends in prison for the offenders. I ask you are you doing it because you see yourself as part of the natural life cycle of humans that is found acceptable by many, or by some untreated illness that is best treated in locations where people care more about life than a quick buck. If it is because you see yourself as part of the cycle of suffering and it is not related to pain, there is hope in Jainism and other faiths that are about ending suffering, if not your best hope is to sell all the things you can and move to a place where you are accepted if you have any will to live and get help, or as you stated death. If that is the case consider moving to Oregon as they have doctor assisted suicide there, and as part of the program there they are required to do what they can to end your suffering first, and then it is all your choice beyond that. I think that is a great thing that they are required to help those that are in pain instead of like most places just let people suffer to the point where death is a persons best option. When a state does not look at ending suffering first, they are promoting death as that is the ultimate result of being more worried about addiction, money and so forth than human life. They say that they are pro-life, but to me and many others it looks like they are pro-death. I realize and others as well that it is not normal to prefer death and suicide, unless the suffering is great and they are given really no other option. As such I am saying that as a result of policies and the way they are carried out they are promoting suicide, and it is not people preferring it to life because they were given the best options. I know in Star Trek, there is a saying “Live long and Prosper”, However a much better saying is “Live well and Prosper” as a long life with only suffering to the extreme is as you say worse than death. I hope that you can find what you need to life a well life, even though it is not all that easy to find it where you live you may find it elsewhere. This is the main reason that people are all over the planet, they move to where life is better for them.

  11. rm says:

    my personal 2 cents as some one who feels suicide is a personal choice, a living beings right to not only choose how its own light goes out, but the degree of dignity it wishes to maintain while doing so:

    my flesh, my rights

    end of story =p

    -rm

  12. Oldntired Downandout says:

    There is never a day or a hour of any day with my pain and family such as they are that I don’t wish I was just dead and it was over because basically for me it is over. The only thing that keeps me standing is my granddaughter and I fear she has little hope because of the enabling ways of her Grandfather, his family, her crazy meth-head addicted to whatever-Mother with ODD and ADHD-no help for sick elderly-they just look for reasons to make us suffer and we are at deaths door now. I was productive once, I was a nurse and I saw this start happening. I don’t think there is any hope for this country and little for the human race. I just love my granddaughter so much I keep trying to see something good. I worry her world will be much worse than this. Those of you who live life blindly tell me how you do it??? I hope if there is a hell, the greedy drug companies, insurance companies, big banks and hospitals get the ghettos of hell. Leave suicidal people alone because they probably know best for them and have given it way more thought than most of you can face death to do.

    [This comment was edited to abide by the Comments Policy. – SF]

    • rm says:

      just because i was in the neighbourhood, Old & Down:

      hope for the best, do what you feel is right, realize that all actions make ripples in a pond

      and try your best to feel the suns warmth on your face, even on a rainy shitty day

      <3

  13. Jose says:

    Corrections for auto correct and not concentrating. It’s not all mental, my physical health has impacted all areas of my mental health and it’s just bad enough that’s it’s physical alone. It’s very draining. Yup, agree Rob, Paul and Tom

    • Paul says:

      I hear you Jose, there are many others like you. However there are ways of getting help, and one way is going into clinics and try different ones. The main thing when talking with doctors is never to say that you are thinking of killing yourself. Do not tell them that you are even considering suicide as they will only think that you have mental problem and that suicidal thought is your problem, that is because most doctors only focus on one problem as part of their training and mental conditioning, when the best of all doctors look at the whole person. All things that are off can often cause the onset and increased problems with other things. All of this is known and is in medical literature. It is also on many medical related websites. I have personally been treating many of my medical problems for years, as I have waited hours at locations only to be told to come back the next day (i did not, as I was in severe pain and started what I knew would solve the inflammation causing the problem, sinusitis colitis and a number of other chronic illnesses are best not treated with pain medications, but other things instead such as antibiotics and anti-inflammatory medications usually done by injection. Antibiotics have no effect on a viral infection, but a bacterial infection that often occurs as a result of the viral infection that decreased the effectiveness of the immune system.). With the posts that I have made in the past it should be obvious that I care about myself and others. Also I see it as a crime to promote suffering of people to line the pockets of the ultra-rich. Also this is more of a problem because there is more of a concern about abuse of drugs than about the untreated things in the life of people. I am not the first to say just like you that there are many things that cause chronic pain, but I disagree with you on one thing you are saying that none understand it. You my friend are going to the wrong doctors. Doctors that are unwilling to take the time to find the cause of your pain, and many times there is severe pain with no cause that can be seen on any x-ray, ct scan or MRI. However an MRI will show abnormalities that often do cause severe chronic pain that are not viable by any other means. That still does not include things such as phantom pain from an amputated limb that often occurs and can be measured with proper tests. All causes of pain can be seen with proper testing. The only reason yours has not been found comes down to only one thing and that is cost. You are going to locations that have no concern for your life, they only are looking at dollar signs. If you can find a hospital that is run by a church they are more likely to help you, and the same for some of the major inner city hospitals in places such as Los Angeles. They help people that can’t afford the care, and the ability to get proper medical care varies by state. Also there are some hospitals that are the worst of the worst. There is one near me, as they do not know how to even put down my proper sex on the paperwork and they put down a few medications that I use as what I am allergic to when I know that there never was any allergic response to those medications. Also from your name I am wondering if you have tried the consulate of Mexico and see if they can find someone to help you with your UN-diagnosed problem causing you pain. Also keep in mind many doctors do not receive enough training in pain management to give you a proper diagnosis. You need the correct doctors to help you.

    • Theresa says:

      Please fight as long as you can to live. I suffer so with chronic pain and i want to live just with a little quality of life. Im not depressed have no mental issues but i have so many chronic pain issues. I want to be your friend not ur hero. Just soft hugs because with my disease thats all i can do most of the time.

  14. Jose says:

    It’s not mental. What about when it is chronic pain that no one really understands to try and figure out. Agree with Paul wrote on (about governments, though he stated US, control, money, that we’re just a coin) 19/01/18. Also Tom H, and I’m too tired and forgetting what am saying. I am 35 and suffering unpredictable disabling pain. I would rather have no life than this quality.

    • Paul says:

      I have lived with chronic pain for about a decade, and the only thing that I can see that comes is more pain and more difficulty getting enough relief from the pain to be able to breath properly and walk somewhat normally. Anymore there is less and less reasons for me to even be here. It is not that I want to die, it is I want to put an end to the suffering that is forced on me and so many others. In addition to the corruption that rules this world. I hear many religious groups talk about hell, and I have thought about it myself. I can honestly say that hell is an improvement to the live that many of us live here on this earth. That is because in hell we are punished for the evil that we do, and here on earth we are punished for the evil that others do, and not so much what we do. If you are basically good, hell is better than here. What people need to keep in mind is that the most dangerous are the ones that create the laws and write the history. I will say that one of the reasons I have no children is that I would not want a child of mine to grow up worse off than me, and to suffer things in childhood that I did not as a child because of control freaks.

      Also I read and hear about people being worried about drug dealers, I can say that they are quite often easy people to get along with and are more open with people about what they are getting into more than doctors are when it comes to using the medications that they prescribe. I have not bought from drug dealers, but have known a number of them personally over the years. The reason they exist is that they are filling a market where one exists. They are basically the pharmacist to those that can’t afford to get medical help for their problems from regular doctors. Taking all kinds of tests means lots of money out of pocket, that did not in the not too far past. It was affordable in the past to get x-rays and other tests, but not anymore. I was born without medical coverage, and all of the costs including the hospital were under $300, but now days that could easily be $60000 or more. Most people do not have the ability to pay what is asked of them. I can now see why people would rather die than go on, if life is nothing but endless suffering. Even The Church of Satan does not promote suicide, they say the only reason for one to end their life is to end the endless suffering, with no possibility of it ending. In other words, if someone is not able to get any enjoyment out of life, and that there is no possibility of any enjoyment of life in the future. Why Christians and others are promoting suffering of the masses is beyond me, when Christ is a healer. We really could use someone like Christ today, ones that are healers. Right now in medicine it is about treatment time and time again instead of healing to get as much money as possible off of each and everyone of us. I say that life was given to us to enjoy and enjoy it with others, but quite often we are too often prevented from doing so by laws that we are told are put into place to so called protect us. That is a lie that not even the devil himself would say, but many accept it as fact. I’m not sure how much longer I will be around, as I am here more for those I care about than myself anymore. Also we live in a world where it is acceptable to bear false witness against people, as lies are perfectly acceptable as a form of extortion in this world. Only way we could have Heaven here on earth is to live a great life without the need for money. This is what many have said in the past, and there are some trying to make it a reality here on earth now. The main thing that needs to happen is that all things mandated upon us, should not need to be paid by us, but those that are mandating them. Republicans talk about no unfunded mandates, then turn around and force them upon us, and same with the democrats.

  15. Paul says:

    Stacy, I have been thinking about what it would take for most normal people to not think of ever committing suicide, but I do not believe that our elected officials in our country will ever allow it, and that is for people to be treated fairly, and allow them to be able to at the very least be able to care for their own selves. We now live in a world that has far more concern for rules and laws to regulate people than allowing them to be able to be functional and care for themselves. Why would our ancestors for over 100,000 years of self medicating be a crime? That is because our lives really no longer matter, and we know this. If our lives really mattered we would be able to learn to provide for ourselves in all ways. Now days it is a crime to do much of the things that our ancestors did to stay alive that harms none. Since this is the case I see far less than I used to and will look the other way when there is no personal benefit for me to do anything else. I see the Mafia, and local gang members as a non threat to me compared to the FDA. Also I am sure that many other people now days feel the same way.

    • Tom H says:

      Paul, you wrote, “I have been thinking about what it would take for most normal people to not think of ever committing suicide, but I do not believe that our elected officials in our country will ever allow it, and that is for people to be treated fairly, and allow them to be able to at the very least be able to care for their own selves.” I agree with you wholeheartedly. I’ve been arguing something similar, which is that rather than forcefully committing individuals intent on committing suicide as a way to “protect” them (all the while subjecting them to horrific so-called medical treatments against their will and removing their other freedoms from them), the psychiatric community (and therapists–anyone, really–can also begin the “civil commitment” process with a simple threatening phone call to the authorities) together with the rest of the community ought to work on making our communities places people WANT to stay alive to keep experiencing. But, of course, human civilizations can’t do that yet. Or we don’t want to. There are people who enjoy hurting others and our governments, despite their rhetoric, care more about money and power than citizens’ quality of life. Nor can we stop people from reasoning that other inevitable life challenges are worth it. Some, for example, simply don’t want to face the horrors of old age–chronic pains; worsening diseases; the indignity of being increasingly discounted; the loss of autonomy; frequent financial disaster, and abandonment by family, friends, and community just to name a few.

      So why are we acting shocked that some people would rather die than experience chronic poverty, or have to work for decades in fields they hate while their bodies suffer injuries and ongoing pain for low wages–just because of competition? Why are we so surprised that some of the undesirables among us who have the SAME desires for affection and intimacy and companionship but who, through no behavioral fault of their own, have been relegated to the scrapheap of humanity would prefer not to live than to suffer every single day from unabated loneliness which we already know is profoundly painful? Why are these professionals demanding that others live lives no one would choose for their children and which no one wants for her-/himself?

      I’ve read some of these professionals’ personal recountings of their own experiences with suicidal thoughts. While I sympathize with their own experiences of pain and applaud their desire to help people, their reasoning that we should ALWAYS intervene to prevent suicide is as irrational as a woman who had an abortion and later regretted it reasoning that under all circumstances all other women should NOT be allowed to have abortions. If the latter scenario is indefensible, I would like to know why the former is not. I just cannot fathom that reasonably educated human beings would believe that life can always be fixed well enough that others won’t prefer to be dead than to live. This should be among the most elementary inferences. In the meantime, while the anti-suicide pundits make it harder and harder for people to leave hellish lives that do NOT get better, they are damning human beings to choose the most gruesome, painful, and lonely ways out of life because many lack the medical competence to do otherwise.

      Thanks for adding your voice to a growing international debate that at last more national governments are paying attention to and acting, thankfully, on behalf of personal freedom.

  16. Brittany says:

    Remember you matter. There is Nothing in this world that is worth taking your precious life: death, being in debt, getting hurt, losing someone, being sick, anything you are dealing with its not worth it, its all temporary and you will get through it. Its a phase. I will care if you die :(((((( please Just loveeee yourself and love others. ♡♡♡ forgive yourself and do something for someone. Email me jesuscaresforyou777@yahoo.com
    because you matter and I care for you. I am here to listen to you, i am here to cry for you. I am here to pray for you. YOU MATTER!!!! ♡♡♡♡♡♡

    • Rob says:

      No, it is not all temporary. Some of us have chronic medical conditions that don’t go away, and make life miserable.

    • Anon says:

      I’m never sure if these replies get to the right comments so excuse the cut-N-paste… Rob (January 14, 2018 at 3:51 pm):

      I agree wholeheartedly. There are many philosophical and scientific problems with the anti-suicide platform, regardless of an individual’s experience with suicidal ideation. I think most of us wish life were such that no one considered suicide. And most of us recognize that life requires good coping strategies. But none of that changes the fact that life can be onerous and exceed the capacity of many to cope, even with professional intervention. There is never a guarantee that any therapy will work. Never. It’s hypocritical of people to claim they care while, recognizing both that they can’t guarantee an end to others’ suffering AND that therapy cannot either, damning others to prolonged, chronic suffering. Yes, many may “get better,” though there are many problems with that presumption, too. But many also do not. And communities are NOT obliged to care for those who’re suffering. Look at all the global reports about the spreading epidemic of painful chronic loneliness and all the physical diseases scientists attribute to it. So adults should ultimately be allowed access to painless, medically competent/efficient ways to leave life if this is our persistent choice. After all, unless every newborn is a slave to the State or the community, the sole thing we should have absolute ownership claims to, irrespective others’ beliefs, is our own lives.

  17. Lee says:

    I’m so ready to get my life over with not that I’m depressed or anything I’m headed for financial disaster and I want to be cremated and I have money just little but can at least have myself cremated and don’t want to be a burden on family but they always want me put in a hospital or some stupid shit and that’s not going to solve the problem at all

    • Chad N. says:

      Lee

      I’m not dismissing your concern over your financial disaster but I have a hard time seeing that as a reason I would consider dying. Money isn’t that important in my opinion. I prefer family which it sounds like you have. I realize they don’t understand the problem but maybe that can change. I know reasons for seeking an end can be complicated and trying to simplify them for others to understand seems easiest but it undermines your argument. That is why I’m doing the formal euthanasia route, getting evaluated and letting the DR try treatments then documenting the failings, or who knows maybe successes. I just want to make sure I’m not missing something in my decision. I hope I am and I hope you might be too. Life should have meaning, I just thought I’d say family seems like meaning.

    • Anon says:

      Chad, I hope you don’t mind me adding my two cents. You wrote, ” I know reasons for seeking an end can be complicated and trying to simplify them for others to understand seems easiest but it undermines your argument. ” I disagree that someone’s argument for rejecting life can be “undermined” so long as the reasons given are personal. Lee’s reasons for wanting to leave are his perceptions of the consequences of “financial ruin” on him. Given poverty is real and people suffer significantly from it, it is reasonable to be terrified of sliding into poverty. Someone else may not fear it but THAT doesn’t invalidate another person’s perspective of poverty and whether he wants to experience it.

      I do appreciate you’ve shared how YOU believe you would feel if you were headed for financial ruin. But surely other people can feel radically differently AND just like the way different people choose to take or leave certain types of music or food, someone else can decide for reasons that matter only to him life is just not worth it. Absent an objective reason such thinking must be “wrong,” and I’ve never come upon such a reason, this type of thinking isn’t the sort of reasoning that can be “valid” or “invalid.” This is really the crux of this whole social debate, but no one is seriously addressing it. To be clear, I’m not advocating any particular choice regarding suicide. I’m arguing that the only opinion that really matters on the matter is that of the person thinking about his or her own life.

    • Chad N. says:

      Anon

      You’re two cents is welcome but we’re saying the same thing. There’s more than just “financial difficulties” going on. The difference being I warned that leaving it at that will allow others to dismiss his assertion or in your case put words in his mouth (assuming Lee is male, sorry if I’m wrong). It’s an honest reaction to being given a difficult topic and limited information.

      Lee

      My point was this. For the people that matter to you provide more detail. It might make it so you don’t go through this alone, may help them know it’s not a fleeting overreaction and could help you feel at peace going forward. At least it has done those to varying degrees for me as another considering death as a better option than life. I’m sorry all I can offer is that advice and I hope you find some value in it.

    • Tom H says:

      Chad N: We are NOT saying the same thing. You wrote, “There’s more than just ‘financial difficulties’ going on.” I wrote that Lee is the only one who can determine what factor or factors make his life worthwhile to him. He has already stated he does not want to experience financial disaster. That is a sufficient reason for HIM. No further justification is required. It is his life and his to judge and his to decide on. He shouldn’t need to explain what others perceive to be something else going on. If the state offered a painless way for people to end our lives, I’d expect specialists to ask us to provide an explanation as a test of our rationality. But there can be no philosophical justification for a judgment that is fundamentally a personal taste.

    • Chad N. says:

      Tom H/Anon?: We ARE saying the same thing. I am just saying more things than the one. I agree only he can decide if his life is worth living to him. I do not deny that and it is the basis of my decision to seek the end of my own life. No further justification is required but that doesn’t mean that one might not attempt to be provided in the right situation. Nothing in my original post negated his original claim I only expressed that my reaction would be different. I did add advice that I hoped might help should he be trying to explain his choice to the family that he stated he has. I am inferring that he has tried and had difficulty doing so in the past given his statement of “they always want me put in a hospital or some stupid shit” in the context of solving “the problem.” Again that was just advice presented as my opinion thus not negating his own. I didn’t tell him what to do or judge him for what he stated he wanted to do. Unless you are offended at me stating I have hope we both might find a reason to live or me expressing my own desire for a family I do not understand your issue with my initial posting.
      Your extract from my second posting, “There’s more than just ‘financial difficulties’ going on.”, is logically analogous to your statement of ,“Lee’s reasons for wanting to leave are his perceptions of the consequences of “financial ruin” on him.”, as you stated REASONS not REASON as he had originally. I too assumed there was more but you went a step further by adding “Given poverty is real and people suffer significantly from it, it is reasonable to be terrified of sliding into poverty.” If you will notice, I stated I believed there to be more while you added details to his condition that did not come from him. YOU put words in HIS mouth and made assumptions on HIS reasons. This is exactly what I was trying to help him avoid should he try to talk to his family again. When faced with a lack of information most people make it up to fill in the blanks just like you did. That was all I was trying to explain. Thank you for demonstrating it.

    • Tom H says:

      Chad N: You wrote, “I know reasons for seeking an end can be complicated and trying to simplify them for others to understand seems easiest but it undermines your argument.” Even if the “your” is general & not specific (meant for the person you’re addressing), that is a claim, minimally, of argument validity. There are no valid aesthetic or moral evaluative arguments. On re-reading Lee’s statement, I see it may not even be financial ruination that motivates his desire to end his life. It is extremely likely that whatever we tell others, or don’t, they will augment what we tell them with their own perceptions and reasons because, regardless what we say, others do not have our experiences, feelings, or thoughts. My gripe is with the supposition of undermining, not what others may envision on hearing what is being said–what I believe to be inevitable.

      I reject the claim that I am putting words in the original speaker’s mouth. I made claims about poverty in general and made an argument about someone else assessing financial disaster. On re-reading Lee’s comment, I don’t know how financial disaster affects his reasoning about suicide, but it isn’t important because his argument is dependent on a subjective evaluation. Again, my gripe is with claims about undermining personally evaluative arguments. On reading your comment back to me, I still maintain we are not saying the same thing.

      It’s not my intention, here of all places, to have a back-and-forth comment battle. Thanks for remaining civil despite our disagreement. Best of luck to you.

  18. Gee says:

    In fact – To whom has written this article could you email me please? GEnuinely think this is something to be advocated for…….IS there anyone who is from UK who would like to possibly formulate a group to provide freedom to choose or can redirect me so ideas can be contributed? Is there anyone here who is rich? I genuinely think so many people could be helped and I think this would be a good business model – BEFORE anyone says ethics,,,,,,,liabilty waivers and agreements can be written up.

    Not everyone can afford dignitas it seems to die peacefully and without big drama will be reserved for those who can afford switzerland or canada!!!

    But definately a HUGE need for such a business and it could be done so smoothly.

    • Anon says:

      Even if I COULD afford Dignitas, I wouldn’t use them. What an insult to so many constantly struggling with the costs of living AND a system designed to benefit the wealthy at the expense, often, of the poor to find that even the act of dying, often in response to financial injustices, requires thousands of dollars. You can’t even get off this rock without hassle.

  19. Gee says:

    I think that there should be a suicide program whereby those who are suicidal can sign up, donate organs ( which would stop organ harvesting, lower donor lists) and do £10,000 death payout fee. Personally think its disgusting that dignitas charge £8,000 not including other fees and charges so its higher than £8,000

    SO instead of people just dying, they are able to leave a small lump sum behind ( can be used to cover funeral costs ,clear debts ** haha not that debt would even be relevant but catch my gist? Help others with their organ donation who WANT to live(which would help so called donor list problem) and person who sign up finally get well deserved peace for themselves!!!!

    People dont understand the exhaustion of having to suffer and bear our personal struggles for others is what makes this depression cycle worse. There are some people who GENUINELY dont mind leaving this ‘life’ place behind – its mundane if you are able to see a bigger picture. Most are too closed minded to view death as a bad thing, when it really is just you being reborn elsewhere……Weird to know that we, all have died already before and just cant remember how and whens……Does time exist? Instead of forcing people to endure there could be a logical system set up where EVERYONE wins 🙂 We need to start question why they dont want us to die,,,,,,,, they want us to work to death!!!!!! longer we are here longer we can pay tax. Its always been a money game folks and dont expect churches to tell you – they are in on it too!!!!!!!!!! Encourage procreation so slave race continues

    Are we growing plants or do the plants grow us? Who REALLY eats who?

    • paul says:

      Interesting that someone wants the organs from someone that commits suicide. If I was going to end my life I guarentee that I would not want anyone to benefit from it. As the only reason that I would end my life is because life is nothing but suffering caused by others. Why should anyone that causes me suffering benefit from my death?

    • Anon says:

      To: paul
      January 10, 2018 at 8:04 pm

      Paul, I totally agree with you. Thanks for having the guts to say what I bet a lot of us are feeling but dare not say aloud.

    • Chad N. says:

      I’m actually working to find a doctor in Belgium so that I can be euthanized. Even so I see no issues with donating organs. Yes I don’t enjoy life but others do. Yes some of those others are related to why I don’t enjoy life but not all. Trying to paint the picture that the rest of the world is all directly related to your low quality of life seems at the least a little overly dramatic to me. How much interaction have you had with the undiscovered tribes in Papua New Guinea? If none then your argument has at least one small hole, if a lot then write a book about it and you’ll be famous.

    • Anonymous says:

      I assure you when I’m dead, I want to be gone from this world completely. No one is having any bodily part of mine.

    • Anon says:

      Hear, hear!

      (to Anonymous
      January 12, 2018 at 6:05 pm )

    • Chad N. says:

      Ok…. organ donation from euthanasia is likely I’d say. Getting paid for it is not due to ethics and the definition of “donation”. If you want to profit off of pain and suffering that’s fine, go to med school or something in law.

  20. Chad N. says:

    Ms. Freedenthal,

    Thank you for reopening this article for comment. I’m sure that it weighs on you but for whatever it’s worth I feel you have built a good forum here.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Thank you, Chad. I appreciate your comment! It does weigh on me, which I wrote about here: https://www.speakingofsuicide.com/2017/08/17/speaking-of-suicide-within-limits/

      Thanks again!

    • Brittany says:

      Chad please dont end your life. You matter to me and so many others. Message me jesuscaresforyou777@yahoo.com. Please it is not worth it. What is going on? I am hear to listen. Anyone else reading this. I love you all and care for you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • Chad N. says:

      Brittany

      Thank you for your consideration but the issue isn’t me mattering to another. It is me mattering to myself. I am just finally valuing what I want out of life and just did so too late. If it might help look at it this way; God made me and made me as I am so who am I to try to divert his will. I simply hope I can fulfill the purpose for me and be done with this life as soon as he will allow. I’m taking it on faith that there is some purpose. Pray for me if it helps you, but remember to pray for yourself as well.

    • Puck says:

      Something that has been upsetting me for sometime is that I feel that many doctors and the FDA want me dead, as I have breathing problems and I am unable to get a doctor to write a prescription for what will help me, as they are worried that it might cause me to have a heart attack in 10 to 20 years. Quite frankly I would rather take a medication that is 100% guarenteed to kill me in 10 to 20 years than have the breathing and helplessness and problems being able to think clearly enough to even be able to put my recepts togeather so I can get my taxes filed. If the tax collector for the state of california takes my home I will not only be ending my life a few others as well, as all of this could easily be solved by proper medications. Am I suppose to go to local drug dealers and buy them what ever that they might want so i can function enough to be able to think at the same level that I was able to just 10 years prior. I really do not care much about the world anymore, as I can see that I am wanted dead, that is other than my parents, friends and business contacts that I have been building for the last 20 years so I can earn enough to live on, but if I am so messed up by lack of proper medicines what is really the point of even living. I did not get my Christmas present that being WWIII as that is most likely the only way that I could possibly have my problems solved, and those that enjoy me suffering get theirs.

  21. Cass says:

    i know how it feels to be in pain every day, it seems like i dnt deserve anything good. things never stop getting worse for me. i wish i had the guts to end it all i wish i knew how to do it. life seems like a neverending torture 🙁

    • Chantell says:

      I feel the exact same.

    • Puck says:

      I know how you feel, as I am in pain every day, and the only things that come to mind is that the reason that we suffer is that we are not the kind of people that support the prison industrial complex that is run by private prisons. They are in support of those that commit felonies against the public far more than those that just need medications to be functional in life. I will admit that I would have never thought 10 years ago that I would be saying much that I do now, about how much that even though I had followed Satan for a number of years that I look forward to the coming of Christ, Ragnarok, or what ever you want to call it because as a species we are a paracite on the face of this planet. We have killed off many species in the promotion of our own life, and now days we are predators on our very own species and actually support this, and say lies that we do not.
      You my friend have nothing wrong with you other than the fact that you are another human of poor design that breaks down prematurely and are unable to get medications and care that will allow you to enjoy the rest of your natural life.
      Ever read about the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah? Those are the kind of places that we live in our world today, and I am not talking about gay, as that is not an abomination, but preying on your own kind is, and that is the world that we live in today.

  22. Anonymous says:

    I want to suicide.

    • Callidora says:

      And why??

    • David says:

      To be brutally honest no one needs to give you a reason why if that’s what they’ve decided. That being said it seems like she/he wants someone to ask but who knows.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Anonymous,

      It’s sad you want to die by suicide. I hope you will check out the Speaking of Suicide Resources page for a list of places you can get immediate help for suicidal thoughts, by phone, email, or text.

    • Brittany says:

      are you okay 🙁 you can talk about whats going on. I know this worlds hard to live in. Your in my prayers

  23. Annoyed says:

    What a load of sanctimonious tripe. Just because YOU were able to recover and see life as worth living, doesn’t mean that applies to others. You are imposing your will on others. What you advocate for is cruel. If someone wants to die and hasn’t responded to treatment, LET THEM

    • Pieter says:

      A sincere question.

      Can someone please articulate the reasons for making suicide illegal?

      I have never understood the moral or legal reasons for people wanting to check out of this mortal coil when they choose to. For people with terminal illnesses, this is a no-brainer (and should be for their loved ones, too). Why anyone would want anyone else to suffer, not to mention the exorbitant amount of money that is wasted trying to eke out a few more breaths of life, is beyond me.

      But I also mean why do we have a problem with someone who simply doesn’t want to live anymore? WHY force someone to stay at a party they don’t want to be at? Seriously. We advocate for personal choice in almost every other aspect of life, particularly medical aspects (abortion, organ donation, drug use, consumption), so why are we uncomfortable with suicide? If there’s any way help can be offered then by all means, then the individual should grab it with both hands. But if they feel they are beyond help & they feel there’s no other way, then the choice is very much up to them.

      Hopefully, like other specious moral issues from yesteryear (gay marriage, gender issues, marijuana etc) we will quickly get past this arbitrary and bogus moral roadblock.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Pieter,

      Thanks for sharing your thoughts here. I want to clarify that suicide isn’t illegal in the U.S.. If someone attempts suicide and survives, they will not be charged with a crime. (That is, they won’t be charged with a crime if they didn’t commit another crime in the process; I recall some years back that someone attempted suicide by parking their car on train tracks. The train derailed, killing some passengers, and the suicidal person, who survived, was charged in their deaths.)

      I think I articulate in my post my reasons for preventing suicide. Here’s the shortened version: Many suicidal people change their minds and later are glad they didn’t die.

    • Pieter says:

      Stacey,

      Yes, some people whose suicides were prevented felt very happy that they were. They felt elated to have the gift of life back. But is this a sufficient a reason to intervene?

      No.

      All of us are engaged in making irreversible decisions. For some of these decisions, we are likely to pay very dearly. Is this a reason to stop us from making them? Should the state be allowed to prevent a couple from marrying because of genetic incompatibility? Should an overpopulated country institute forced abortions? Should smoking be banned for the higher risk groups? The answers seem to be clear and negative. There is a double moral standard when it comes to suicide. People are permitted to destroy their lives only in certain prescribed ways.

      And if the very notion of suicide is immoral – why stop at individuals? Why not apply the same prohibition to political organizations (such as the Yugoslav Federation or the USSR or East Germany or Czechoslovakia, to mention four recent examples)? To groups of people? To institutions, corporations, funds, not for profit organizations, international organizations and so on?

      This fast deteriorates to the land of absurdities, long inhabited by the opponents of suicide.

    • Tom H says:

      Stacey, again, there’s no way to reply to your reply. I don’t know if that’s intentional, but I feel compelled to point out, respectfully, that your justification for preventing suicides, “Many suicidal people change their minds and later are glad they didn’t die,” is neither a statistically valid argument (there is no comparison between the community who survive and disavow their earlier suicidal ideations and the untold numbers who successfully committed suicide) nor a philosophically valid reason to proscribe free personal choice. Many people who get divorced later regret their choice–as is also true for very many significant life choices (like the choise to drop out of school or give up citizenship in a prosperous nation…). That is the very cornerstone of personal freedom–that we and we alone get to decide about our personal lives.

      Of course, when someone seeks out the help of a psychologist or therapist or priest or minister… that is her or his free choice to seek counsel. It is notable the contrasting case with other patients (the working hypothesis undergirding mental illness of which there is no rigorous cause-effect proof is that these so-called diseases are organic diseases of the brain) who are free to terminate therapy at any time despite (a) experts’ prognoses that doing so will be terminal and (b) it being just as arguably in such patients’ interests to be deprived of the freedom of choice–under similar reasoning (the documented regret of those who forego treatment and later lament their choice). In no other branch of health science, with the exception of the consideration of legal minors, can health practitioners countermand patients’ wishes wholesale, and certainly not for the justification that you offer here.

      Lastly, that the majority of a community feels a certain way, it is consistent with US legal and social policy history as well as social moral philosophy, is no justification for imposing others’ personal life decisions on an individual. Such is the sentiment of the long history of US civil rights law and I’m confident eventually this most definitively personal matter will fall under the same umbrella. We are neither willing nor able to care for very, very many who choose to die. That may be a sad affirmation, but it is true and unless we both want to and can do such things, we shouldn’t even be having this conversation as precious few (if any) of us will be there to comfort those otherwise utterly bereft of comfort.

    • Callidora says:

      I’ve attempted suicide several times since I was a teen. Never once was i happy i didnt succeed. Life just got even worse.

  24. Kelly says:

    I have wanted to die for years now. I have zero quality of life. Only family I have are 3 children who hate me. A nasty x husband who rewards them for hating me. He has money I don’t. I don’t have money for a hobby or to go out. I have 2 friends both live far away. I’m in pain everyday and I want it to stop.

    • Callidora says:

      People die every day from accidents, illness, and stupidity. Why is death so hard to achieve for those who desperately seek it? Yes, i seek an easy, peaceful death, my life is painful enough. I am more afraid of a failed attempt than anything

  25. Carol says:

    I’ve been severely depressed and anxious for over 3 years. I have tried everything, from many different meds to a number of different therapists to residential care to ECT and alternative doctors, neurofeedback. I’ve been hospitalized probably 7 or 8 times. I had a helper for awhile who dragged me around to exercise classes. I’ve tried to continue meditating. I recently had an (unintentional) overdose; I was just trying to stop the pain. Was in a coma for 3 days, hospitalized for almost 2 weeks. For a few days after the hospital things were a tiny bit better then steep downward slide. I’ve lost most of my friends, and recently it’s gotten even harder to keep up any semblance of normal life (I had slight bits and pieces before) or talk to people. Everyone is burned out and wants to live their own lives without taking on my pain. I have a husband with Parkinson’s; that probably was a contributing factor to my falling into this state. Not being alone doesn’t keep me from wanting to die. Before this, I had a history of depression but nothing like this. And for almost 14 years before this crash, I was on an antidepressant that worked like magic and I was happier than I’d ever been. And then it stopped, as often happens. I thought I was through with depression during that 14 years, thought I’d get to have a good life, despite prevoius depression be able to say I’d had a good life. But then entered this horror show. It’s been living hell and I really, really wish there was some surefire, peaceful way to die. I know there isn’t. They say suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. Is 3+ years temporary? If there is a god, he is cruel.

  26. Aricia says:

    The fundamental question that one must ask:

    “Is there anything in life worth doing or experiencing that makes prolonging your existence worthwhile?”

    I think that this question can only be answered on an individual level and CANNOT really be answered in a general or holistic sense. This is because life is a subjective experience, and although one individual may have their reasoning as to why they wish to continue living, another may feel justified in blowing their brains out. Which individual is correct in their reasoning? I would say both are correct from their own perspective. Aside from the mere fact that most people are simply propelled to survive solely through the fear of death, the reasoning for survival is a very subjective matter. No philosophical reasoning can conclude that life is better than death or that death is better than life, especially since you can’t possibly know what is on the other side of death.

  27. Anonymous says:

    im afraid to type, dont ask why, i wont tell you. ok im not here to give anybody any help, ok this complex.but i wont reveal anything to you, i keep everything to myself and shut my mouth from now on due to the danger im in, to you sheeps, and i dont mean this an offending way, its just a slang word, suicide to you is different from suicide to somebody that is not a sheep. im not giving anything away here, but an example is, if you order a dell battery and it arrives, you will know that is not the original dell battery if it doesnt say dell in big logo words,you will just think is the oem original part of the dell battery, but those who dont know what a legit dell battery looks like then you are a sheep, because most batteries dont say dell and look similar, but its not exactly the same cause no dell logo, in fact what you got was a chinese battery instead which are not as good as american dell batteries,will still accept it as the original dell battery. sheeps suicide and i like sheeps dont get me wrong are diferent than somebody that is not a sheep. you all commit suicide cause of depression, cancer or any fatal disease, or loss of job, or breaking up relation with your partner.suicide is not getting you to heaven or hell,i know where it gets me, but im not telling you.so dont commit suicide, everything can always be fixed, better days will always come. me i have always been a happy person, my childhood was great, i got to admit, but since 2015, supernatural things happened to me in this tropical country, it was horrible, i say no more,then when i came back to the country i love the most,which is the USA, i had escaped those haunting months, my mom rescued me.after a while i was going thru some uncomfortable times,almost every month and when im happy everything going well, things that i cant talk about started every month after weeks of feeling like my life is going to be fun and adventurous and have girlfriend,12 months straight bad things happen to me, so now i think suicide, but for me suicide is different because im not depressed and im healthy, but lonely. all this bad things thats happening have considering suicide, by making myself so stressed out, so i will get a stroke. this is the part you wont undertand and i wont reveal much, because i have to keep everything to myself and obey at any costs,no matter what.i dont exist, im not real, im an illusion, trapped in a video game, and what comes next after you die is not that bad, but i am not going to get the normal thing that happens if i die inside the video game im in, or if i die after the video game is over, kind of like a pac man game, put coins in and when pacman is swallowed by the ghosts,game over, well i feel im going to get tortured very bad, its not hell, its different, only for watching videos on the internet, which were there to watch, it wasnt my fault i watch videos,like planets and mythology, well i was scared of what i watched and sad and i stupidly went and posted many of those videos on frou site and now, believe me, my fate is not very good,i didnt know i was doing this and then i knew i should not have posted any mystery videos.so now for that im considered a bad person, from whom, i wont tell you.but think i have to try to stay inside this video game as long as i can,because if try to live the video game, i know there is something bad to happen to me, i will be punished with much pain.last time i post here,.god aint gonna help me, jesus, i dont believe in jesus. doesnt matter, im just a hologram, leave you with a funny star wars quote, princess leia telling obi wan kanobi, youre my only hope, sadly obi wan kanobi wont be there to help me.live long and prosper beautiful humans.

  28. T says:

    I would implore everyone who’s been participating in this discussion to watch this 18-minute documentary, “Letting You Go” about a Belgian man who stood by his 27-year-old daughter in her decision to pursue physician-assisted suicide after struggling with severe mental illness for over a decade.

    https://aeon.co/videos/what-it-s-like-to-stand-by-your-daughter-in-her-choice-to-die

    • Carol says:

      She was able to get physician assisted suicide for mental illness? I thought it was only possible for terminal physical illness

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      In the U.S., physician-assisted suicide is permitted only when a person has a terminal illness and is expected to die within six months. In a few countries, such as Belgium and the Netherlands, people can receive assistance to die for other reasons, too, including mental illness.

      This state of affairs is fraught with moral questions. This article captures the questions well: Europe’s Morality Crisis: Euthanizing the Mentally Ill.

    • Tom H says:

      In order for a legitimate crisis to exist, a phenomenon has to be objectively real, I’d offer. Superman and Lois Lane can’t have a relationship crisis because the characters are fictional, despite readers’/viewers’ suspension of belief regarding the fiction. Historians might argue there were “morality crises” surrounding the emancipation of slaves or women’s suffrage… but I’d argue these controversies represent differences of opinions. And that’s what’s at the root of human euthanasia controversies–differences of opinions. The travesty is that some professional organizations, without empirical evidence to substantiate their opinions as verified biomedical facts, have duped the legal system into believing that one opinion of life value and the corresponding “therapeutic” intervention opinions are hard, objective facts. This means, of course, that differing opinions are taken not only as fallacies (the sorts of things that can be objectively “wrong”), but worse, as indications of objective biomedical illness (neuropathology). This is the cost of elevating opinions to the status of facts–that we can then pathologize those who have different opinions, silence them, and even involuntarily manipulate them–removing their freedoms and forcing what we perceive to be “treatments” on them.

      I don’t want to seem to be nit-picking, but when the stakes are as high as personal freedom then these charged expressions ought to be called out.

    • Brittany says:

      why would you share that that should not be on here :(((( no one should feel like they should kill themselves no matter what reason. We were all made for a special reason. Man this video should be banned.

  29. mic says:

    Stacey, thanks for your interesting post. But speaking as someone who has been suicidal for many years, the idea that people such as me should be forcibly kept alive (or else be left to try risky and painful methods of secretive suicide) deepens my despair. In fact, I would have to say that the current laws that are keeping suicidal people trapped in an unwanted existence is the greatest contributor to my suicidal ideation; more than the personal issues of loneliness and failure stemming from my autistic spectrum disorder. I appreciate that you mean well in wanting to prevent suicide, but denying people their bodily sovereignty and keeping them imprisoned within a life that is burdensome to them (after they never consented to being born in the first place) is akin to slavery in my view.

    I can’t really top J Connor’s excellent comment, which covers all the bases very well. But to reiterate what he/she said, non-existence cannot be harmful and suffering is always harmful. Although in many cases, suicidal people’s lives do turn around eventually; if the individual concerned can provide a reasoned and competent explanation of why they wish to end their life, then it should be their inalienable right to do so as long as nobody else is directly endangered in the process. To echo again a comment of J Connor’s, to prevent people from being able to make this determination on their own is a case of forcibly using the state apparatus to impose one’s own values and beliefs (in this case, it often stems from a religious conviction in the absolute sanctity of life). I would consider that to be a violation of the individual’s freedom of thought and is effectively a violation of freedom of/from religion.

    • Grieving Mother says:

      So, from reading many of the comments I am horrified to know that many people think that suicide is simply a person’s choice. I just lost my 17yr old daughter to suicide and you people are really disturbing in my opinion. She was a senior getting ready to graduate and start her life. But instead I buried her exactly 4 months after her 17th birthday. Her 15 yr old sister found her. Now I have to worry about losing her too. She is in counseling now and praying it works. I will do whatever it takes to save her. I already feel like I failed my oldest daughter and I refuse to fail my 15yr old. Suicide is murder so I don’t understand how anyone can think that letting someone kill themselves is OK. It is repulsive to me knowing so people think it’s OK.

  30. 656E64206974 says:

    “And yet, even with that intention, the moment he jumped off the bridge, he instantly regretted his decision”

    I’ve attempted twice and both times I woke up feeling even more bitter than when I did it.
    So you mileage may vary.

  31. Pechorin says:

    In my experience, there are people who truly ought to end their lives, but they are stopped by all the cowardice credited to suicides. And so they go on, becoming exponentially more miserable by the day, with their sense of valuelessness showing itself in less agreeable forms, recklessness, bad manners, and possibly even trolling. Such individuals cannot end the agony of their existence, so they seek to drag others down with them, and I am not even going to start on those who suffer in silence, only screaming their curse on the human race when and where nobody shall hear them.

    I ponder suicide often, but if I had the nerve to end this wretched life, I probably would have no desire to end it. That nerve would have enabled me to make something of it.

  32. Bill says:

    I hate life. It’s all pain and stress. Then I have assholes like trump that just start shit.. I’m depressed. I’m on meds’ I’m tired of it all. Trying to get the nerves to kill my self. I don’t want to leave my wife
    And dog alone!!! I need help

  33. James says:

    I had a spine injury from a spinal cord stimulator trial about a
    year-and-a-half ago. I lost most of the use of my left leg, bladder function
    and live a life of chronic neuropathic pain 24 hours every day. I can get
    around with a cane but the pain is so bad I find it hard to do anything or go
    places with these issues. Even sitting upright in a chair hurts. I spend most of my time
    laying on our sectional. I’m 56, have a wife and 11 year old son and I know my
    wife has totally had it with my problems. I want to end my life. But I just can’t go on like this, every day and night is such a struggle and I know it makes it
    tougher for the few people close me. You really can’t understand the life of
    chronic pain without living it. It destroys you emotionally and you just don’t
    care about things anymore, even the people you love. You live a dead life and
    can go from rage to tears so easy. I have tried everything possible to lessen
    this pain but nothing works. I keep waiting each day for it to get better but
    it never does. Pain meds help a great deal especially when I have to go
    somewhere, but with the government issues and the crackdown on opiates I had to
    cut back on them and it really hurts. Doctors don’t want to have the feds in
    their business and I can’t blame them. Just another thing to make my days much
    more difficult. I still have some hopes that this pain will ease up but I
    really doubt it will happen and I don’t take that tragic step of ending my
    life. I’m not looking for sympathy or advice, there is little I have not done for my issues. To all out there who suffer like I do I wish you the best.

    [This comment was edited to abide by the Comments Policy. – SF]

    • Puck says:

      I am sorry to hear that you had a bad surgery. The one thing that far too many just do not get and that is the opiates are far safer than most alternatives such as surgery, and over the counter medications when there is chronic pain. I also have chronic pain, and have been using opiates for about a decade now. I had my meds cut and had to find another doctor. After all what far too many just do not get is that opiates can kill, and life is terminal. What is needed is for life to be worth living for people not to kill themselves with opiates or some other method. Have you though about moving to another state, one where you can get medical pot and other herbals. The main reason that makes sense that Kratom and Pot are either illegal or facing being illegal is that there is not enough profit in them for the major drug makers in this country. Also their money is more important to those in government than our lives or the lives of our families.

  34. Terry says:

    I have read this but at no point has anything helped me I think I will always want to die. I have attempted three times . Now it’s almost like I have desensitised my self from it. I know no one will actually give a shit. Every one will move on . Have happy lives and just live normally.
    Every one I have seen that has had death in there lives have always been fine in the end and like its nothing. Except me when my mum died I couldn’t ever move on and still can’t 3-4 years on. Loosing my sister 25 years ago and still can’t move on.

    I have spoken to doctors . Mental health specialists
    Behavioural specialists
    Friend
    Family
    Everything .
    It doesn’t change anything it just makes it worse . Blissful ignorance is the only thing that even comes close to “helping” I say helping sparingly as it’s almost a placebo that I have an extremely high tolerance to. I know that literally makes no sense but that’s the way it is.
    I love people in my life so much but still it’s not enough to change. It’s almost like it amplifies it, I feel like I’m being selfish hanging around because I love them. And I know they will be perfectly fine with out me. Actually will have a better quality of life with out me.
    I don’t even know why I’m writing this

    [This comment was edited to abide by the Comments Policy. – SF]

    • Carol says:

      At least you’re able to feel love. After 3+ years of this agony, I feel so burned out I can’t feel anything like that.

  35. DF says:

    Yes, hope and hopelessness are equally delusional states. The question of their “truthfulness” will always be as unverifiable as the truthfulness of any other deeply held belief. The relevant question to ask of any of our beliefs is: “Does this belief contribute to me living with myself and others in a way that is helpful?”

  36. Anon says:

    Because, even if an individual has been suicidal for 20 plus years, there is and will always be hope. The worst thing I can imagine is someone not surviving long enough to find what life can be, that it will not feel like this forever, and to see the colours in the world. Speaking as someone who has attempted to suicide numerous times to the point of being resuscitated twice. There is always, always, always, always hope, even if you can’t see it or even understand the concept. I would suffer a million times over and over again to see and appreciate life as I do now.

    • Rick says:

      THANKYOU for your encouragement in the deepest, darkest “Hellhole”, soooooooo many of us are currently experiencing in this Sin filled world.. Your “failure” at suicide, just saved many,many, many more struggling soul’s. Thank you. Eternally(I PRAY) grateful.God bless you..

    • J Connor says:

      So you believe you have the right to impose your experience and beliefs onto others? Utterly baffling. I’m not suicidal. I’m a physician who believes in body autonomy which extends to the right-to-die (see Belgium and the Netherlands for case studies in action so I needn’t explain my position). What you’re suggesting is akin to a religious zealot pushing their beliefs and agenda on others. Philosophically speaking, “hope” is an illusion. Reality is what’s left when you’re not trying to escape from your discomfort with hope. As a wise teacher once said, “Hope and fear is a feeling with two sides. As long as there’s one, there’s always the other. This is the root of our pain. In the world of hope and fear, we always have to change the channel, change the temperature, change the music, because something is getting uneasy, something is getting restless, something is beginning to hurt, and we keep looking for alternatives.” So you see, your whole position is grounded in YOUR personal belief system; you could easily replace the word “HOPE” with “GOD” and it wouldn’t be any different.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      J Connor,

      Thanks for contributing to the discussion. You raise good ideas, but there is one confusing point. If hope is an illusion, wouldn’t hopelessness be the same? And if people then kill themselves based on an illusion (per your philosophy), then wouldn’t we have an ethical obligation to intervene, in the same manner that someone who’s delirious with a fever of 106 is protected from himself or herself? I use that extreme example solely for the purpose of an illustrative analogy, based on the logic you use above; in reality, I realize that the situations that suicidal people face are seldom, if ever, so simplistic.

      I appreciate your engagement in the discussion, and it leads me to a greater question that others’ comments have led me to, as well: Why are you against others having or expressing hope?

      In this case, Anon didn’t say we should use force against the suicidal. They simply expressed a belief, in the same way that you did. So, by extension, are you imposing your belief on others merely by expressing it?

      These aren’t intended to be rhetorical questions. I’d like to keep the conversation going. Thank you.

    • J Connor says:

      Stacey, unfortunately, you don’t have a “Reply” link under your comment, so I’m replying again to Anon. To answer your questions:

      You said: “If hope is an illusion, wouldn’t hopelessness be the same? And if people then kill themselves based on an illusion (per your philosophy), then wouldn’t we have an ethical obligation to intervene, in the same manner that someone who’s delirious with a fever of 106 is protected from himself or herself?”

      I’m not sure this analogy works. People don’t kill themselves *because* of hopelessness – hope/hopelessness are merely words we use to describe probabilistic states which exist only in our minds. People hope for all kinds of things. They hope to win the lottery. They hope to meet Prince Charming and live happily ever after. They hope to be rich and famous. More often than not, hope is not grounded in reality – it’s used as a diversion FROM reality. If hope is grounded in reality, it can be a useful cognitive tool. But I rarely see hope applied that way, so I’m talking about the former.

      People kill themselves for a variety of reasons, but I’d like to focus this example on those who are suffering from severe, lifelong mental illness that has not responded to treatment. Those people often kill themselves due to an unbearable pain that they’ve been carrying for years and years (with treatment). Eventually, some of these folks will make a very reasonable and logical assessment that they are likely going to be struggling uphill like that for the rest of their lives. They may decide that they are willing to foreclose on any future good times because an absence of good times isn’t harmful, whereas suffering is always harmful. Some may call this “hopelessness;” the truth is, in some cases, it’s a realistic, pragmatic assessment of a suicidal person’s reality. It doesn’t matter what labels we apply because we’re not the one living that person’s life. Some may believe that under all circumstances, people should have hope (like Anon), even after say, 40 years of battling illness and suffering intensely; never mind their own experience and judgment and choices about how they’d like their life to go, they should just “keep hope alive.” All too often, I see people using other people’s suffering in this way to give meaning and value to their own interpretations of life. That’s simply not appropriate.

      You said: “In this case, Anon didn’t say we should use force against the suicidal. They simply expressed a belief, in the same way that you did. So, by extension, are you imposing your belief on others merely by expressing it?”

      Anon responded to your question, “If Someone’s Life is So Awful that They Want to Die, Why Stop Them?” with, “Because, even if an individual has been suicidal for 20 plus years, there is and will always be hope.”

      I realize you have changed the title of the post after the fact to a softer word, “prevent,” but I’m going with the word “stop,” because that’s what we often do. To “stop” someone is often to use force. And the reason Anon suggested we “stop” someone whose life is so miserable that they wish to die is because….hope. Furthermore, he/she said, “There is always, always, always, always hope, even if you can’t see it or even understand the concept.” You can hope all you want for something which has no probability of happening, but that doesn’t change reality. I could give more clinical and real-life examples than you’d care to read where there IS no hope, there’s just plain’ ol’ reality. Anon’s response suggests to me, that under any and all circumstances one should cling to hope and ignore reality and keep on suffering because “I believe this about life and the world, and you should too, even if you don’t understand it.” It’s laced with dogma. To be clear, I don’t have any issues with Anon’s hopefulness as it’s applied to **their own life.**

      To reiterate – I’m about personal autonomy. If hope works for you, great! I certainly encourage my patients to remain hopeful when, clinically speaking, there is a reasonable justification for it. I have seen many cases where false hope was more than counterproductive for patients facing very real end-of-life situations. Conversely, I had a Buddhist cancer patient last year who rejected the notion of hope and stated she’d prefer to “be with what is.” She was one of the best patients I’ve ever had. No doubt, her meditation practice helped her healing process along. But she never clung to hope as a distraction from what she was experiencing – she never once turned away from it – she went through it fully, bravely, and presently. She prompted me to read up on the Buddhist view on hope (Pema Chodron is the “wise teacher” I quoted in the aforementioned comment).

      My point all along was this: We should be very clear that hope is an aspect of personal belief, and personal beliefs should not be used to impose upon the liberty of others.

      As a caveat, I do believe suicide prevention is necessary under most circumstances, as many people who attempt are in crisis. I also believe there’s a subset of the suicidal population who are left to suffer relentlessly from untreatable illnesses because they’re not “terminal,” and I do not doubt that one day in the future, we’ll look back at ourselves and see our current policies as inhumane.

      Stacey, if you’re interested, I would suggest watching this Yale Philosophy course on the rationality of suicide. It’s only a few parts long, and it’s an undergrad course, but I have yet to find any material which better illustrates my line of thinking on this topic. Thank you for keeping this conversation going! It’s obviously an important one. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MajfZIyHP8U

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      J Connor,

      Thanks for your thoughtful and well-reasoned reply to my comment. (And yes, it’s unfortunate that these are all nested under Anon’s comment, since you and I have moved into a different conversation between ourselves.)

      I appreciate the points you raise. I think for me, as someone involved in suicide prevention, the terrible challenge I face is not knowing who is on the other end of the screen. By that I mean, when someone leaves a comment disparaging hope, the words can be validating in a soothing way to someone whose situation has not improved after many years of fruitless efforts to get better. On the other hand, the words might be validating to someone for whom validation is damaging – the person whose hopelessness arises from cognitive distortions, for example, and for whom some hope is not only warranted but potentially healing. Yet many people in the second camp think they belong in the first (and many in the first wish they belonged in the second). And, in keeping with a fundamental disagreement that you and I appear to have, I think it’s rarely possible to know that there is no hope. Life surprises us all. Is that reason enough to stay alive? That might be a more apt question than whether hope does or does not exist in a particular situation.

      I will try to watch the Yale course you referenced. As I wrote in another comment today, I do see the merit of some arguments for not intervening when someone is suicidal. In particular, I believe that more people would get help – and be more honest when they do – if they didn’t have to worry about being committed to a hospital against their will. Susan Stefan writes meaningfully about these issues in her book Rational Suicide, Irrational Laws: Examining Current Approaches to Suicide in Policy and Law, which is a book that might interest you if you haven’t read it already.

      And yes, I agree, this is an important conversation, and one we will see more and more in the years to come, I suspect.

  37. Myrna says:

    I have major depressive disorder and PTSD. I have a very loving husband of 51 years. I have a child who lives with us who also has PTSD & MDD. I see no reason to live any longer when my husband passes; he is terminal. My husband saved me from an abusive situation when I was a teenager, & had tried suicide at ages 14 & 16. My son’s problems are personal & tragic. I see no reason to go on living with my husband gone. He is the ONLY PERSON WHO HAS EVER LOVED ME UNCONDITIONALLY. So I ask you, what is the point??? I am on meds, plus I’ve had 5 years of therapy. I don’t think my wonderful daughter, & 5 mostly grown grandchildren are enough to keep me going.

    • Constantine says:

      To Aiah Zohar: I want to thank you for your grounded perspective, your rationality, and your intelligence – you have made some incredible contributions to this discussion (I’ve been following for months). It’s a shame that mental health professionals like Stacey can’t lead a rational debate on this topic. Instead, they’re stuck in an immature way of looking at suicide through a purely emotional lens and they only know how to project their personal beliefs and perspectives about life and the world onto others. “Just have some hope and check the resources page!”

      I understand that you’re a physician – I wish that at some point when the debate does eventually make its way into the public forum, people like you — and many others in the medical and philosophical fields — will come forward and enter the debate. My father is a surgeon and he shares your viewpoints, as do many of his colleagues. We need people who are able to discern the difference between reason and emotions to drive this conversation and really dissect the issue. I am not depressed, but I have a chronic, degenerative disease for which I would not qualify for assisted euthanasia in the US and I will, therefore, have to take my own life with potentially unreliable means when it progresses to the point of no return. Or I’ll have to go to Switzerland for assistance, which is expensive. It’s ABSOLUTELY hideous that people like me are expected to suffer in order to keep the false cocoon of “hope” and comfort in tact for everyone else. The same is true of those suffering from lifelong, treatment-resistant, intractable mental illness for which “hope” and “Resource Pages” are utterly useless and insulting. I believe one day in the future, we’ll look back on ourselves at this period of time and see ourselves as barbaric for allowing this level of human suffering to go on for selfish reasons.

    • Anonymous says:

      You passed on your mental health issues to your children- I think you owe it to them to stick around, and I hope you do.

  38. YeahRight says:

    As long as a person is alive, things can change for the better. Situations change. Even if their external situation is unchangeable, they may discover things that make their life worth living. There is always the possibility that they may find ways to cope. Or they may come to appreciate different things in life.

    I’m sorry. But I have been feeling like shit for over 10 years now. I have been waiting for things to get better. I have actively fought for things to get better. You’re telling me to live in misery for another 10 years so things maybe will get better? No. For some people they won’t and you can’t expect people to feel like shit for 80 years so maybe they have two more okay years. People didn’t ask to be born and they should have every right to die.

  39. Jd says:

    Im ugly been alone almost 26 years. Im in pain and i will never be happy so why go on living. Im tired of being alone and want to die.

  40. Ebony says:

    I’m suicidally depressed and have been for the past ten years but I refuse to give up hope. Even though life is difficult and things dont always go the way id like them to I will continue fighting. I mean we all die in the end anyway so why bother rushing things? May as well enjoy life to the best of my abilities. I refuse to end my life because I know that even though things seem hopeless theres always hope and that I will overcome. And I hope that all of you do too.

    • Aiah Zohar says:

      It’s absolutely terrific that you are hopeful. Life without hope can be bleak. I hope you won’t take my observation as an affront, but it’s quite demonstrable that there are many, many circumstances without hope. While it is theoretically true that “anything” is possible, and therefore one could argue there is always hope, given the span of human life, some events’ low probability of occurrence practically dismisses “hope.” Early in the treatment of some diseases, for instance, hope can be helpful in motivating patients to persevere through difficult interventions that significantly improve survival rates. However, other disease states have low survival rates, and research shows that faith or hope do not statistically alter patients’ survival rates for such diseases. In fact, at some point in the trajectory of disease, “hope” can be counterproductive, disincentivizing families and patients from making hard but necessary decisions. So not only are there legitimately hopeless situations, and not only can it be objectively demonstrated that hope does not alter outcomes, but hope itself seems to be a proxy for situations with sufficiently high chance of a favorable outcome.

      I’m not trying to be argumentative or a downer. But in a discussion about legal rights and personal freedoms concerning already culturally biased phenomena (like gender identity or marriage rights…), I think it’s extremely important to be as precise as possible about the mechanics of the phenomenon under consideration. While some people for a host of reasons have hope where their currently unsatisfactory lives are concerned (that is, there is a reasonable probability of their attaining satisfaction), that is mathematically not the case for others. The fallacy of the psychological model is its assumption that the ignorance of those in the present about the future necessarily means that future events are “open.” For many reasons, this assumption is false but persists simply because we don’t yet understand enough the core causes and effects.

      Bottom line: it’s terrific that someone is hopeful, so long as that emotional state is not then used as an expectation of the way others must feel about their own lives, or as a presumed model of the way the world actually works.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Aiah,

      I considered not publishing your comment, because it doesn’t seem to actually relate to Ebony’s comment. Ebony said that she experiences depression and suicidal thoughts, but that hope keeps her alive. And as you yourself note, it’s “absolutely terrific” that she feels hopeful. I agree with her reasoning, and I’m grateful that she and many others like her do feel hope. Hope is an antidote to suicidality.

      I also think you misunderstood Aiah’s comment. She’s not making a statement about “legal rights and personal freedoms concerning already culturally biased phenomena (like gender identity or marriage rights…),” as you imply in your comment. She’s making a statement about her own personal experience, and she’s saying that she hopes that others experience similar hope. I don’t know Ebony beyond the words she posted here, but her comment suggests she has a generous and compassionate spirit.

      It seems to me that your comment about hopelessness pertains more to situations of people with terminal illness, for whom there is no recognizable hope for recovery. I’d like to point out that research shows that most people with incurable terminal illness do not want to end their lives prematurely via suicide or other forms of hastened death. Isn’t that interesting?

      Ultimately, I decided to publish your comment, because I think it can stimulate important discussion and thought. I’m particularly interested in this statement by you: “The fallacy of the psychological model is its assumption that the ignorance of those in the present about the future necessarily means that future events are ‘open.'” Is there a reason why you would assume that ignorance of those in the present about the future necessarily means that future events are *not* open?

      I ask genuinely out of curiosity, not to be argumentative. I appreciate your contributing to the discussion, and I’d like to be sure I understand. Thank you.

    • Aiah Zohar says:

      Stacey, first, pardon me for replying to Ebony’s comment, but I saw no “reply” field under your comment to reply to it. I appreciate that it is not your intent to be argumentative; nor is it mine. First, I do not believe I took exception with the way Ebony herself feels about her own life experiences. And I sincerely congratulated her for feeling good about her circumstances.

      However, I did take exception to the assertion, “there’s always hope.” That is patently false. What humans call “hope” is our desire for events to transpire a certain way. There is no rigorously demonstrable reason that what we hope must come to pass, and considerable evidence that hope does not alter outcomes. Very many hopes do not come to fruition. But statistically, even if the probabilities of hope-odds were closely matched, this would be what a researcher would call poor predictive power. There would be little justification in believing “I hope X” presages the eventual passage of event-X. You can argue that hoping for something motivates behavior that may alter the odds of realizing what’s hoped for, but then hope is arguably not the causal factor, but a confounding factor for intent. And even then, what is intended–motivating someone to act–must be possible and doesn’t guarantee success. Curiously, intent and hope can be disjoint and yet lead to unhoped for outcomes in the favor of intent (what is intended predicts what happens rather than what is hoped for, assuming the event is actually possible).

      I do not agree that my argument is limited to patients with terminal cases. This is merely a natural consequence of probability. Obviously, if medicine predicts a certain physiological state is terminal, hoping otherwise is eventually recognizable as unreasonable. But the assumption that what is hoped for is reasonable when the means available to us to assess probable outcomes are crude is an argument of present ignorance, not cause-effect. The same patient who was counseled to be hopeful earlier, and was, is the same patient who today is labeled “terminal.” All that has changed is our ability to “see” the disease trajectory better, not the effect of hope on the disease process.

      I did not misunderstand Ebony’s comment. You are right that she is not addressing legal rights at all, but because her feelings and perspectives enjoy, as you have yourself here demonstrated, professional approval as “appropriate,” despite the lack of rigorous empirical substantiation (not of simple associations), they have come to occupy the legal and medical position of “correct,” and therefore alternative views and perspectives are not merely discouraged (which runs counter to the democratic process which relies on open information and discussion), but also carry punitive costs. So, yes, this kind of discussion that impinges on all citizens’ legal rights is critical, especially in the context that your own reply imposes. While it’s terrific that some people are hopeful, and while I agree with you that hope predicts the desire to continue living, it’s an affront to liberty that these perspectives should become national policy circumscribing others’ personal freedoms.

      You asked why I would “assume that ignorance of those in the present about the future necessarily means that future events are not open.” First, I only claimed that not knowing the future does not mean that all possibilities in the future are practically possible. That is a demonstrable fact, and it is also an assertion that ought to be addressed on its own merits without the distraction of another question. The assertion is also a natural limit on the rationality of hope. Unless my claim is proven false, “there’s always hope” is simply false.

      The question you ask, however, assuming the additional qualifier “some” (future events), is a logical complement to the claim I made. If multiple events are mutually exclusive, eventually some events become improbable (“opportunity cost”). Further, natural probability distributions are rarely equal. Someone may argue that one may be content with many of the possible outcomes such that it is not a problem that some are no longer possible, but there’s no natural reason that must be true for everyone. Moreover, it will still be false that hoping for something must make it come true.

      That I’m aware of, the encouragment of hope is not rigorously empirically evidenced as therapeutically effective. I’ve spent many years searching for the quantitative and physical evidence but haven’t come upon it. I’m open to reading research publications our team may have missed. As I see it, hope is not an intervention, but instead, a response to circumstances.

      Stacey, you point out that most terminal patients want to continue living. My clinical and research experiences corroborate that claim. Pardon me, but I don’t see how that alters the argument. I have never argued that anyone ought to be forced to accept a particular perspective, but rather that patients should enjoy autonomy to consider the myriad aspects of their lives external professionals simply never can and to make personal decisions that may differ greatly from the decisions their support professionals might make for themselves. This discussion now transpiring globally is critical because it concerns one of the most crucial personal liberties. And more and more nations around the world, and more and more US citizens are deciding in favor of personal liberty.

      Lastly, thank you for deciding to publish my earlier comment to Ebony. Again, it wasn’t meant to be mean-spirited, but rather generative. That said, it frankly frightens me, as a free citizen and a medical scientist and a physician, that some ideas that concern policy that purports to be based in science and to which all citizens are subject should be publically censorable simply because others find the ideas themselves offensive or disagree with the perspectives entailed. Sorry for the long reply.

    • Diego says:

      to Aiah Zohar,

      I want just to say that with your last comment (very, very well articulated) you really hit the mark from a rational, realistic, empirical, scientific point of view. To me (and maybe to other rationally oriented people) reality, even if sad, is always better than delusional wishful thinking, because in the end reality always wins.

      I didn’t like Stacey article but after reading her responses to some of the most deep and articulated comments and after reading, in “Why I Came Out of the (Suicide) Closet”, the fear of stigma from opinionated colleagues that she faced, I have much more respect of her opinions.
      I understand the difficult situation she faces as a therapist counseling suicidal people.

      In one of the comments I was referring to she writes “Many of the comments on this site have challenged my ideas and caused me to stretch my thinking.”; I want to be provocative and suggest that your comment should be one of them, maybe the best one, in my humble opinion.
      I’m disappointed she didn’t respond with a rational, realistic, empirical and scientific observation on par with yours… but maybe she can’t because the phrase “there is always hope” is theoretically and empirically false and “it will still be false that hoping for something must make it come true”. Sadly, she can’t change it…

  41. Lost Man says:

    I think it is high-minded crap to be interfering with the choices of others. This argument that the crisis is often or usually temporary smacks of arrogance. No one else knows what a person is actually going through. You may be able to relate, but you do not KNOW what is going on. For those with lifetime diseases, the continued torture of living with that disease can be just that, TORTURE! Sure, there MAY be treatments to help manage the disease, but all to often there is no CURE! As a man with bipolar disorder, I know this will haunt me for the rest of my life. I also know that I am running out of treatment options, so why shouldn’t I be able to make a choice if I want to live this way or not!

  42. m.m.mokhtar says:

    in my opinion by now there is no right to prevent sucide , let any person decide for his self every body knows about himself better then any body else , no body is kind to himself more than one self

  43. Lily says:

    And what if I am such a fuck-up who did poorly in school, has no realistic nor affordable access to quality college, strongly resents employer demand for degrees that are expensive and unnessesary, fucks up on what few jobs are available to me and thus burns bridges and gets bad references that affect future employment, can’t keep/get anything gainful, is transgender and desperately wants gender reassignment but cant seem to access doctors for it, is looking at losing any real healthcare access due the clowns in Government, is still stuck living at home with limited time before being cast to the street, all the while being months away from age 30… An age I had expected to be independant. I don’t have time in terms of support to fix anything, late blooming to this degree looks awful on a resume, my references suck (and that’s irreversable), and I literally cannot realistically foresee any betterment in my near future. I can fantasize about it, but it would seem I simply wasn’t born to move the world. I am naturally a rude diva-type bitch without meaning to be and Im usually oblivious to the fact until it becomes a professional faux pas that gets me fired. I will end up a leech on society with no means to climb out. I will not have a beautiful lube of the story i crave and dream about… No ultra-modern luxe place, no total overhaul off my car, no glamourous and gainful job with plenty of work/life balance while young enough to really enjoy it. I had potential once and it was squandered. I have no good future, just a shityy, tumultuous one that will never give me joy. Tell me why i should keep going on. Why would you dare think this is temporary and resolvable? It will take more work and time than I can give and cost money I can never have without massive, crippling debt. Imagine yourself in my shoes. Will you not want to end the suffering, too?

    • Anonymous says:

      Sounds to me like you need a mentor more than anything else. Help you get your priorities straight. Having conflicting values can screw your life up royally but can also be corrected in a short time. And the evidence of it working can come almost immediately. Improving one self can be a goal to enjoy working on for a lifetime.

    • Liz says:

      I’m the same as you. I’m 34 and have screwed up my past so royally that I don’t even know what to do about it. Some of it wasn’t even my fault–years of illness, being robbed, depression, lawsuits against me. My family abandoned me during this hard time, and my father died. But a lot of it was simply me mismanaging my life, moving to other countries, and otherwise being a dumb fuck.

      The future leaves me no hope–I won’t go into the details, but there is no biological basis to assume anything will ever improve at this point. I have a shitty personality, like you said, “rude diva-type bitch”. I can’t make friends, I can’t make romantic partnerships, I can’t even get anyone to have sex with me. I’ll never get what I really wanted in life either. No chance. Add to that the overall decline of my country…sigh.

      What pisses me off about this suicide prevention stuff. is that it’s all geared toward teenagers. What about middle-aged folks who have had nothing but a string of bad luck and agony and who have limited chance of ever recouping these losses? Am I seriously supposed to look at my life and somehow be grateful for it? It seems like such a load of crock to me! Maybe OTHER people get happiness, but I’m clearly not one of them. I’ve no desire to continue here. THIS IS BULLSHIT.

      Well, idk if that’s relateable to you, but that’s how I feel anyway. I thought I could recognize the thought processes you’re undergoing…I go through them every single day anymore.

    • John says:

      @Liz @Lily
      I am in a similar situation as the two of you, a 28 year old man who never quite fit into what the “norm” is perceived to be and has run into terrible circumstances too. From the death of my loving mother when 17 to never forming a true loving relationship with a woman who cares about me. Life is anything but enjoyable or easy.

      Yes, each day is incredibly hard to to persevere through, knowing that a lot of what I do is seemingly in vain despite the best efforts I take to better myself; I have studied for nearly 6.5 years through graduate school from engineering to education, to have a career where I could make a difference in peoples’ lives, I was never given the opportunity to teach… Now, I am unemployed, spending a lot of time contemplating life, observing others pass me by and spending as little as possible while taking many hikes in nature.

      Like the Anonymous poster said, a mentor is the best answer to your dire struggle. This mentor, if you don’t have family or friends, could be a counselor; there are wonderful people who will help you, many counselors would be willing to waive fees at times and point you to places that are free to live/get help if you are in dire need; there are more good people out there than it may seem, it’s just the monsters are the most vocal.

      Your lives do matter, even if you have walked directly through Hell throughout your lives; even though I don’t know you, I can feel your pain when reading your words, I care about your well being, even if I am a stranger posting on this forum.

      Please carry on, meet a compassionate mentor and find peace; I fight my demons each day, struggling, but I think I’ll win, somehow.

  44. muzodor says:

    How do you find hope ?
    I am a mother of 7 and grandma to 20 . I was raised by a sexual abuser who beat us and our mom .we would run away from him in the woods because he would be chasing us with his 308 riffle .
    He would face a freight truck they would be pulling on there horn and tell us tonight you are all gone die .dad would go back to his side of the road just in the nick of time .
    I was sexualy assaulted by other men …friends of the family news paper boy ect ..I was kicked out of the house because the dog shit in his room I didn’t even know . I went to live with my boyfriend now husband and raised my own family with no drugs alcohol or violence aloud in our house . Then 13 years latter my dad sexualy assaulted my 11 year old daughter ..THAT KILLED ME INSIDE. Life would never be the same . While I was I’ll with severe depression and ptsd after bringing dad to court he got only 3 months did only 1 1/2 I went to a woman’s shelter because my husband was sexualy abusing me at that time .after 35 years we are still together .while another of my girls was assaulted by a neighbor within the next 2 years another girl by a coworker and my eldest daughter found her boyfriend dead in her car from suicide . I was hospitalized over and over again with attempted suicide and self mutilation .finally I tried to get out of this depression wich took me 7 years I became a work ahoolic built up my own buisness with my passion that is poodles .had a gromming salon boarding facility and breeding ..have donated many dogs to service .guide dogs.therapie dogs and autistic children’s . For all those years of fighting to make something of my life I ended up in a wheelchair with a broken vertabrea chronic pain
    Chronic depression and ptsd also many suicide attemps ..I am now 52 have had years of therapie . I still can answer the door or the phone am afraid of anything and everything
    My evaluation is it is not worth living .. Life is to hard . That was just a glimpse of what life was for me . Suicidal thoughts a daily thing for me .. it’s hurting the ones I love that is the hard part ..

  45. She's alive says:

    I love life and have a lot to live for. I have been through a lot, including a long-term stay in a psychiatric intensive care unit.
    I have been suicidal many times and have attempted suicide before. Every time, after, I am ashamed and bewildered.
    See, my mental health is what causes it. Issues with medication causes it but I Don’ Want To Die.
    I don’t speak for everyone but, these are the reasons I am grateful for suicide prevention. And for everyone commenting that you should have a right to it, if someone really wants to, there is no stopping it.

    • Jo says:

      I’ve been suffering from depression and C-PTSD since I was a child, for over 30 years (along with a host of co-morbid disorders like anxiety and body dysmorphia). I also have fibromyalgia. I’ve been fighting my illnesses full-on, with everything I’ve got for over 16 years. I’ve spent tens of thousands of dollars on just trying to feel *okay.* I’ve tried every relevant therapeutic approach – CBT, DBT, talk therapy, Jungian analysis, somatic therapy, trauma therapy, you name it. I’ve been to clinical psychologists, social workers, counselors, psychiatrists, shaman, ayurvedic doctors, doctors of Chinese Medicine, family physicians, “energy healers” and even psychics (hey, we get desperate) – I’ve been to every type of mental health/helping professional there is. I’ve tried 12 different medications, all of them made me worse off. I’ve done EMDR, TMS, and ketamine infusions (decided against ECT). I’ve done too many alternative/complementary therapies to count. I live a clean, healthy lifestyle. I exercise. I have practiced yoga and meditation for 15 years. I’ve done voluntary inpatient treatment. Intensive outpatient treatment. I’ve traveled. I volunteer. I’ve had good jobs. I have supportive friends. I’ve gone through all of the “resources” medicine and society have to offer. Many of them have provided temporary relief. I’ve had brief periods of remission, but still, I’m plagued by a gnawing, burning agony that has been eating at my being for my whole life, in addition to severe chronic physical pain. My personality has been slowly eroded by mental illness. I’ve lost my life to an endless cycle of desperately trying to get better – my entire life has been focused on that one goal. I wouldn’t wish this on anyone. The brief periods of relative remission HAVE NOT in any way compensated for the 35 years of overall suffering. I will not live another 40+ years just for the possibility of a few months here and there where I’m not miserable. I’ve been seriously suicidal multiple times over the course of my life, but I’ve had the fortitude to deal with the impulses — not because any external “resources” were effective in helping me — but because I’m RATIONAL and I knew I hadn’t yet exhausted my options. I know the mental health profession likes to perpetuate the myth that mentally ill people are irrational.

      At this point, I’ve not only exhausted my options, but I AM exhausted. On every level, to my core. Do you have any idea how insanely tiring it is to have to spin plates all the time just to be barely functional? If I stop doing even one of the several things I have to do just to keep myself “functional,” I’ll quickly spiral down to the point I cannot get out of bed. It’s a full-time job that pays nothing – I’m not living, I’m existing. If you cannot speak from personal experience about what that feels like, you have no business spewing platitudes.

      Aside from the exhaustion, I have no money left. Let’s be real clear here: the “resources” available to those without money are a joke, and I can say that because I’ve seen it from both sides. You should be aware of this problem Stacey since your services are for upper middle-class folks. I’m not calling you out – you charge the market rate, and you’ve worked hard to get where you are. But let’s not be disingenuous about what’s available to those who can’t afford $150/hour 2-4 times per month. Community mental health clinics try to fill in the gap, but they are overburdened, and their services are “one-size-fits-all.” It often takes a couple months to get any kind of treatment. Crisis services may be helpful for people in crisis, but what about the people just trying to survive day-to-day? Well, for those people, if they have money, they have a lot of options. If not, they’re relegated to cookie cutter group therapy, or to students of counseling programs who work for discounted rates, both of which are insulting and demoralizing to anyone who has been dealing with mental illness for a long period of time, and even more so for those who are educated about mental illness and psychology in general.

      The bottom line is this: no one deserves a life of interminable suffering just so others can keep living in a cocoon of hope, where they don’t have to admit to themselves that sometimes, things DON’T get better, in spite of long-term dedicated effort and expert treatment. A lot of this comes down to people’s discomfort with their own mortality and questions about the meaning, purpose, and value of life. I don’t deserve to suffer for 40+ more years so others don’t have to contend with existential questions they’d prefer to avoid. I’ve done my part. I’ve tried everything, in EARNEST. And I will end my life on my terms. I have what I need to ensure a swift and peaceful end, and I’ve had it for over six months. I have no immediate intentions of using it, but when I am ready, I’ll go to sleep and never wake up. Sadly, most people in my shoes have to resort to gruesome, potentially painful methods that may not work and may leave them in a worse position. That’s society’s fault. I’m not in any way saying that people in crisis shouldn’t be helped. I’m not saying that treatment is useless. It’s not, and I encourage everyone to pursue it long-term and try different modalities. But there are plenty of people out there who have tried everything and still suffer from poor quality of life. People who suffer silently day in and day out from an extraordinary invisible pain. For those people, once they’ve given heavy and careful consideration to the decision to end their life, they shouldn’t be forced to do it in alone and in secret, in gruesome and painful ways. Their families don’t deserve the extra trauma of their loved one suffering a violent and painful death. They don’t deserve the shock of it coming out of left field. In a compassionate, humane society (see: Belgium, the Netherlands, and Switzerland), their families would have the time to mentally prepare, and be with them as they pass peacefully and swiftly.

      Until I’m 100% ready, I’ll keep going to therapy, and I’ll keep doing all of the “right things” I’ve been doing for the past 16 years of my life. But now, I have the comfort of knowing I have a way out. This brings me more peace than any treatment or therapy ever has. Do I like that things have come to this? No. But, I have reached a place of acceptance. I’ve had open and frank discussions with my family and friends about my decision. It hasn’t been easy for them to come to terms with, but they know first hand how much I’ve suffered and how hard I’ve tried. Most (not all) of them support me in my decision because they know it’s a rational one, and most of all, because they LOVE me and don’t want me to suffer endlessly just to forestall their inevitable experience of death. Even though I will still have to do it alone and in secret, at least this way, they will have the comfort of knowing I’ve passed peacefully and swiftly, that I’m no longer suffering, and it won’t be a complete shock. They won’t have to deal with anything afterward, as I’ll have taken care of everything in advance.

      The conversation about rational suicide and body autonomy is gaining momentum as more and more people start to approach it with compassion, reason, and logic rather than fear, knee-jerk emotions, and personal ideologies. At the end of the day, the only person who can determine the value of life is the person living that life. No one else has that right.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Jo,

      It’s awful that you’ve suffered so much, and I can understand your exhaustion. I’m sorry that you’ve had to go through so much pain and illness, and that treatments have not helped.

      You capture very eloquently the core arguments about why suicide should be permitted without intervention from others. I find merit in many of these arguments. What I struggle most with is where to draw the line.

      I don’t think people who work in suicide prevention does so to avoid existential issues, as you state above. I think for many people, myself included, the motivation is helping a person through a feeling or crisis that almost always (though not always, I realize) ends up being temporary. We have witnessed people who were resolved to die and then later, with help or the passage of time, grateful to be alive still.

      I hope that you are able to get to a better place without dying. But I also recognize that it is your right to make the choice to die, and to do it. Suicide is legal. Professionals intervene only when professionals know a person is in imminent danger of suicide.

      You stated, “I’m not living, I’m existing. If you cannot speak from personal experience about what that feels like, you have no business spewing platitudes.” I question whether my having been there confers credibility, but in case it does, I hope you will read about a piece of my experience here: A Suicide Therapist’s Secret Past.

      Again, I’m hoping that you find some measure of hope and healing, even if such hope seems unwarranted to you. Thank you for sharing your story here. I think it will help others to read it.

  46. Brittany Odle says:

    I am here for you <333 you can email jesuscaresforyou777@yahoo.com nothings worth killing yourself you matter <3333333 I care for you.

  47. Brittany Odle says:

    Remember you matter. There is Nothing in this world that is worth taking your precious life: death, being in debt, getting hurt, losing someone, its not worth it, its all temporary amd you will get through it. Its a phase. I will care if you die :(((((( please Just loveeee yourself and love others. ♡♡♡ forgive yourself and do something for someone. Email me jesuscaresforyou777@yahoo.com because you matter and I care for you. I am here to listen to you, i am here to cry with you. I have empathy for you i tried to kill myself many times but praying helped me. I am here to pray for you. YOU MATTER!!!! ♡♡♡♡♡♡

  48. Jude says:

    Linda I feel the same. Always here to talk

  49. Cole says:

    Put it this way– People who believe in abortion say a woman has the right to do what she wants with her own body..

    I say– DON’T WE ALL HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO WHAT WE WANT WITH OUR OWN BODY?

    If I want to end my life, that’s MY CHOICE & my own body.

    • Stephen says:

      I think suicide is terribly misunderstood. If I could simply fall asleep and never wake up again, I’d choose that in a heart beat.

      My life isn’t bad. I have problems but they’re not all that terrible. I simply don’t enjoy living and I don’t think that that’s crazy or even mildly out of whack.

      I don’t like life. There I said it. When I look back, even to my early childhood, I can never remember looking forward…to anything. Nothing interests me on any kind of profound level. I find life to be boring and bland at best, extremely tedious and painful at worst.

      That said, why should I be forced to participate in something that I don’t enjoy or desire? All of life’s pleasures disgust me. I hate the sound of people eating, it makes me sick. I hate the notion of sex, let alone the act. It’s …disgusting. I frequently feel that I simply can’t be the only person who feels this way.

      I’m not depressed. Depression takes a degree of passion. Depression speaks of some level of disappointment. I don’t feel that way. I have in the past, but that’s not what this is. What I feel now is a complete inability to muster up the energy to care to relate. Books put me to sleep, quickly. Movies, especially modern ones, are unwatchable and stupid. Music has become a chore to listen to. I’ve just outgrown it. Food is annoying. I eat very well, but the act of getting food and then having to eat it is just a chore. I don’t wish to die because of any intense self loathing, or hatred of mankind or anything like that.

      I simply wish that either the death that awaits me would show up very quickly, or that I be afforded to walk out on this boring movie of a life that nobody would ever…EVER watch.

      And I’m fine with that. Since I was very young I can remember, clearly, wishing that I could just fall asleep and not have to be bothered to awaken.

      Is that really so much to ask?

    • Anonymous says:

      Stephen! Exactly my thoughts. I haven’t seen anyone think like this except me and now you. I also wish I could sleep and just not wake up. I had some problems but that’s not the cause for this thinking.

    • Anonymous says:

      stephan is right , he says it all, stop the world and let who wants to get off get off.

    • Tom H says:

      I love the posts that argue that suicidal adults should, like women who decide to abort the child they’re carrying under the understanding that the women are in control of their own bodies, be free to get off the ride of life whenever they choose (to borrow another commenter’s expression). It is the absolute height of arrogance and absurdity that anyone–professional psychologists above them all–should presume to decide that people aren’t fit to make this particular decision, and worse, to manipulate the law to imprison people in mental “institutions” where our rights are removed, we can be restrained against our will, and have drugs and other “treatments” forced on us. It is an absolute horror that this is even still possible.

      I read recently about ill veterans and terminal elders whose homes the government snatched for the crime of tardy property taxes of less than $100 on homes these individuals had paid off decades ago. While the veterans and elders were languishing in hospitals, many dying, the titles had been sold to private companies that then, with state blessings, took the property and kicked the ex-owners out. Who’ll take care of those people? I use that as one out of a million examples of the actual hell life can be. But psychologists would have us believe every problem is surmountable and that there is a “right” way to respond–to homelessness, to utter abandonment, to chronic debilitating pain, to incessant bullying, to police and state power corruption and brutality, to unfeeling and unjust legal and court systems, to the depredations of neighbors and friends and family, to mushrooming competition for housing and jobs and schooling and even the social companionship we all need, to corporations’ destruction of the ecosystem we all have to rely on for survival simply because those corporations are rich and control governments, to the unaffordability of access to the legal system to protect our rights in a country (USA) that touts empty claims of guaranteed constitutional rights, to rape and murder and a myriad other crimes no psychologist can prevent or guarantee we can overcome. Like religion, psychology doesn’t put food on the table or guarantee our so-called rights will be upheld.

      Life is challenging for everyone. But for some, it’s just one horror after another–and the interventions of psychiatry or psychology CANNOT guarantee relief. Nor should anyone HAVE to think a certain way just because modern psychology believes that way is “normal.” Yes, some people have reason to be depressed and negative. Some people have reason not to want to be here. Oh, and let’s not forget that while psychology and its political pundits enforce their transcendentalists beliefs about what is right and good regarding other people’s lives (there are no objective reasons any of their evaluations about life value must be true–not a single reason since science and empiricism are not evaluative–human minds form individually and culturally biased evaluations), many of these other people have to deal with financial destitution and unemployability because they can’t hold down jobs but aren’t eligible for any kind of “aid.” So who will take care of them when they can’t work and have no source of income in a world in which EVERYTHING is owned and has to be bought? But psychology forces them to stay alive?

      The greatest presumption I’ve ever come across is anyone else, especially a professional body, telling other legal adults how to feel about and what to do with the private lives those others aren’t living. If this worked, suicide rates would have plummetted across the world. The opposite is true.

      And I mean no insult to this article’s author, but there simply is no excuse, not a single valid one, for deliberating about the denial of rights others should have to make decisions about the only thing that we all have an ownership claim to–whether poor or rich: our own bodies. Unless at birth we are all the property of the State, it should be irrelevant what this article’s author or anyone else thinks regarding a legal adult’s decision to stay alive or end her/his own life.

      Sorry for the long comment.

    • Paul says:

      Tom H, I agree with you completely. Also add to it the fact that we have student loans in this country, and are forced to pay them back at the expense of our future, the health and well being of ourselves and our families. The problem comes down to fair and just. Those just do not exist in the world today sadly. If people are going to have to pay something they should have the right to be able to have the income to pay for it, or a waiver that excludes those that have to cut what most would deem necessary in life. People should not need lawyers to show that they are too poor and do not have enough income to pay bills. I hear all this worry about foreign terrorists. However they are not threatening me with fines, shutting off power and water to me and my family. They are not the ones that look the other way when my ex boss broke my face at work just because he felt like it. This is a sick world, and we need more concern about people here at home, the majority of people in this world. Besides from all that I have read the only reason that many groups including north korea are a threat to us is because we are getting into their internal affairs. We have many that work here to make life difficult for the masses, then when those same people get in the face of other countries and try to do the same to them and their people they call them terrorists because they are not willing to put up with it.

  50. Jeff H says:

    What do you do with someone who has gone past the point of no return and their only reason for not doing it just yet is that they are waiting for their parents to die first so they do not feel the guilt of the sons suicide. I think this person is beyond help as he has hated his life and wanted to die for as long as I’ve known him.

  51. Matthew says:

    I can relate to a lot of what’s been said here. I’m 43 and a writer. That probably says it all. I’m broke, alone and a total failure who’s addicted to the craft of creative writing and delusional to think I’ll ever succeed at it. When, in reality, I’m an untalented loser who loathes his existence.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Matthew,

      It’s painful to witness, even in these few words, your hatred for yourself. I have no doubt that your own pain is profound. Have you tried to get help? You don’t have to be alone with this these painful feelings.

      You can talk to your physician, or to a therapist, or to a religious leader if you’re religious, and so on. If you want to get help anonymously and for free, check out the Resources page for places you can do so by phone, text, email, or online chat.

    • Someone Somewhere says:

      I have huge dreams (I’m no writer but my dreams are artistic too. I’ve been crushed and downed and mocked and humiliated by others for having them so much that I hesitate to even tell anyone what they are) and man can I ever relate to this post. I share the same sentiments about my own dreams, the irony being they’re the only thing that I ever bother waking up for. Take my dreams away and I have nothing. I’m just getting older and more washed up year after year after year.

      This world definitely isn’t a friendly place to artistic types… it’s even worse now.

  52. Melissa says:

    Suicide in my opinion has its own definition for people. Everyone is different so certain situations are different. In my own situation I would because there is no help with losing a child. Its forever painful. No professional can help they just use medication. Now im not suicidal im learning to cope but the human body can take so much pain.

  53. Erin says:

    I have tried every antidepressant out there. There is no cure for mental illness and none of the doctors care about you anyway. Life is absolutely pointless. I don’t know why anyone would want to be here. I wish I was dead. Perhaps I can go to the Netherlands and they can help me with that.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Erin,

      I’m sorry you’re feeling so hopeless. It’s a terrible feeling. It sounds like you’ve gotten a lot of treatment and tried many different things. That said, I still want to point you to the Resources page in case you want to just talk with someone by phone, email, text, or online chat.

      May you feel at least a little hope again soon.

    • Puck says:

      I can understand why some people say life is pointless. One of the biggest games in this world is controlling people for amusement. That is amusement of those that have enough money to play such games, a billionaires game, and a game of governments.
      At one point in my life I did not see things this way, that was back when I could easily get any medication that I needed to keep myself healthy and able to think clearly, and for the most part pain free.
      Then also at that time education was for the most part affordable, $20 a semester to go to college. A person did not need medical insurance to see a dentist or for most other things, that is outside of a long hospital visit. Now times have changed for the worst. Everything his gone up in price, but the income of most people in nearly every country in the world.
      I know that I am not alone in noticing this, and personally I think that anyone that does not see it is mentally impaired to say the least. Nowadays I spend each day in ever increasing pain due to spinal stinosis, tooth problems and sinusitis. I also am unable to do things that most people can easily do because I do not think clearly because of the pain. This has me to the point that I have great difficulty communicating well, or even being able to file tax returns on time. However I’m told that it does not matter if I’m not in the hospital. When I get to the point that I will be in the hospital, that will be game over for me, as I will lose everything that gives me a reason to continue to be a part of the world. Same if the government does something to me. I care about myself and others, but I have to say it really sucks when the most workable option for me is to end my life. I do not want anyone to stop me if I get to that point, as if they really wanted to make a difference and not push me to that as being the best option, I would think that there would be people that would do so. All of the people that say that they want to help are only interested in one thing and that is stopping people from ending their life, but they outright refuse to do anything to help people from having a better option in life. Things such as helping people get a better job, helping them get the medications that they need, or other medical services. I do not feel that any sane person would think of ending their life if they had better options to the problems that make life unbearable for them.
      What is wrong with those that think that only talking is what most need. I’m willing to pay people to help me, that is when I am able to do so, and yet people refuse to help me find a better job even when I offer them $1000 to do so. That would be quite easy for me if I were earning what I should be and feeling better and thinking better.

      Years ago I chose not to have children, as I really do not want a child of mine to have life harder and less enjoyable than I have had. I am not one of those people that is so selfish that I would bring a child into the world, just so I could do what others have done before me. Also really what is the point to life to live as a slave, and to enjoy being a good slave to society and the banks with very little in return. It is things such as this that make me think about what I read in the book of revelations, where there will be many innocents to suffer needlessly before the nations that brought on the problems fall. Besides, a thinking person would realize that there are many things that book says that John wrote, first Mankind will be the cause of the fall of mankind, as in we cause the problems for ourselves and there are many others that cause our problems as well. In the end the problems will go full circle and those that are at the top will fall, then the world will be able to rebuild anew. The other part is a spiritual rebirth, and lastly there is the fact that it is a test to see if people are as a collective enough to keep the collapse from happening in the first place. Many from what I see are not, so their destruction does not bother me, but to me it is justice served. After all they are attacking me right now and working on more methods by making life more difficult for me and others because they do not want us to be able to self medicate. That is the only thing that currently is keeping me alive. I need do nothing to end my life, as our government will do it for me.

      I ask, prove me wrong!

    • MaryBeth says:

      Erin, I completely agree with you. I’m too tired to fight this battle any longer. No one wants to hear the truth about bipolar depression. I’ve been dealing with this for many years and now I’m just too exhausted to continue pretending all is well. Wish there was a magic pill that could ensure I’d sleep into the next life.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      MaryBeth,

      Bipolar depression can be excruciating, as you know all too well. I wonder if you’ve read the works of Kay Redfield Jamison. She is an expert on bipolar disorder – she co-authored a textbook on its treatment – and she herself has bipolar disorder. She emphasizes the need to see a professional who understands the distinction between bipolar and unipolar depression. And she talks about the need to combine treatments, relying not only on psychotherapy or medication or even ECT, but a mixture of them. Here’s one of her pieces: “Depression Can Be Treated, But It Takes Competence.”

      You might also find some of the information on the Resources page helpful. I hope you will check it out.

  54. Elena says:

    I just am tired. I’m in a bad marriage. But it’s not just the marriage or the loneliness. It’s everything. I have a daughter. I am so proud of her and I love her dearly. But next year she will be in college. My life has been so painful so hard and I just can’t anymore. I don’t have it in me to do this for my daughter anymore. I don’t want her to hate me or feel she had anything to do with it. No matter how many degrees I get I’m stuck in crappy jobs. I have a criminal record so my options are limited. No matter how much therapy and reading I do, I just am attracted to men that will suck the life from me. No matter how hard I try to maintain some form of stability my life is chaos. Chaos I create. Originally by June of 2018 I was considering killing myself by driving off a cliff. Now I’m researching life after death and may do it sooner. My life has been completely bad, it’s more painful then most. I made and make stupid choices and will pay for lifetime. I’m doom to work in a warehouse forever. It’s time I save myself the energy and go.

    • Crushed & Broken says:

      Hi Elena, I can feel your pain. I myself attempted to commit suicide back in 2015. I saw that it really hurt my son. I left him a note with my bank cards and info and told him to just keep them and don’t spend it all. When he came home and didn’t see me he became very worried. I didn’t tell him what I was about to do. I’ll share my story real quick. At the time when I was pressing to go forward I kept getting closed doors. It seems that I had to fight hard for everything. I was staying with my mother at the time and was expecting very important mail. My mother actually took the letter and hid it for her own selfish reasons. That took me over the edge because I questioned myself “why, why would she do that knowing I’m going through a hard time?” At that moment I became numb and wanted to kill myself. My oldest son cut off his relationship with me because I left his father due to bad treatment and started over in another relationship. I had worked so very hard to give both my sons the best and thought by leaving, I could give him the life he dreamt of but his father brainwashed him into thinking I was the bad guy. My exhusband joined a motorcycle club the 1st month he brought his bike. He cheated on me since we dated & was just caught having an affair. He wasn’t a good provider & I did everything and became tired. I gave him the option to choose between his family and the club so he decided to stay in the club, so I left. I didn’t want to but I felt like a prisoner in my own home. In the next relationship the guy tricked me and betrayed me even worse. I always worked temp jobs hoping to become permanent somewhere but never got hired. I became very sick with stress and lost so much weight but I kept pushing. It seemed the more I pushed the more things became worse & my exhusband partied more and got remarried the month after we divorced. He turned his back on my youngest son and I became a single parent. I had to move back to my mother’s house and that was so awful. So 1 day I wrote a note and planned how I was going to kill myself. I was going to buy alcohol and take it with my medications and go inside of Panera bread to do it. As I was on my way walking to Panera, I found a beige wallet inside of a shopping cart with like $350. Right there I knew it was a sign from God to go back home. So I walked home but still contemplated to kill myself. I began drinking and taking pills and told my brother and friend I was on my way out. All of a sudden there was a knock on the door and it was the police and ambulance. I was admitted in the hospital for 5 days. All they did was give me meds and sent me back out here in this world to fight alone. I guess they thought the meds were going to help but what about my problems I was facing? To this day things became way worse. I don’t wanna talk too long but I promised myself I would never try to commit suicide ever again. When my son comes home and I’m not there, he calls me asking where am I because I guess he’s afraid that I left or killed myself so I don’t want him to ever have to experience that again. Right now I feel so numb and hurt and I began to develop a relationship with God by prayer and worship every morning. I feel he’s not answering my prayers and has truly turned his back on me. It’s ok because I will never give up on god but I question a lot and it seems like all the bad guys and people that do wrong are winning. All I can advise is to tell you to hold on! I always hear that the bad days don’t last forever but I somehow can’t see that and just try to stay hopeful. I just want God to naturally take me but will never kill myself. Killing yourself will hurt your son/daughter tremendously. Please just take the good and hold onto that. I have my 5lb Yorkie whom I love for 10 years. Honestly I feel he’s the only thing that loves me. Not even my own sons love me but it’s ok. So please, for me, hold on and I will do the same

    • Anonymous says:

      Eckhart Tolle – The Power of Now. Please give the first chapter of this book a chance. It explains how your mind is a bit like being possessed by a paranormal entity. I know this sounds mad, and possibly is. I am not a genius obviously but Eckhart is. Please give it a try, go for three chapters.

  55. Crushed spirit & heart says:

    I don’t want to commit suicide, I just want to die. Life is hard, I didn’t ask to come here and it’s a shame I have to suffer. I never been happy no matter what I’ve done. I was in a bad marriage, left & tried to be in another relationship. That wasn’t even better until the point my health became affected & I had to move and stay with my mother. I feel my life went completely backwards because ever since I was young I always wanted to get away from living with my mother. I worked good jobs to the point I can no longer get a job anywhere, not even at a supermarket. I have so much to say but I just don’t understand and can’t believe that things will get better and this pain I’m feeling is only temporary. I say this because I was temping at a job last year & applied for the poisition permanently. Over years of trying to find an apartment when I was working, the 1 place I found I was approved for. Right after I got a yes for the apartment, I lost my job. I had to hustle to pay bills & my vehicle broke down. Sure enough after 4 months I lost my 1st apartment and had to go live back with my mother. She’s a very miserable and negative person and it doesn’t help being here with her. Even my exhusband, he dogged me so bad & actually remarried a month after our divorce. I have 2 sons and the oldest is on his own and my youngest I’m having such a hard time because their father doesn’t spend time with them at all. He waited until they were big to become a dead beat. I’ve applied to so many jobs, interviewed for positions and all I get are rejections. My last story: I met another guy and warned him that I was too hurt and didn’t want to be in another relationship. He wouldn’t accept no for an answer and slowly but surely I fell in love with him. Come to find out he was lying to me the whole time and was in a relationship with his baby moms. He actually moved in with her. So I feel like I get something and then I lose it. It’s like I see all the bad guys winning. I had a rough life and always was so positive and a fighter but what am I fighting for? I feel like I’m getting tortured each day I wake up. I pray every night that god would just let me die in my sleep. My spirit and soul is so tired.

  56. Angela says:

    I don’t think suicide should always be prevented. My depression has been really bad for nearly two years. Nothing will improve in my life. There is no support here. And a lot of people have turned their backs on me.

  57. Dave says:

    I am a 33 year old male. I have been suffering terribly from depression for a few years now. My ex fiance recently broke up with me. I have no job and live at home with my parents. Everyday I wake up hoping I will die on that day. I hate myself and my life. I just want to end the pain. My life is hopeless and I get no enjoyment from it. I just want peace.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Dave, it sounds like you feel hopeless and are hurting a lot. And it sounds like you feel convinced that the way your life is now is the way it will always be. I hope you will talk with someone about how you feel. You can call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 1.800.273.8255 (TALK). Also please check out the Resources page at http://www.speakingofsuicide.com/resources/#immediatehelp for places you can talk to somebody by phone, text, email, or online chat. You don’t have to hurt like this forever, and you also don’t have to die to avoid hurting like this.

    • Steve says:

      Dave, I feel your suffering mate. Remember you at least are living with your parents. There is love there. I live alone and have been feeling like this for almost 10 years now. Talk to your parents, you don’t want to continue on this route. For me I feel I’ve gone too far and can’t see it improving. When I do see a glimmer of hope the door shuts. I hope you get the help you need. Take care matey.

    • Anonymous says:

      Eckhart Tolle – Power of Now. Explains why your mind is not your friend and what you can do about it. Best Wishes.

  58. Mom says:

    Oh Stacey, I’d LOVE to hear you rationalize this. In March, a woman named Kathy Myers in Colorado obtained physician-assisted suicide for her end-stage COPD which was caused by being a lifelong smoker.

    So let me get this straight. You can spend your whole life smoking, which by now, we all KNOW (including Kathy), that it inevitably leads to disease, suffering, and in many cases death. So, in other words, smoking is officially a socially-acceptable and legally-sanctioned form of suicide. Hey, go for it! Smoke your life away and you won’t have to deal with the consequences of your actions!

    By contrast, take a person like me who was born with hereditary depression and had a traumatic childhood which compounded it, in which symptoms began before puberty. Endogenous depression lasting for decades causes INTENSE, unimaginable suffering, and a nonexistent quality of life. So a person in my case, through no fault of my own, is expected to live a life of endless suffering despite trying every treatment under the sun to no avail (years of therapy – CBT/DBT/EMDR, medications, ECT, alternative therapies, the list is a mile long), but a person who KNOWINGLY caused their highly preventable suffering and disease is offered a peaceful, painless death out in the open where family members can be with them in their final moments?

    Guess I should have started a 2-pack a day habit at 12 rather than being committed to health and wellness my whole life, and spending decades and tens of thousands of dollars on trying to heal myself of an illness which I didn’t CHOOSE. Why are sufferers of long-term, untreatable mental illness any less deserving of a peaceful exit from their incurable disease? Because they aren’t of sound mind? I’d argue that someone who smokes their life away isn’t exactly of sound mind either, so out the window goes that argument. A friend – who coincidentally is a chain smoker of extraordinary poor health – once accosted me for being “ABNORMAL!” for my wishes to end this lifelong torment and agony that I’ve tried SO HARD to heal myself from. I think it’s “ABNORMAL!!!” to be a chain smoker who takes shit care of oneself and can get a peaceful exit from the world once they start suffering from their poor decisions. I get how addicting smoking is, and hey, maybe for some that addiction is incurable just like for some with mental illness, it’s incurable. So how in the hell is this okay?

    I’m happy for Kathy for being able to have a peaceful, reliable, self-determined end of life. It’s a basic human right that should be available to EVERYONE, not just on an arbitrary basis based on society’s inability to understand the severity of suffering and exhaustion that comes with a lifelong uphill battle against an unrelenting depression. I can’t wait to leave this incredibly absurd world.

    • Someone Somewhere says:

      THIS. Just, THIS.

      I’ve even had smokers (and overweight people who are addicted to junk food, not that I’m judging them but I mean, dear god the irony) tell me the same thing if I tell them how life just isn’t for me. The only reason it’s legally acceptable to consume things that are potentially deadly such as tobacco and alcohol not to mention junk food (hell even stuff considered “health” food) that has ingredient lists that might stump a chemistry major is because the government stands to gain while other substances that do far less damage (if any) are still illegal depending on where you live or at least taboo though that’s besides the point. My own father died almost 12 years ago from a stroke… I came to an epiphany recently that he didn’t kill himself directly, but he did ostensibly by refusing to take care of himself even though he had warning signs all over (from bad body acne to borderline-narcolepsy to being rather overweight) telling him to take care of himself or pay the consequences. How am I any worse for wanting to die because I’m too genetically messed up being mentally and physically weak, butt-ugly looking like a keebler elf and rebellious to function in this world and I can barely even scrape by with the bare minimum of part-time work (if that) and did even worse when in school, only living for perhaps impossible dreams? Shouldn’t the world be happy if I killed myself for a defective, “lazy” dreamer willingly taking care of himself by dying than being a leech to the clogged-up overpopulated system at best?

      Though I don’t smoke Kurt Vonnegut was a smoker and had a great way of putting it “I am hopelessly addicted to cigarettes. I keep hoping the things will kill me. A fire at one end and a fool at the other.”

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Someone Somewhere,

      You communicate very poignantly, and powerfully, the depths of your feelings of hopelessness. I hope you will consider talking to someone about all this. You can call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 1.800.273.8255 (TALK) at any time if you are in the U.S. Also check out the Resources page for more places to anonymously get help.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      “Mom,”

      I’m sorry to hear of all the suffering you have experienced, suffering so intense that you want to leave this world. It sounds like you’ve tried a lot of different kinds of therapy and are still hurting. Maybe one of the places on the Resources page could help you, even if only a little; I hope you’ll try.

  59. D says:

    If we knew how to encourage a suicide, would we?
    (If the answer is “no”, perhaps we should stop)

    We as individuals are quick to put distance between ourselves and anyone who already feels alone. We suggest their fears and pains are invalid, or dismiss them as less valid than those of others. (Or dump on them our own problems.) We pathologize their quirks and foibles. We amplify their sense of “otherness” with a diagnostic label either attained from Dr. Google or with the aid of a “qualified medical professional”. We label minor differences and disagreement between them and us “probelms”. We are patronizing when we like them and treat them like societal outcasts when we don’t. And the most damning thing we do: We refer to them as a “them” when we are as them.

    Our society makes the daily struggle of life itself less cooperative and collaborative by the day. We’ve ramped up competition at every opportunity and increased the stakes of failure to global public ridicule and permanent social ostracism. We’ve passed the blame of systemic failures onto the individuals that have been failed by those systems. No job? It must be you. No skills? It must be you. No future? It must be you. We are punitive, retribution, and judgment based instead of generous, rehabilitative, and discernment based.

    The statistics on suicide are always changing but they never quite measure what is really going on. Suicidal individuals are trapped in a system which gives them only one way out. Unless the network of resources around someone reveals an alternative path that route out isn’t pretty.

    Suicide is a personal solution to a systemic problem.

  60. Nonni says:

    I kinda snickered at the whole ’90 percent’ thing. I mean, if someone succeeds, it’s not exactly like they’re going to be around to die another way. And it seems to me that no one is willing to consider the reverse, and that the people that are determined to die may actually result to overkill (if you will pardon the unintentional pun) in order to ensure the desired result.

    But I’d love to know a few things.

    1. What gives any of us, outside of directly affecting someone else’s physical safety, the right to dictate someone else’s life choices? The line of thinking can become very- well, very ‘not nice’. An example could be anything from tattooing to jobs.

    2. With the whole ‘it gets better’ movement, really? Perhaps these people would be willing to share next week’s jackpot numbers with me while they’re at it? For the people it does get better for, that’s great and wonderful. But I want to know what happens for those who they DON’T get better for. Certainly seems like a way to keep those already in emotional turmoil from trusting those who supposedly have their best interest in mind.

    3. Why do any of us think that we have some magical insight into the lives & psyches of others?

  61. Linda says:

    So lonely,all the people who truly loved me have died.
    So I feel I want to die too,the loneliness is unbearable

    • Jude Gibbons says:

      Hi Linda,
      I feel the same. So lonely in my circumstances. Hear to talk if you would like to any time

  62. Someone Somewhere says:

    I myself have decided to end my life very soon and there’s nothing anyone can do/say to stop me from this. Can’t say when or what’s going to be the last straw, but I can pretty much guarantee this IS going to happen. I am genetically screwed and was from the get go thanks to being cursed with my parents (especially my unhealthy father’s) bad genes thus me being cursed with extreme lethargy and bad skin and that can barely function in this world and can barely hold down a part time job much less 2 and have pretty much turned into a hermit recluse. I had huge dreams and they are/were pie in the sky, but they were the only things I lived for. I don’t have any prospects in this life, and I’m proud of myself for refusing to have children especially because I should’ve died in the womb like nature intended of me in the first place. I got all the bad genes from my parents and since I like kids I could never forgive myself for passing my bad genetics on to an innocent child. It’s one thing to make me go through this, but I could never live with myself forcing a child to.

    What makes me very mad about the anti-suicide stuff out there is how these people cannot admit that they don’t know how to treat someone who is suicidal. They are too full of pride and judgments to let go of their egos and actually LISTEN to anyone who is suicidal. They threaten these people with violence (I have been.) They call them stupid and cowardly. The authorities put them on suicide watch and throw them in jail. If they attempt and are thrown in the hospital, the staff might end up calling them “stupid” and “cowardly” too! Yeah, none of this stuff sounds triggering at all, does it? Most (if not all) of the people I know that are anti-suicide are very cruel and abusive deep down. They are the “misery loves company” types. They are control freaks who cannot let go of others and before anyone says anything yes, I have lost loved ones to suicide (maybe even an uncle, who attempted at least twice that I know of) and while there is an empty void where they once were, more than upset they are gone, at least they are truly in a better place than this god-forsaken overpopulated, polluted hyper-competitive hellhole excuse of an inhabitable planet. I also hate the phrase “permanent solution to a temporary problem” because very often, the problems of a lot of suicidal people are NOT temporary. Then there’s the jerks that go “get it over with then, you coward” and then in a twist of irony try to save their lives! It’s like “oh, you can’t dare point out your own shortcomings; I have that right because I’m better than you and I know what’s best for you!”

    “Why is suicide illegal? Because it’s destroying government property.” – Unknown

    “Honestly, life isn’t for everyone.” – Doug Stanhope

    • Paul says:

      I agree, and you are so very much correct on all your points. Also if these control freaks were really interested in making the world a better place they would listen to those that want out. They would take all of the things that people say that want to die and turn each and every thing that they say on its head. That will not happen though because those control freaks want people to suffer and for them and their friends to make a profit off of it in one way or another. Be it for profit prisons, hospitals, etc. All billed to unsuspecting tax payers, so all of us pay far more than we would be if people we have in office really did have a heart and worked to make this world a much better and enjoyable planet. We have many many highly skilled people that are unable to afford to enjoy life because of these control freaks. I dream of the day when people will by the millions borrow millions to get doctorate degrees, and when they are done either skip the country or end their life when the bill comes due instead of trying to pay it. There is more than one way to kill this beast that lives in most countries of this world. One of the best is for people to not try and better themselves, and have as many children that they possibly can, and have all of the people on public assistance. After all the beast in the book of revelations is alive and well. It is quite obvious from the actions. There is no devil, but people that act as a large group that makes up the devil, they are the control freaks in this country and every other country on this planet. There will be many innocents die, and this is also in one of the chapters. The bible is not some mystical book, but a book of history, stories, and many other allegories. Also the end is coming to this country and others, and this is because of the people driving things that way. It does not have to happen but will because there is much profit in causing suffering. Selling weapons to both sides, security, and many other things. Just like terrorism, it is to get people to act, and it would not be effective or keep happening if ignored. It is another part of psychology, and yes the best and brightest killing themselves to get out from under student loans is both very sad, and on the other hand not all that surprising.

  63. James C says:

    I found your article very self serving, short sighted and narrow minded. If people want to die that’s their free will and they are entitled to it. We didn’t have the choice whether to be born, but we do have the choice when to die and that’s a wonderful gift. No one in society should shame another if they decide to take their own life, it really isn’t any of their concern/ you can never know another’s struggles enough to tell them whether they should keep living. Stay in your lane, stop being so judgmental of others if they decide they want to commit suicide, your concern really has no bearing on what they are going through. You are being self absorbed and despotic in your attempt to dictate what others should do. Sometimes the kindest and most rational thing to do is to let someone end their own pain. Pragmatism and the hope for a more peaceful existence can manifest itself as suicide.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      James,

      I’m sorry that you view my attempts to help others so negatively. I understand your argument philosophically, but realistically I also know that many people who were feeling abjectly suicidal are now grateful to be alive today. And they are thankful to those who helped them to not act on their suicidal thoughts. (For just one powerful example, read the story of Kevin Hines.) I hope you will consider those people, too, when making your argument against suicide prevention.

      Thank you for contributing to the discussion and for giving me this opportunity to address what no doubt many other readers are thinking, too.

  64. im_id says:

    no, I know in terms of some others I never suffered enough , I just feel like I am an outsider no one understand , I am such a failure in every aspect I thought of trying ,ok I am tired I don’t want to try anymore , actually I can’t try anymore I can’t tolerate someone telling me I have no fucking future , ok suck life I don’t need it

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      im_id,

      Are you getting any help? It sounds like you’re believing the worst edicts of your mind, without entertaining other possibilities.

      If you’re in the U.S., please consider calling 1.800.273.8255 (TALK), which is a 24-hour hotline. Wherever you are, you can check out the Resources page on this site at http://www.speakingofsuicide.com/resources/#immediatehelp.

      I hope you will reach out to someone, but someone who is supportive and constructive, not toxic to you!

  65. Cameron says:

    The world was never meant to give second chances. Once you blow it, you blow it. Of course this isn’t really the only reason where there could be rational suicide, as often the bad things that happen in our lives are due to other actions we had no control over. I want to die myself. I feel that I have no purpose, and that I’m a burden on society. A lot of people make claims like this up, but I really can’t find anything positive about myself except for the little things. What I’m trying to say is, rational suicide can be indeed rational. Ending ones suffering will only help them, if its not possible by treatment while they’re alive. I do however think that without a proper diagnosis of the person’s mental disorder it would be irrational.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      “A lot of people make claims like this up, but I really can’t find anything positive about myself except for the little things.”

      The little things are no small thing, Cameron! Especially when they are positive things about yourself.

      On a different note, I think you will find that many people have been granted second – and even third, and fourth, and 20th – chances. If you want to read more about them, check out these sites:

      Stories of Hope and Recovery

      Live Through This

      Also, it might help you to listen to the story of Kevin Hines, who jumped off the Golden Gate Bridge and survived: I Jumped Off the Golden Gate Bridge.

      I hope that you feel more hope for yourself, and for life, soon.

  66. Joe says:

    In the last 15 yr i have lost my son and his mother to a drunk driver. I’ve lost majority of my family. The other day i found out that a very dear friend had been killed. I have few friends, next to nothing to show for in 31 yr. Im legally retarded in the state i live in. I have been depressed since i was 6 when my sisters were taken from me. Every person i meet is using me for something be it everything i have or just what they can take. Relationships dont happen since forever, and im not the nicest person but thats the end result of a shit stained life that wasnt wanted in the first place.
    No amount of therapy has ever helped me. The one thing that haz been there my whole life is the concept that i can end it any time. That has been the only thing thats ever been true.

    • Brittany Odle says:

      I am crying for you I do not know how you feel but i am here to talk if you want. Losing somoene you loves not easy. I lost my grandpa and great grandma who i loved. If you want to message me i am here jesuscaresforyou777@yahoo.com

  67. Vikas says:

    i want to die i dont have a job never had a girlfriend and now my career is like over its just over now i cant earn enough to have a family i am gonna die alone im pathetic i always make bad decisions people are gonna laugh at me i will become a joke in society so i guess its better to go nobody is gonna miss me….

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Vikas,

      I’m sorry you’re feeling so hopeless. Please check out the Resources page for places where you can get help by phone, text, email, or online chat. And remember, just because your mind is saying all these bad things about you doesn’t mean they’re true.

  68. Anonymous says:

    No. It should never be prevented for the people that do have a genuine reason to die. This is because the average of their feelings is very much in the negative and so it is clearly preferable to go. That’s rationality in this debate. You don’t really love someone selflessly if you would rather them suffer for a lifetime now do you? ‘Mentally-normal, helpful’ people are sick. People may change their mind about suicide to die of other causes. However, obviously they’re likely to live a life of guilt for their continued desire to die, hurting the selfish people left behind. The reality is sad.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Anonymous,

      I understand that you feel strongly about this, but I have a question: How do you know?

      That is, how do you know that the feelings of someone with a “genuine reason to die” will remain “in the negative”?

      How do you know that someone will “suffer for a lifetime”?

      How do you know that people who are suicidal and choose not to die by suicide are “likely to live a life of guilt for their continued desire to die”?

      I don’t think you – or I, or anyone – can know any of those things.

      I do know, however, many people (and of many people) who were certain that they would never feel better, or would never want to live, and who now feel very differently. If you’re interested in reading the stories of just a small fraction of those people, here are some places to start:

      Stories of Hope and Recovery

      Live Through This

      Suicide survivors of Reddit, what was your first conscious thought after you realized that you hadn’t succeeded? (Note that this one contains graphic descriptions of suicide attempts, but the words of the survivors will, for many people, outweigh the risk for triggers.)

      Good luck to you, Anonymous!

  69. James Harps says:

    I’m piss broke and can’t hold down a job. I’ve got plenty of education and certifications, but that means nothing since I don’t know the right people and I don’t come from a financially well off family. I HATE the fact that most of the world functions on consumerism because it leads to do much waste and debt. I’m trying to figure out why I should keep living in a world that I hate as I feel like I have no purpose in society except to be a burden to those who have accepted the societal norms. I don’t think like most people, in fact I do everything I can to help people because I know how much this financial system sucks the life out of you. Seeing the world become what it has has made me wish for an apocalypse or global collapse for years now. I don’t want to see the human race die off I just want all the bullshit laws and politics to fall in to disarray so that we as a globe will try to start over again but focus on a global functionality rather then profit.

    As a child I loved the thought of a world that worked for a common goal, but as I’ve grown older I’ve come to the acceptance and conclusion that the world will never work in harmony for a global success and instead this world will die from human ignorance and greed.

    So in closing I ask again. “Why bother living anymore?”

  70. Anonymous says:

    i tried kill myself twice but both times someone found me and take me to hospital
    i don’t really wanna be here, i’m alone, i don’t enjoy life,
    i’m thinking for the third time but hopefully this time no one can find me

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      So sad that you are suffering, Anonymous. Please look here for places where you can get help by phone, text, email, or online chat.

    • Rob Z says:

      I know the pain. If it weren’t for my cats, I’d be done. For now, find the thing, people, something that’s stopped you so far and grasp that.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      So true, Rob, cats (and other pets) are many people’s reason for living. And even if they can’t have cats, they can help rescue them or volunteer at a shelter! It only takes one thing.

      Thanks for sharing your great advice.

    • Joseph says:

      I can promise you that no matter how deep the trials of this life may seem, you are not alone, and one day, the light will come.

    • Reverend Ane says:

      You are not a lone, many times I have been told I should kill myself, I was wasting space and I am still here a Reverend and a mom so when you feel life is not worth it remember God chose your life and he has big plans for you. Who knows you may be our next president, or the person who cure AIDS, or cancer, even Parkinson.

  71. Lisa P says:

    I’m 57, and I’ve spent my entire life wishing it would end. Abusive father, indifferent mother, a sister who grew up knowing it was perfectly okay to beat me up too, because in our house, I was to blame for everything. I haven’t lived in that house for decades, my father died in 2002, and still I can’t get rid of the ghosts of self-hatred and self-loathing that I grew up with. I’ve spent the last 20 years on meds for bipolar, but I was never bipolar, just unlucky enough to have a bad psychiatrist and no ability to see through the drug fog. Now the new doc says I have avoidant personality disorder, two rounds of TMS later, I’m still as chronically depressed as I was since age 4, and SSRI’s don’t work for me. I haven’t worked in 20 years, and have zero self-esteem or self-worth, because my life has no value. I’m worth more dead only because of a life insurance policy, but of course, even though I’ve been paying on it for more than 20 years, I’ve got the only policy on the planet with a permanent suicide clause in it, so I couldn’t even get that right. No way out for me from my misery, because I’d just become a bigger financial burden…

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Lisa,

      It’s unfair how much some people suffer. I feel that way reading your comment. I hope you are able to get help that truly does help you. If you want to talk with someone by phone, email, chat, or online text, please check out here a list of places where you can do that.

    • Anonymous says:

      I have the same problem and diagnosis. Abusive father, indifferent mother and also abusive sister. Some people should be sterilised to prevent from inflicting such horrors on their unsuspecting children.

    • Joe Blow says:

      I’m BY NO means encouraging you to commit suicide. I think it’s generally an awful choice to have to make, but nonetheless, it is a basic human right even if society tries to tell you that it knows better than you the value of your own life, or worse, that you don’t even have ownership of your life. It sounds like you’ve tried everything which I can completely relate to, as well as the abusive/neglectful upbringing. I do hope you find something that helps alleviate your suffering. Have you tried ECT as a last resort? It does work for some people when nothing else has worked.

      Getting to the point of my response to you, I believe you are incorrect about your life insurance policy, assuming you reside in the USA. State insurance laws supersede insurance clauses, and I would check with an insurance lawyer (or just post a question on JustAnswer.com – it’ll cost $5-10 to get an answer from a practicing and licensed insurance attorney in your state) about your policy because I’ve been a licensed insurance broker/financial advisor, and I’ve never heard of such a thing outside of the standard 2 year contestability period (sometimes that period is only one year, depending on state, even for suicide). Your insurance company can have whatever clauses it wants to have, but if your state law dictates something else (which in many cases they do), the clause doesn’t mean a darn thing. Of course, insurance companies always bank on people not being aware of their rights and this is how they literally get away with keeping millions and millions of dollars per year in death benefits that legally should have been awarded but weren’t because families just took the insurance company’s automatic denial as the final word rather than consulting an attorney.

      Here’s an article that discusses the topic: http://time.com/money/3117698/how-life-insurance-policies-deal-with-suicide/

    • mmmokhtar says:

      let us start from the worst case ,say a man has no job ,no income , no home , no family , suffering a permanent illness and can not pay for medicines , starving ,not insured , cursed and humiliated by every one because of his extreme poverty , if a man like this is thinking of sucide do you still call it an awful decision to commit sucide?

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      mmmokhtar,

      I don’t think there’s a formula for when suicide is justified or not. There are many people who suffer the exact fate you describe, and they do not die by suicide (or even want to). And there are physically healthy people who live in affluence and die by suicide. Suicide and suffering are both mysterious in who they claim and who they spare. Resilience and joy are equally mysterious. The amazing thing is we really have no idea what comes next, in life or beyond.

  72. Anonymous says:

    It’s considered “humane” to “put an animal out of their suffering”… but why not those of us who are also suffering so much mental anguish every day? Where’s the “humanity” in that?

  73. Anonymous says:

    is there any way to die easy with sure results? , that may help suicide thinkers , i can not understand why some people want the other people to struggle and suffer life , it is only sadism isn’t it , OK if you want some body to live with that insistence then help him out of his sufferings if you can not help then shut your mouth, this law against sucide should be eliminated if we can not help these suicidal people

    • Joseph says:

      Life is a great blessing, even if full of suffering. There is always something to cling to, and that is faith and hope. Even if it is hard to see, like the sun when our side of the earth is turned from it, the light will come.

  74. no onje says:

    Unfortunately there is no provision for assisted suicide in our law, so I will simply have to do it on my own. Probably it will be more painful and results will be less certain, but in the end no one has the right to prevent you from exiting your life.

    • Joseph says:

      I promise there is hope. There are those in the world who care for you and would miss you. God loves you as well, and wants you to live. If nothing else, i care about you.

  75. Anonymous says:

    Epilepsy sucks like life

  76. Anonymous says:

    I want to die because there is no help out there all I get from the doctors is “keep taking the tablets “”I can’t get you help try online forums””Sorry your 10 mins are up I have other patients to see.”as they escort you out the door or at A&E “take these tablets I can’t refer you as you’ve not taken anything or hurt yourself yet” “go back to your doctor he may refer you for evaluation ” in other words I’m not worth the effort .

  77. Brittany Odle says:

    Remember you matter. There is Nothing in this world that is worth taking your precious life: death, being in debt, getting hurt, losing someone, its not worth it, its all temporary amd you will get through it. Its a phase. I will care if you die :(((((( please Just loveeee yourself and love others. ♡♡♡ forgive yourself and do something for someone. Email me jesuscaresforyou777@yahoo.com
    because you matter and I care for you. I am here to listen to you, i am here to cry for you. I am here to pray for you. YOU MATTER!!!! ♡♡♡♡♡♡

  78. Anonymous says:

    you know what i feel from all comments ,it is that we are at the end times ,all the world is becoming unbearable , the lucky one who is letting go first , terminating self life i think it is absolutely self decision , and i do believe that the ones who are thinking of sucide are the best among people they should not stay in this corrupted hopeless world , by the way when is Jesus coming back ? it is the correct time for his coming -it is now only useless world

  79. Lily says:

    Some of the posts on this site made me realise that my own issues are not so bad. I hope that all those suffering are having a better day.
    I have lived with anxiety, on/off depression, and other issues since I was 13. I am now 51 years old.
    I have good times, bad times, been optimistic and pessimistic. I have wanted to die at times and other times cried so much because I did not want to die, as I loved life too much.
    I am scared of death. I think it might be about how I will feel before it happens, if I happen to be awake. I am not scared of afterwards.
    Being 51 and a young for my age and healthy person, I have a feeling that I may last until quite an old age, and people in my family have tended to live to old ages.
    I want to live but not as I feel now. Compared to some others I have it good, but there are also troubling issues which have made me as I am including genetics.
    When I hear of people ending their lives I am saddened, but also if a person is very unhappy then who can blame them. Who can criticise? It is a personal and private choice.
    Life is a crock of crap for many people in this world, no matter how much they try to improve things. The only way is to never giving up trying to improve, in order to get out of the situation and build a good as it can be life. I imagine having some horrendous illness can make this impossible,but some people do find joy in some things even when very unwell. Don’t they?
    Even in some of my darkest and bleakest hours, there was always a point where I thought “Ok, so what happens now, I suppose I just have to carry on” The next day or however long it took, I would often feel so much better. This is what scares me about suicide. I have had the blackest and bleakest of times, but there have been such happy and perfect times too, that I am glad I have experienced.
    I often think, that if I were to end my life, what if on my way to that point of death, I regretted my actions, and it was too late to do anything about it. Maybe I was trying to end my life because I had been unhappy for so long or just on that day, but by ending my life I was ending any chance of experiencing any possible happiness too.
    No one can rule out happiness ever happening.
    I find personal happiness,, contentment and fulfillment in caring for my dog and cats and petitioning for animal rights. That makes me feel better. To some that may be nothing, but for me it does help me, however I do feel that my life has no meaning, so I try to give it meaning. I do think helping others is the best way to do this.
    People’s life circumstances can change for the better and some people seem to live a crappy life all their life.
    We either try to improve even if it is just by doing 1 positive thing a day, no matter how small that may be, or just be here contemplating suicide and life and its meaning, which is what I tend to do a lot of.
    I have an amazing daughter who is doing so well in her life and career. She is everything that I am not. I am immensely proud of her. I would hate for her life to be ruined, which it would, as we adore each other, if I ended my life. I cannot put her through that pain.
    I just don’t understand why I am meant to be here. Maybe I was meant to have a child who is doing very well.
    Years ago people died earlier. At 51 years old I feel like it is all over.
    I am still to scared to end my life, and if I were told tomorrow that I have a terminal disease, I know that I would be devastated, and wanting to live. Maybe I will always feel in a limbo state until it is my time.
    My thoughts are with people on this site. Some of your stories brought me to tears. I hope that you feel a little better.
    Please don’t give up on life easily. Compared to being dead, I think being alive with its suffering and occasional times of contentment is better than death. Death will find us all one day anyhow regardless, so….

  80. Anonymous says:

    any body who experienced life such as you will come to the same conclusion let us good people go there is no room for us in earth -enough

  81. niki d says:

    No. I think people should be left to their own devices. This world is too much, too many people can’t find their place in it. So many others aren’t allowed a chance to grow or prosper. Dying and killing yourself should be allowed, and society, which is too busy to deal with its rotten parts and lack of attention to such things, should realize that people want suicide because society treats people horribly. The family structure is gone, mental support is almost un existing , the world is not a fair place to live, struck by violence and greed. I’d say yes for suicide and I encourage people to do so. For it is the only way out of this slavery for nothing.
    sorry.

  82. Hayley says:

    I am considering suicide. I am in my 50’s, and at the peak of my work experience and capacity to enrich and educate the next generation- but because I am an “old woman,” I am considered to be useless. Without a use, I am nothing, and there really is no reason to continue consuming needed resources. I will make my decision in the next few weeks.

    • J says:

      I do hope you will reconsider. Please read some of these articles. I found it interesting that such a high percentage of suicidal survivors wanted to live. Maybe the feeling of uselessness comes from your occupation or those you spend a great deal of time with. Sounds like you are an educator? Maybe you could be educating older adults? I don’t know, but it would seem that everyone needs educating, no matter what their age. I am a 59 year old female, though I am not (and you are not) an “old woman”. Have a good 30 years ahead of us! Hope to hear from you again soon. 🙂

    • Rob Z says:

      Reach out to me. I feel the same – I have much to offer, but no one wants me at all. I understand your position, 100%, really. I’d be dead now, but my cats need me. They are my thread that keeps me going.

    • Joseph says:

      I promise you that you matter. We are are God’s literal children, and you are a beloved Daughter of God. He cares for you and loves you. I promise you that hope is there to find. The world will suffer a great loss if you leave us.

  83. Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

    I’ve received a lot of requests to re-open the comments for this and other posts on the site. It has been a rich and lively, if at times challenging, conversation. May it continue!

  84. Socio Pathos says:

    I want to. I have tried twice, The first time I just got really sick. But I was euphoric in the thought of ending. The second time my brother walked in, after I swallowed the entire box of sleep pills and called hospital. I still won’t speak to him. I want to die, I want to end. Logically, rationally and with evidence for the thoughts. I am a sociopath, I hurt things, I kill things, Some are self aware others are not quite so endowed. I was introduced to philosophy a while ago. I thought it would be a great way to learn to manipulate for my own ends. I instead, looked logically at what I am. I serve no purpose other than to destroy the things around me. I have no fear of death. Fuck I have no fear at all. i am very good at what I do. I know because I have never gotten caught, Nor am I under any investigation. HA HA HA! I am on the inside there. The fact remains that I am a destructive force of nature that despises the objects around me for their weakness. This is the only honest thing I have ever said. I say it to an object, because meat-bags are too stupid to realize they are food for things like me. i will soon find a way to do this.

  85. Veronica Horton says:

    The act of existing is not benign to other beings; anyone who’s not going to adopt a strictly vegan diet and basically go off and live in a cave somewhere is alive through killing other beings; your home was once wilderness, anything manufactured that you own required destruction of habitat and life, you can’t walk without crushing insects. For someone to prevent a being who wants to die from dying, they’re forcing that person to continue destruction of other life, the other life which, presumably, wants to live.

    • Anonymous says:

      How intense and Truthful. I can’t quite grasp the origins of life and understand it’s meaning. I hang on to the love I feel for the TRUTH and my loved ones, that’s the only reason I hang on to each day with little desire for it’s boredem and ugliness. I feel for you and your pain. I wish that we as living beings can find some meaning to this madness we call life.

  86. kate says:

    I just don’t want to be here… life is not as expected. I think I’ll stay until my pooch dies, but after that? not much reason. and how am I expected to live without a partner or money? better and easier not to….

    • Heartbroken Doggie Mommy says:

      Neither is mine. I am 52, I am not the oldest and certainly not the youngest so I want it to be my time now. Every time I think I am getting somewhere in life the rug gets pulled from under me. I don’t do life well, not a very good earthling. I want to return to my spirit self on the other side. Others seem to be able to have jobs, romantic relationships / marriages that last forever, tons of friends everywhere, tons of family that they are madly in love with, doggies that they have until it’s their time to go to the rainbow bridge, etc. I never wanted human children so I am okay with that.

      I now live like a child in my parents’ home (not as cushy as you would think) and it is HELL. Lost my home, lost my baby (a 5.5 year old Yorkie boy that I had to give away so he can have a better life and don’t want to live on this earth anymore without him), not working, feel like I can’t work anymore or get a job. I want to hide from everyone. I live my life as close to death as possible by sleeping as much as I can (it’s 8:10PM EDT right now and past my bedtime lol). I love the dark night and can’t stand the daylight. I go to bed very early and wake up late. I had a dream that I was in a dark tunnel and a truck spilled some black gravel on me. I was suffocating, got scared and got up but was still in the tunnel. I should have hung in there as I think I may have missed my window of opportunity to leave this life. I wonder if this was sleep apnea happening during that time. Advil and Tylenol PM is my best friend. Each night I pray that I don’t wake up and each morning I am still here but what’s happening is that I am being killed slowly instead of just disappearing to the other side. I actually envy people who have died in their sleep. George Michael, Joni Sledge, and the like. Bring them back and take ME I say, TAKE ME!!!

      I used to want to live a long, long time and grow old with my little doggie. I thought he’d wear his little doggie designer tux at my wedding, marrying the love of my life, whomever that was going to be, with me walking down the aisle with him but now that he’s gone (not just a dog but the love of my life) and my life is a hellish mess of my own creation … not so much now. I am afraid of suicide and I don’t have the means to make it happen so I am stuck here. I am as healthy as a horse physically. Apparently suicide runs in my family as my father and maternal aunt both committed suicide with a gun. Quick and it worked.

      We all should be allowed to decide when we want to leave this earth. I think it’s selfish to will someone to stay here when they don’t want to. WHY??? So they don’t have to go to a funeral, so they don’t have to feel sad or guilty for 5 minutes. Are they going to fix everything for you, give you a billion dollars so you can live??? NOPE!!! And people always say what they would have done for you AFTER you are gone anyway!!! Please… In a week when the hoopla of the funeral is over they will be planning their vacations ans going on with their lives. Let me go, no one will know I am gone anyway and maybe I can be a spirit and visit my doggie and keep an eye on him ❤️❤️❤️???;)

    • Jamie says:

      What’s your booby’s name? that’s what I call my babies ( I have 2 cats and a doggy). I love them so and sometimes get the feeling of self termination. I literally cannot breathe without them nor do I want to. The thought of self annihilation gives me hope, but like you i cannot bear the idea of leaving my love ones in this mess. It will be nice to know your baby’s name and don’t ever feel like you’re alone. When i read your comment I thought to myself, how can my words come from someone else? The truth is that we’re all vulnerable to the Truth and we care too much to carry on. Hang in there, I need your support. My babies are sending you a HUGE hug.

  87. Kat says:

    This is ignorant rubbish. There is a massive difference between wanting to kill yourself and wanting to not live anymore. Without physician assisted suicide the suicide process is almost guaranteed to be awful and it is perfectly possible to not want to have a painful death but still want to end your life.

    We also have a ridiculous attitude to suicide which seems to begin and end with stopping people from killing themselves. Successfully killing yourself or living you whole entire life wishing you could kill yourself – which is worse? Aren’t they both problems? Aren’t they both worthy of attention? But what we focus on is trying to stop people in crisis from succeeding in an attempt. How about we set society up so that as much as possible people are not made miserable? So that when they are miserable they can count on support and understanding?

    As for the rather woolly ‘people might find different ways to cope’ well yes, they might. It is perfectly possible for an entirely rational person to look at and assess their quality of life and decide that, of course they might be able to improve their situation or their coping skills, but what they would prefer is to die.

    I am opposed to physician assisted suicide because of what it says about the value of certain groups of people to society if we offer state sanction to their suicide – it is essentially saying ‘you fall into a category society considers to be worthless’ but I am opposed also to neoliberal politics which make so many people’s lives (quite rationally) unbearable.

    Why do western countries have an obsession with medicine ‘saving’ increasing amounts of people’s lives only to offer them such poor quality of life?

  88. Savannah says:

    Im 18, and have had depression since I was 7. Yes, 7. I found an old diary of mine from 2005 (which was when I was 7) and it filled with nothing except how depressed I was, and detailed plans of how I would kill myself. I have been hospitalzed 9 times. Sure, I feel better for a few months sometimes, I even made it over a year. But it always comes back. Its always there, and it always will be. Why would I want to spend the rest of my life like this? Why are people keeping me from killing myself? Its kind of cruel to me that people wont let others die knowing the agony theyre in. I will live the rest of my life with depression. I dont have any money, I cant move out of my house with my literally crazy dad. I cant hold down a job because of my depression and anxiety. I dont have any friends or socialization at all. Whats the point???

  89. Ann says:

    I’m 37 and missed all of the milestones that make being human worthwhile. Never been in a healthy relationship. I don’t even know how to have one. At this point I am so profoundly damaged and broken that nobody could ever love me. I don’t know what the point of waking up in the morning is, I am always sad when I wake up like, “why?”
    I just can’t relate to anyone and I always feel alone in a crowd, no matter where I am. I know others have it much worse.

    • David says:

      Well I’m 44 and can completely relate. The only thing I wouldn’t agree with is that no one could love you. I know it may feel that way but don’t discount the capacity of others. That being said I’m not saying it will happen…like I said I’m 44 and my history with relationships is laughable at best, basically I’ve had 1 relationship that I knew wouldn’t last from the very beginning but sometimes the craving for human companionship and affection from someone is extremely hard to resist. It’s not healthy to live life so disconnected from other people. But if you are like me it’s not by choice….it’s just that no one seems to think the same or have the same values. Of course when just leaving the house is a miracle then that can dampen the possibilities just a bit 🙂 Feeling completely disconnected from the human race is something I sadly have in common with you.

      I wish you the best and hope things change for you Ann.

  90. Kathi says:

    Mike – Your comment is perfectly worded. When I am going through a deep depression, it is mentally & physically exhausting. I compare it to being sucked into a whirlpool of despair. You are correct. It is nearly impossible to find the energy to crawl out of that deep black hole and there are statements that, while well intentioned, are just not helpful, platitudes like “Everything happens for a reason”. If that is true, then explain why my sisters and I were physically & mentally abused for two years by our housekeeper, including being thrown down stairs, which resulted in one sister developing a seizure condition and dying at 36 and another being so traumatised that she has BPD (borderline personality disorder) and had spent her life in and out of rehabs for alcohol & drug addiction. Why is a child born with CF or Progeria? This is an ugly world that tends to be very unkind to those who are not capable of cruelty.

  91. anonymous says:

    What if has been a therapist that has caused your life to be misery ?

  92. jacob says:

    suicide is the only way to permanently stop pain. There are unbearable levels of hopelessness and pain that are unjustified for someone to keep living with

  93. m.m. says:

    i absolutely agree with you specially you are talking about over 60 age this is the most difficult stage of human life , of course age discrimination is valid everywhere , mistakenly employers get older age as lack of physical ability to work this is not always true unless one have serious disease to hinder his physical ability , i know too much people who are on the same age but pretty strong to perform work , employers always oppressing they dig to find any weakness of applicants due to the lack of demand over opportunities , please do not surrender to this none sense and wait for god say on your life , do not submit others the opportunity to eliminate you from life , i know this type of wickedness that good people are suffering from and believe me that if you are young employers will tell you that you lack experience what is this ignorance it is just position pride , so more patience is required when it comes to this end then surely god will provide you with opportunity to live if he does not then he will take you safely to another world , do not worry my friend you are not alone

  94. Brittany Odle says:

    You guys matter. You were made for a purpose i am here if you want to talk. I love you all. ♡♡♡

  95. Brittany Odle says:

    I am here if you want to talk. Email me Jesuscaresforyou777@yahoo.com. i love you guys ♡♡♡♡

  96. Kathleen says:

    I am 61 years old, cannot find work, am ineligible for unemployment and have realized that my usefulness as a human being is not recognized by most. I have plenty of experience, but no college degree, which basically makes one equal to the village idiot these days. I am tired of putting everything into an interview and then finding that I did not get the job. I just fixed my credit and have been trying to pay my bills on time, but am down to $1300 in my 401K and up to $3,000 on my credit card. I am just so tired of fighting what appears to be a losing battle. What is the point of continuing life? I have a sister who cannot understand that lending her money I don’t have is an issue. I am a miserable person and it wouldn’t be difficult to picture life without me as better for family and friends.

    • Brittany says:

      Kathleen nothings worth killing yourself. You matter!!!!!! Being in debt and have to pay a lot of money doesnt value who you are. You were made for a purpose. If you want to talk I am here to listen email me jesuscaresforyou777@yahoo.com.

    • cz says:

      If it makes you feel better I’m more useless than you! I live in a town that I was relocated to so no one knows me here. I don’t have friends that I see. I’ve emptied my 401k down to $7000, no degree, can’t get a person to hire me for more than $5.00/hr. I have about $30,000 in debt. I’m ready to die! I just don’t want to die in debt for my family to then absorb. I’m more concerned about what happens after I kill myself. I don’t want my family to have to take care of so much.

  97. Anonymous says:

    My 40 years of “life” have been a constant hell. Everyone says things will get better. But they dont. Ive tried counselling meds ect. The results always the same. Im alone my life is only of value to others. Im already dead so why should i drag out the suffering just to keep others feeling a false sense of life. Im sick of hearing that im the unwell one. Were all dead eventually. Whats the problem with short cutting the pain?

  98. Jacob says:

    There is so much “talk” about the value of life and the joys to come. Our American society cherishes war and does not generally accept the existence of mental illness (see Tony Robbins). So, life is expendable as long as it contributes to a large corporation’s profit margin.

    Hypocrisy aside, right now I want to kill myself. I had my 15th ECT treatment three days ago. The positive effect is lasting for shorter time periods each time. I am bi polar with mixed episodes.

    For some reason, I am waiting for permission to carry out my plan. Given the emotional pain, this is irrational. I am 64 years old, so my life is nearing its end anyway. I have been thinking about suicide almost every day since I was 15.

    I happen to have an appointment this morning with my therapist and I am sure he will suggest yet another hospital stay. I am going to have to refuse, or pretend to agree and end my life. I have tried almost every pill they make. I have tried ECT. I have tried suicide, and almost made it. I won’t make the same mistake again.

    Suicide is not a knee-jerky reaction to not getting your way. It is a considered response to how your mind is attacking your body. When science fails, and God allows the pain and suffering to persist, it becomes clear that God has given me permission to terminate.

    So, I have my permission, I have the means and I have the desire. I also have a family. I would hate to disappoint my children, but it might be a greater injustice to let them grow up thinking life is kind. My wife – she understands her convenience, but little else. I had planned to renew our vows, but, ECT, therapists and psychiatrists haven’t helped. Unless something doesn’t change very soon, I have no intention of continuing to live that long.

    It has not been a good life. I really can’t see it getting much better. I am not a Christian so I have never subscribed to their threats. I think I just had to talk to understand my options. In all, suicide makes the most sense. I don’t know when I will implement my plan. But I do hope your prayers will be with me as I go to a God that understands me.

  99. Anonymous says:

    I have been sick for 20 years. I have been diagnosed with myriad things. Bipolar, Joint Hypermobility Syndrome, Fibromyalgia, Unknown Neurodegenerative disese, and now a possible Brain infindibulum or aneurysm. I am in constant pain, have not slept through the night in a decade abd I have no social life…too sick to do anything I have tried it all to no avail. I hate this life. I would love to have even a little joy, but some assholes think I should just be happy to be alive. The only reason I have not killed myself is because I tried and failed and the idea I could live in a worse condition than this is horrifying. I pray for death every night.

  100. Aiah Z says:

    I found this site as I was searching the Internet for information on self determination. Most of what I would add to this discussion has already been covered by others. As a woman, I wonder that I can terminate a life growing inside me based on others’ volatile opinions about what constitutes “viable life,” but I cannot terminate my own life. Whom do I belong to that someone else’s feelings, opinions, and perceptions are more important than my own as far as the continuance or termination of my life is concerned? I can make all manner of so-called horrible life errors, and society tells me that they are all my responsibility. That is the cost, I’m told, of being an adult. I can smoke. I can over-indulge in alcohol. I unhealthful dietary choices. I can engage in unprotected sex with many, many high-risk partners. Once I’m a legal adult, I can refuse to continue my education or get a job. I can become homeless, suffer the sexual and other physical depredations of others, and die slowly and torturously. All these things, though nearly everyone agrees they’re unwise choices–mistakes, I’m free to do. Why? Because I’m a legal adult and I am responsible for my own life, terribly “mistakes” and all. The regrets of others who’ve pursued, or been on these paths, never justify another forcing me to act “wisely.”

    Yet I cannot end my own life. Why do the suicidal deserve special protections, while the vast majority of society’s derelict do not? Just about everyone who matters–friends, family, politicians, doctors, lawyers, judges, police…–tells the societally lost they made mistakes and must now pay for them. Many of them will die painfully, abandoned, and that’s just life. But I cannot end my own life, so you seem to argue, Stacy, for my own “good”? How is that reasoning at all consistent with our culture’s principles of personal autonomy and responsibility?

    Speaking, too, as a licensed physician, even when I am confident a patient would benefit from additional treatment, I cannot force her or him to accept treatment. Even when the prognosis with treatment is statistically “good,” I can only present patients data–survival rates by years from diagnosis, side effects from treatment… Even if death is imminent without treatment, I cannot impose my will on a (non-minor) patient. So I do not believe the justification mental health gives, as you have here, Stacy, that acting against patients’ wills is justified based on the clinician’s superior knowledge of the disease state, or on the patient’s lack of clear thinking, or on the regret others who’ve attempted an act but failed at it later express over having attempted at all. At the root of the unique treatment modalities for mental health, in particular suicidal ideation, is an unjustifiable belief–not scientific fact–that life is always better than death. Other scholars in philosophy and medicine have written broadly on why this viewpoint is fallacious and never objective. Just as several European countries have finally concluded that life value can only be determined by a person living life, the rest of the world will eventually follow. The modern mental health therapeutic belief system is wholly untenable since it relies, like religion, on others believing the same principles as clinicians and mental health policy lobbyists–all who have a clear stake in the game.

    Lastly, on a practical note, study after study links quality of social life to depression risk. We’re all advised to have healthy and sufficient connections with others we care about and who care about us. But, who doesn’t want quality social relationships? A mentor of mine from my residency commented about the health protection of friendships that what counselors usually fail to acknowledge is that every relationship requires two people. There are very many reasons outside an individual’s control for her potential isolation. Clinical psychology fails to address how persistent these may be despite therapy, drugs, or other interventions. You can only hope to change an individual, not the others she must interact with. So the clinicians who are adamantly against the right of the patient to choose death, will they commit to being with each patient throughout the week, the day, the night, when loneliness sets in and these people feel abandoned and desperate? Can the clinicians guarantee that whatever treatment-du-jour will overcome the early-life formative experiences we know literally mold neurology so that these patients feel radically different, more inclined to stay alive? Will clinicians guarantee patients’ communities will put aside racism, homophobia, transphobia, xenophobia, ageism, classism, scathing prejudice based on body habitus, or any of the other myriad prejudices that isolate over a lifetime? Or will clinicians be there, day after day, to provide the intimacy of a hug, holding those who need frequent reassurance? Or can clinicians guarantee a more equitable or hospitable world in general–especially regarding the sometimes monstrously callous or patently malignant mental health system itself? I think not. So, if clinicians cannot guarantee sufficient quality of life we understand is so crucial to “mental health,” neither should they be entitled to condemn the humans they cannot help to lives patients actually living those lives find to be hellish isolation and hopelessness simply because of clinicians’ assessments of their own lives, life in general, or even other patients’ lives.

    The debate over the right to end our own lives is not a matter of medicine or so-called mental health. We already know this since every day patients whose imminent deaths could be forestalled by medical intervention are permitted to reject medical care, and insurance companies are entitled, based on finances, to reject necessary procedures the medical literature tells us are likely to extend patients’ lives significantly. The debate over the right to end our own lives is shockingly rooted in biased value systems–“shockingly” because other people in this arena uniquely get to command otherwise legal adults not to act on our own bodies. To me, there is no greater a contradiction to the concept of personal freedom than this.

    • Mom says:

      Thank you so much for this. I would have loved to see a response from Stacey, but clearly, your logic and reasoning is far too sound for the canned “but what if it gets better?” argument.

  101. Miranda says:

    In my opinion, that’s a personal decision and no one should stop them because you don’t know how much pain we have, it’s better just to disappear and stop suffering, if you stop them, they’ll go back home and still feel like nothing,

  102. Yuuki T says:

    No, I don’t.
    Obviously, suicide can be considered a selfish action – the try at death may physically hurt others, stop traffic, pull public resources, basically inconvenience people in a very literal, tangible sense. And that’s not even counting the emotional scars that may be left.

    Nonetheless, though, I actually think it’s more selfish to deny someone the right to exit.
    Nobody signs up for this life of their own volition, and there is only so much someone can do to change the circumstances of the world around them. The systems are set, the ships out of harbor, and trying to rock the boat usually just throws you overboard. Everyone I know lives with nervous laughter and downward cast eyes: they’re poor, their dreams, goals, and ambitions will never come to fruition, they have no sway in the world, except over the children we all know they can’t really provide for. They work unfulfilling, dead-end jobs, working paycheck to paycheck, smothered by bills and rent, never having anything for themselves that doesn’t come from charity or that didn’t fall off the back of a truck.

    None of them want to kill themselves, at least none have expressed it, but if they did I wouldn’t dare stop them.
    Life really isn’t glamorous, not for most of us, and too often do people toil for no benefit of their own. If they decide that they’re sick of all this, that’s okay.

  103. John Doe says:

    I tried and failed. I live with chronic pain. I’m tired all the time. It takes everything I have just to get throug the day. I can’t work. I can’t do any of the things I used to enjoy. The last thing I want to do every day is get out of bed. Disability keeps denying me. I can’t afford Dr.s to find out why I’m like this. I know I’m dying. I can feel it. It’s just taking a long time. Meanwhile I suffer. I am frustrated to death every time I have to get my pain medication filled because pharmacists hate pain patients for some unknown reason. And do their best to stall filling them and I have to go without for a day or two while they pretend they don’t know that some months have 31 days. I have nothing to look forward to. I’ve lost just about everything. Every move hurts, and any task that requires effort will cost me a day or two in bed. Then to ad insult to injury I acquired Peyronie’s disease. I have come to understand some reasons why my first attempt failed. Gastroparisis being one of them.

    I was punished for trying. They locked me up and on top of that refused to treat my pain. Wouldn’t even call the pain clinic. Their excuse was valid for the first day but not the second, or the third, or the remaining. So not only did I have all the pain I live with, I had to suffer the withdrawals. They wouldn’t treat my withdrawal except with anti anxiety mess. I don’t have anxiety. Then they kept kicking me out of my bed and room and locking the door for hours several times a day. Not a seat with a cusion in the entire place. Nothing to do or read. It was torture. I certainly did want to kill myself while I was in there and that kept me in there longer. I finally realized I had to start lying to get out.

    I was certain my first effort would work. But it didn’t. My gun isn’t big enough to convince anyone it would do the job. And I certainly don’t want to make things worse. Especially if I cripple myself to the point that I can’t finish it. I don’t want to throw myself in front of a train, but if it comes to it.. I want to go peacefully. The only thing I hated about my first attempt was that is was a secret. And I was alone. And it took a long time before I fell asleep. And I don’t ever want to wake up again like that again. I was promised from my reasearch that even if I woke up, my kidneys would be gone for sure, but no such luck. Liver survived too. If I could provoke my undefined illness to kill me I would. Then it’s not a suicide.

    So this is why rational suicide should be legal. I shouldn’t have to throw myself in front of a train. I don’t want to do that to the guy operating the train. It would be wrong to throw myself in front of a car or truck. They might react and crash and it would be a horrible thing to do to a person emotionally. I live a life of pain and misery. I would like to go out peacefully. I shouldn’t have to starve myself or deny myself water in hopes of injury. IF YOUR NOT GOING TO HELP ME LIVE THEN LET ME DIE!!! Damn hypocrites.

  104. maria says:

    I’m ready to die. “Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem”, my ass. I fucking wish my depression was a temporary problem. It’s been 10 years. Medications haven’t worked, therapy hasn’t worked, nothing’s worked. I’m miserable and I don’t want to live. The only thing holding me back is the knowledge that my parents and little brother would be a wreck.

  105. Anonymous says:

    No people should be able to choose.

  106. mike says:

    With regard to “Do Not Give Up!” and “Do Not Give In”….

    I think the response to such statements is at the heart of a number of comments here – if it’s so important to not give up on life, then the person making such a claim should “provide the energy” and effort to the person who should not give up (i.e., the person considering suicide). I think many people who are on the brink of such a decision are out of the energy required to put forth the effort to “save themselves”. That’s the point! They are looking for help. And help is NOT telling them to somehow, in some manner, try to help themselves by doing something.

    When I’ve approached counselors in the past, I’ve approached them from the point of view of seeking help. If a counselor merely tells me what I need to do to, in effect, “pull myself up by my bootstraps” or to “snap out of it”, I get turned off and more depressed right away. Even IF depression and suicide ideation MIGHT be considered, to some extent, in the same category as addiction (I personally think there ARE overlaps between them) and that, as with addicts, the depressed or suicidal person must initiate help by taking the first step toward recovery (most counselors agree that an addict can’t really be helped in the long term until they admit to themselves they are addicted), I think initiating contact and discussing feelings with a counselor IS THE FIRST STEP. They have taken it. There, done!! So, to demand that the depressed person take even MORE steps by themselves (“Okay, you’ve got to do this and this and this to start feeling better”) isn’t helpful at all! It’s likely that the person dealing with these feelings and issues was barely able to bring themselves to a counselor and ask for help. So help them! And NOT by immediately telling them how they can or need to help themselves. They can’t! That’s why they’re seeking help from a counselor, get it??

    What we probably need is for someone to not only suggest solutions, but to basically enact the solutions, WITH the consent of the person seeking help, of course. Yes, to do the work for them (at least, initially)!! This is NOT out of laziness or from someone trying to take advantage of the system. This is from the point of view of someone doing the best they can, and that all of their energy went into asking for help! Yes, this is more expensive than someone doing something on their own, both in money and emotional effort. Yes, this is more individualized than a “one size fits all” solution of “go read this book, go research these topics, go take these special organic vitamins and chart your own progress toward a solution”. Tough!! If counselors don’t want to be seen as hypocrites in their actions, this is what they, and society in general, need to do.

  107. chris says:

    Im Really Sorry to hear that…I wish i had the right answer to tell you…Im Sure you are a Great mother that your boys Love,and your shifty ass husband is at a loss for leaving you…Please stay around for your sons and friends,I Know it would Ruin them if you were gone!Im sorry i dont have better words for you.Stay safe Please.

    • mary h says:

      I totally agree. My husband hasn’t eaten a thing in 10 days. He has no known illness. He lost a tremendous amount of weight in the last 6 months from casting off food. Says he wants to die at home. Die from what? His wife and 4 adult children want to know what is wrong. Could it be depression, cancer, thyroidism, whatever. I feel like I’m helping him. I’ve offered him absolutley every food he loves. I feel so inadequate. He just drinks water. I’m afraid to look at him, it’s scarey. I feel so sorry for my children.

  108. Deborah says:

    Yes, my life is tragic and continues to be every day. After my husband of 36 years walked out of our marriage dumping me and our 2 sons in Bellingham WA, where we hated the constant rains and gloom and couldn’t wait to get out of there, I thought my life and theirs would be better and happier.

    But that was 3 years ago, and although I am divorced from my husband, my life is so miserable. After he left me, only 4 months later and still reeling from the event of abandonment and trying to cope with how this event happened to me. my brother in NY called me on January 20th at 8:30 pm telling me to sit down, because he had “something stunning” to tell me.
    My brother then told me while he was cleaning out our father, Abe’s apartment in NY since he had severe dementia and could no longer live alone, he stumbled on a metal box with a lock on it. When he opened the box…. he found my European Adoption Documents inside. Wow, at age 57 years old to find out I had been adopted hurt me greatly, especially since I called all the relatives and they told me they always knew I had been adopted in Europe.
    I found out my birth mother was from Strasbourg, France born in 1921 a Jew,and I was put up for adoption in Baumholder, Germany where my birth mother was a medical secretary. There was no father listed on either the birth certificate nor adoption documents. My birth name was Darlene Barbara Levy, but my adoptive parents, Jewish Chaplain Abe and Norma adopted me at 4 months old when the adoption was finalized and then changed my birth name to Deborah Susan.
    After leaving WA state and finding a first cousin in CA my sons and I thought our lives would then be happier. But a few months later my left eye retina detached, had surgery and then 33 days later my left eye detached again, leaving me legally blind now in that eye with limited vision.
    I hate my life and find it easier to plan my death rather that live. Finding out my birth mother told the family that she did give birth to a baby girl in Germany in 1957 but that baby (ME) had died of a disease was another stab in my heart. Feeling like my heart was broken when my husband left me, then finding out about my adoption feels like my soul had a missing pieces to it not knowing who I am, and my spirit that I once had, the ability to laugh and find joy is gone.

  109. chris says:

    Im 32 and Im tired of being depressed and physically ill for Years,just the last 7 years ive been bedridden,had depression since 15,i have chrohns disease,chronic prostatitis,Allodynia,IBD,IBS,nauseated all day,anxiety all day,irritability in my bladder and penis,throbbing prostate,turrets,i cant shit or piss right because of my prostate sigh etc etc. Im so tired of the same thing EVERYDAY,im Afraid to go to sleep knowing im going to wake up with the same AWEFULL feelings EVERYDAY!!!!No one should be scared to wake up everyday!!!!!!!And because i dont feel well i stopped hanging out with people because i Dont Want To Share My Misery With Others! Why is that SOO hard for people to understand???But for the few people that i have to see on a daily basis,ie family members,i feel AWEFULL because i dont feel well and am always apologizing for not being able to go out with them to eat or shopping whatever,or if im rely hurting extra some days and someone comes over and i blow up on them cause IM NOT WELL!!And that why i stay away from Everyone,so then i feel Awefull and Apologize over and over saying”im sorry im angry but im hurting all over!”Im tired of hurting my loved ones because of the way i am.So if can’t work to make money and help my family,cant have a relationship and have children,cant go out and have fun or something simple like going out to eat because of the nausea,whats the point of life if i can’t do these simple normal things!!Im sorry but if you cant so these things in this life like work,make money,and have a relationship and have children then there is No point of life.

    • Sophie says:

      You have loved ones. I don’t! Try feeling the way you do all of your life never having a family, or any one to help on your worst day.

  110. Anonymous says:

    I am that person

  111. Christina Stewart says:

    I knew a man who was 70 years old who lived down the way from me. He has no TV, no radio, no computer or anything else to do. His family abandoned him 7 years ago. He has kidney failure, severe heart disease, arthritis and severe, life threatening dental problems. He lives on $1,000 a month. He has to pay taxi drivers to do everything for him. He has not seen a doctor in 5 years. He doesn’t have any copay money. He wants to die. No friends or family will see him.

  112. Lee says:

    I think people who have had life long mental health issues should be able to choose to die. It is truly a life of suffering and is not fair to that person to suffer. Yes, they may have good days but the bad days outweigh those good days after 40 yrs of suffering. It is like being on a seesaw. Belgium is very forward thinking on this topic. There is no cure for depression and until there is,which is highly unlikely as pharmaceutical companies make billions on depression, anxiety drugs and other drugs, people should be able to choose the right to die with dignity.

  113. Joseph says:

    I definitely feel like dying everyday. An accumulation of my family falling apart and betraying one another, my mom being an addict and my dad not wanting to talk to me, my vision has faded since I was 15, my goals in life aren’t clear anymore and I yet to have accomplished anything more than high school graduation which I was lawfully forced anyways. My gf won’t let me see my daughter if we aren’t together so I’m forced to be unhappy with her to have some happiness of my daughter in my life. I absolutely would love to stress to the people out there who shame on these kind of feelings that they just don’t know how it is. Feelings of disparity and loneliness and absolute self worthlessness can take a toll. If you don’t have anyone in your life offering a smile or offering to sit with you or to help you in any way it really becomes lonely. My childhood was filled with abuse, watching my mom do drugs while dad was at work, her cheating on my father, her beating my brothers and I and her constantly telling us she didn’t want us and wished we weren’t born. I have no joyful memories when I was younger or even for my whole life for that matter. Thinking about the past really hurts, which hurts the present psyche, which dwindles my ability to have any sort of hope that the future is going to be a jackpot. I used to be religious until I realized I was merely mumbling unheard wishes and pipe dreams in my own mind (people know as ‘praying’). Of course these wishes or silent whispers were never to alter my hopes or expectations. Im a father and if I had the almighty ability as old school idiots think then I would with all of my power never let my children suffer a day of their life. Killing wouldn’t be a reality. And a (the) devil that was against me sure as hell wouldn’t be creeping around my child’s realm to potentially destroy the purity I established. I would smite the Devil like an ant. But this being people created called god allegedly has this power YET chooses to let us fall into the pitfall of free will and unchangeable disaster. Perhaps a reason why I feel so despaired is when I realized the god I used to believe in wasn’t even helping me REGARDLESS of the power he is said to possess. It’s even more depressing to realize that people made this concept up to make people like me have hope.

    Should a human being have the right to keep another human being on this planet just because they have luckily made it through life without such traumatic and despairing situations? That’s like a man living in an island (the island representing life) of bounty telling a human living in an island of dust that life is amazing and to cheer up. While the man on the bountiful island will never experience or know why the dust island man is so hopeless and defeated, it makes the hopelessness that much worse to know that it’s just an unfair deal of the cards. Some people win some people don’t. Some are happy because the dominoes fell correctly for them. Some people no matter how positive their aspirations or their expectations life can be total disaster. So next time you tell someone don’t die things will be better maybe you should ask yourself what are you doing to better that persons situation personally and emotionally before flaunting your positivity due to a sheltered and better life, by luck.

    • ioio says:

      Good. Point of view.i would say extraordinary.be blessed my brother!

    • Sophie says:

      Very well written. Agreed. But you at least have a daughter. I have no one. No family and all the abuse you had plus no partner now (never did). I have no future.

  114. Anon says:

    I have been down the road of suicidal thoughts. I have severe anxiety, and panic attacks. I also do not handle stress very well. I had a very rough go at life starting from 12 years old, up until now. My teenage years were the worst of it, and i ended up dropping out of school. I have been with my wife for 8 years. She knows i have issues, and sometimes does not understand at all. I have told her about my prior suicidal thoughts, and she gets angry. She does not get how i could want to die. We have a 3 year old now. I try to maintain a positive way to think Because of my toddler. I love my daughter more than life itself, and it keeps me wanting to fight, and live. Some days are better than others. All i can do is keep on trying and fighting every day. I also have my mother and sister to keep me positive. I think that if you have that close circle of people in your life, it makes each day a little easier to get through. I wake up every day, and just try…. Thats all i can do for myself.. Just try…if i feel bad, and have those feelings, i just think about my child, and the woman who has stuck around 8 wonderful years.. I hope life can get better for others, and hope it continues to get better for me.

  115. Paul says:

    I am warming to the idea of voluntary euthanasia. Clinical depression is a very bad thing, and it often remains with you for a very long time. At times one utterly despairs of life and death seems like it would be a release. Personally speaking, chronic illness has severely diminished my enjoyment of life. We have to find ways to escape reality, be it enlightenment, fiction, fantasy, sex, drugs or alcohol.

  116. Brent F. says:

    “Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem”. Nothing could be more the opposite. Suicide is a temporary solution to a permanent problem. The problem being that of unlimited conciousness. I already tried to kill myself and succeeded and ended up in an identical life with a more damaged body. From a thermodynamic scientific standpoint there are multiple universes, each with an identical copy of you and identical environments. When you die by any means, even in the absence of suicide, you end up continuing to live in a universe that supports a survival scenario. So you decide to hang yourself with a rope. Then the rope breaks…or your parents walk in and get you help…that’s what *you* experience. Little did you know there is that original universe with a set of your parents mourning your death and planning for a funeral. So you’ve accomplished *nothing*, your neck aches and you still have 13 billion years or more of life to get through. Suicide only was the temporary solution. From the viewpoint of the self (schroedinger’s cat) the effect isn’t permanent and you still have to serve your sentence. You cannot fool thermodynamics/god/mother nature (depending on what you believe in). The enemy knows the system.

    Bottom line is, don’t waste time trying to discover the first digit of pi. It’s the number three any way you slice it. Suicide is a waste of time because it has no lasting effects. Just stay alive. Yes, you can put 1+1 into a calculator then clear it over and over but the answer is always 2.

    You will always be alive for ever and ever, no technology, person, weapon, ritual,or event can take that away from you.

  117. J W says:

    I believe in bodily autonomy. My life is mine, and mine alone. There are countless people out there — myself included — that have spent DECADES trying to recover, and things have actually gotten worse as time goes on. Much worse. I’ve tried everything under the sun. Yoga, fitness, meditation, self-care, spirituality, talk therapy, CBT, DBT, EMDR, Chinese medicine/acupuncture, supplements, body work, 8 different antidepressant medications (all of which made me PROFOUNDLY worse), diet/lifestyle modifications, self-help books, ketamine infusions, psychics (hey, we get desperate), bioidentical hormonal therapy, weekly IV nutrient infusions, ayahusaca ceremonies in Peru, THE LIST GOES ON AND ON. I’ve even participated in clinical research. About the only thing I haven’t tried is ECT and I refused it because for those with atypical depression like me, the efficacy is greatly reduced – the risk of further cognitive impairment and even lower functioning was not worth it to me for such low probability of it helping. TMS isn’t covered by insurance so that’s not an option. To say that most people get better is to completely ignore the people out there who have treatment-resistant depression. I personally know 6 other people with TRS – coincidentally, they’re all in my family. It’s worth noting that I never believed my depression to be treatment resistant until the last couple of years when reality finally set in.

    When it comes to suicide, I’ve been thinking of that since I was a child. I’m 40 now. I’ll admit – my suicidal ideation in prior years was irrational. Now, it’s absurdly rational. No one has the right to determine on my behalf that I should suffer interminably for no good reason unless they are prepared to offer a treatment THAT WORKS. Oh, and it should also cure my chronic and degenerative pain and fatigue as well, because those are becoming unbearable.

    If I lived in Belgium, the Netherlands, or Switzerland, I’d qualify for voluntary euthanasia (all three countries offer it for cases of severely mentally ill people who have a lengthy medical dossier to prove they’ve exhausted all of their options). It’s comforting to know that there ARE societies out there with compassion and mercy, not to mention a level of emotional intelligence to understand that suicide isn’t going to go away just because we don’t like it. Society will have to keep cleaning up broken bodies and guts from sidewalks, they’ll have to keep fishing bloated bodies out of rivers, they’ll have to keep cleaning up brains and skull fragments from walls until they realize that this is an issue that requires a different way of thinking besides “it gets better!”, and one which doesn’t involve forcing someone to suffer simply to appease deeply imbedded fears about death and reinforce trite sentimentalities about life. The decision to self-euthanize CAN be born in a rational mind. That’s not to say that all suicides are rational and that prevention should be non-existent, but it’s atrocious that people with lifelong illnesses, both physical and mental, don’t have autonomy over their own lives and are forced to make such a big decision alone in the dark about when they’ve had enough, which only causes unnecessary suffering for their families if and when it happens.

    It’s worth noting that in those three countries that offer voluntary euthanasia, many people that receive the green light actually decide not to go through with it, and report that knowing they have the option to end their suffering peacefully and reliably brought them comfort.

  118. m.m. says:

    now it is clear how much endless sufferings in this life and for the initiator of the question is there any way to help those who find it necessary to terminate their lives? if so please if you can show them how to die easy , you asked them and then you had the answers , please reverse it just be asked and give the answers -thank you

  119. Rolly says:

    I hurt so bad. The darkness and evil is always looming. I have burdened my wife with my psychological disorders for nearly 25 years only to now burden my 12 year old daughter as well. My meds failed me last weekend and I exploded into rage. I’m hurting the one’s I love so dearly. I’d rather be dead than locked up again. I’m loosing a battle with my faith as a devout Catholic. I don’t believe God has time for me anymore or if He ever did for that matter. I want it to end! If it weren’t for my daughter it would be easy. I just can’t break her heart by ending my life. As for my wife, I trust without me she could and should remarry and hopefully have a happier life. A monster has controlled me for my entire life and I can’t take much more. There’s only one way to quiet the monster, rage, and anger.

    • pAT says:

      I can’t say i know your pain but i’m struggling with heroin addiction and its brought me to my breaking point and I still see no way out, the anger is the worst part, angry for being alive, upset at yourself because how society has structured you to live, I’m not sure if there are any answers to such a problem but there’s a beauty in self awareness, and its incredible how life can take you to the highest point and bring you back down to the depths of existence in no time at all…

    • Joseph says:

      I totally feel that way as well… I feel like I want to be the great good man people always try to represent. But the feelings my brain produce aren’t in my control. I look around and see people so happy and smiling and I utterly wish I could have that in my brain. I wish I was wired that way. I wish I could enjoy small things in life and get surrounded by the positive noise to the extent I forget I’m alive and just start living. But I realize I’m alive and suffering everyday. My fiancé wants to help but it makes her sad to see me this way. It makes it so much worse that the people I love are being affected by the way I am even with my constantly not wanting to be this way. I wish there was a pill we could take that would solve everything or maybe a solace or god that actually affected me without me having to essentially dig in for the positivity myself.

    • Pin Ann Coe says:

      If you feel you are inflicting so much difficulty on your family, then move to a small apartment nearby and make sure they know it is out of love you are doing it. Maybe it will take off some of the emotional pressure from you. Do everything else in any case, before making suicide appear to be an option to your daughter. She will face seemingly insurmountable challenges in this increasingly hostile world and I can tell you are a loving parent. Don’t let her think that suicide will ever be an option for her in those rough times. This alone is why you must endure. Find another way.

    • Amy LifeStar says:

      DO NOT GIVE UP and DO NOT GIVE IN!

      “Perseverance is the KEY;” and being “Creative and Innovative” to Approach the Nature of the CORE ISSUES you are and have been undergoing!

      Also, Medications per se: and in general have Too Many Unhealthy and Unwanted Side effects or Harmful effects! So, perhaps, right now, it might be good and wise to use a MUCH MORE “NATURAL and Authentic Health and Healing Approaches” for whatever and however you have been Tormented by!

      It is Worth to consider and Explore NEW and Uplifting Approaches and Reality and a New Horizon!

  120. m.m.mokhtar says:

    i think you are too young to get bored , you still have too much time , try life again

  121. Beth says:

    Just because a mental illness is diagnosable doesn’t mean it magically gets treated because that’s expensive and nobody cares.

  122. Travis says:

    Because I make myself alone, I am afraid of disappointing people but I do anyway. I just want to die. Why do you care what some fat, wimpy American guy is tired of his well fed life and wants to stop? I don’t add anything to the world except selfishness, pettiness, lies, and pain.

  123. Peter says:

    I disagree. I think it an individual choice. It is also highly subjective. I have diabetes and hypertension and my life expectancy is likely to be less than 15 years. A crippling stroke is likely. Much better in my opinion to end my life now especially as I derive no pleasure from it whatsoever.

  124. Anon says:

    I have a chronic disease. It doesn’t kill me, it doesn’t totally disable me.

    But the confrontations and the disapproval by society is killing me slowly by embracing me with huge amount of concerns, anxiety and depression.

    I cannot see myself happy anytime in this life, I pretend to be happy sometimes and I never expressed my desire to die.

    I can’t fall asleep not playing with my fantasy killing myself. My desire to die has lasted long and are carefully thought thru.

    Probably I’d swallow my pain to ease life of happy ignorant people who loves the society that killed my soul.

    The only cowards are the ones who cannot accept the choices other makes to kill themselves.

  125. Anonymous says:

    There are times when people around you say that they don’t understand you. On top of the personal misery you are experiencing. The final compelling remark becomes they can’t help you. This sums it up and thete is no reason to remain.

  126. Anonymous says:

    Thanks, finally an article that makes some sense.. I want to end it myself and everything i read about it is full of bull!
    Life is a cycle of hell. They created a supposedly hell to reduce the pain that is actually happening down here. Everything is so pointless providing this is a monetary system, nothing is real! 62 people of this planet own the wealth of 3.5 billion people on the planet – what’s that saying! If someone wants to die let them go, people are clueless fucking zombies!

  127. Jacob says:

    If you want to die, you are mentally ill. Humane nature does not dictate wanting to die. However, human nature changes based on the environment you are placed in. So, if the environment you are placed in makes you want to die, then that environment has warped your view of society and has tarnished your hopes. Suppose you were placed into that environment from the very start of your life. How would you differentiate from good and bad? You would have no way of knowing what a “normal” life should be like. You would only know the “bad.” Perhaps you experienced someone else’s “happy” life, and you knew right then and there just how awful you had it. Would you have only known that your life was bad once you had something to compare it to, or would you have been content with your life? Let’s examine the life of any insect, they have instinct. They make their decisions based on surviving. They don’t care about the quality of their life, and their only meaning is to make babies, eat food, and die. Let’s go back to humans now, no one should want to kill themselves. No one should want to end their lives because we are here merely to populate the earth. Unfortunately we are not insects, and we have many more emotions than being horny. Still, you should not find yourself wanting to die. I’ll admit, I do not find life worth living. I think, “What’s the point of going on if I’m going to die one day anyways.” There are a couple of other problems, but for the sake of the comment, I’ll focus on this one. I feel all the hopes that I have will never actually happen. I’m losing hope. If you feel you have no hope, but you find yourself in counseling by your own regard, doesn’t that mean you have some ounce of hope in you? If you make the trek to go to the counselors office every week/day/month doesn’t that mean some part of you wants to live? I find myself, more often than not, only wishing that I would die. Killing myself seems strange, but I most definitely wish a truck would plow through my window and leave my entrails strewn along the walls. So far that hasn’t exactly panned out for me. I know that I have a problem. However I don’t find myself wishing to do anything about it. Is suicide bad? If someone is “keeping” you alive or “forcing” you to stay alive, and you do it, are you really being oppressed by someone, or are you making the conscious decision to not end your life any chance you get? I don’t think anyone truly wants to kill themselves. (There may be someone out there) I haven’t heard of anyone who is having such a hard time killing themselves that they feel they are being kept alive by someone against their will. If you wake up in the morning and aren’t instantly trying to hang yourself, then you aren’t truly suicidal. You still have hope, a very small amount of hope, but hope nonetheless. Is keeping someone alive a crime? No because somewhere deep deep deep down they don’t want to die either. The instinctual part of their brain is screaming at them to stay alive as long as possible to make a new human. If you truly aren’t dissatisfied with your life, and are actually content, and you still find yourself wanting to die, then sure, kill yourself. However, if you are depressed in any way and you find yourself wanting to die, then yes, you are mentally unstable. You have unclear judgement, and someone should help you.

    • Anonymous says:

      Not so long ago homosexuality was also considered an illness. So we will get there, hopefully. I really don’t understand what’s the big deal with this. We are going to die anyway, and nobody chose to be here. We were just brought to the world. I started to feel like I wanted to be dead when I was 17. I’m almost 39. “Oh, it will go away”. When? Do I have to go 20 more years of misery? I don’t have a family, nor I want one, of course. Every time I see someone with a kid I feel sorry for them. It makes me realize that I live life differently. Any person who thinks like me, or has felt like me, couldn’t bring a life into this world. Also, we tend to think this is like in the movies. Where you try to do something and in 90 minutes, things change. Guess what, they don’t. I don’t want more jobs that I hate, I’m sick of the traffic, of uneducated and loud people, of political bullshit, of the fucking money, I don’t want to chase jobs I hate to pay the rent, etc. And I might be the minority here. I’ve traveled to over 30 countries, I live in a really nice place, I drive a nice car and my life is pretty much solved financially. Still, i can’t stand life. I don’t think it’s worth the effort. We just assume that we have to like this. Well, some of us, don’t.

      When somebody is with an abusive husband, we don’t tell them, it’s not that bad, it’ll get better. Just hang on. Maybe next month he’s gonna give you some love. Then, he will make you miserable for another two years. Or when someone can’t stand a job, we never tell them to stay there, right? But with life… ding! There something called religion. So we can’t accept it. I think it should be encouraged and facilitated.

      It’s not that we don’t want to die. We don’t have the balls. And of course my family is going to be devastated. I know that for a fact. I’m not delusional. But… do I have to be miserable because of them? for life?

    • Aiah Z says:

      Jacob, you’ve presented here a running catalog of your opinions. Others can feel radically differently, just as they can about many other aspects of life. You aren’t the judge of “mentally unstable” for anyone other than yourself. Be satisfied deciding on whether you yourself feel justified in concluding you want to live or not. Telling someone else she’s unstable and cannot make decisions for herself isn’t going to convince anyone else to live her life the way you believe she should.

  128. m.m.mokhtar says:

    solid and true statement

  129. m.m.mokhtar says:

    and in addition why do others want you to live in torture and no dignity life ? either they help you or leave you alone

  130. m.m.mokhtar says:

    the very interesting point you said death is pain , how did you find that ? and what kind of pain is it? thanks

  131. Anonymous says:

    many of the people, Myself included, did talk to counselors, suicide prevention, so called family and friends, read books etc…but the pain didnt stop, the hurt doesnt vanish, the temporary thought as you claim, isnt at all temporary. Most have years of the above solutions and they all failed with one thing left… i know some day in my near future my suicide will be my solution.

    • m.m.mokhtar says:

      I think you do not need to consult any body because you are the best one to judge yourself , for a word of truth life is becoming really boring

    • nolove says:

      I feel like I’m in the same mindset as you. But for me I’m not sure what’s going to happen moment to moment.

    • James R Gorsh says:

      I whole heartedly understand.

    • Kayla says:

      I can’t remember a time not being severely depressed and I’m 30. To me it’s more of just being to exhausted to figure it all out anymore. You can reach out to me if you want to chat though. And not in a save you kind of way but more in a “this is is all bullshit let’s compare life notes” kind of way

    • David W says:

      I couldn’t agree more. Some people’s life is nothing but pain, disappointment, more pain and then a little extra pain on the side. Dosent matter what tyou of pain it is whether mental or physical or both.

      For some, true happyness or true nothingness will only come at death. I’d be more than happy with either ending..

  132. Kimberly says:

    The right to die is personal and should be respected.

  133. Anonymous says:

    I’m 60. Alone. No money in savings and nothing for retirement. I am in a job I hate doing part time work. Who is going to take care of me when I get sick and can no longer work? A state run nursing home. Guess what I do for a living! I work as a CNA. I know the lack of staff.

  134. Lucy says:

    Being one that would embrace death with open arms if it was possible quickly and painlessly, being one that “survived” a suicide attempt… I will always, and have always, been a strong advocate of individual choice, it’s no one else’s right to deny another the right to die, under any circumstance, I do not care how subjectively poor a reason you may think it is, nobody is required to remain alive simply because you think they should… so yes, I am 100% in favor of assisted suicide, no matter the reason.

  135. Jason says:

    Four years ,five suicide attempts ,two counselors and im still not better im 13 now

    • Tara Brannelly, MD says:

      I’m assuming you have chronic depression. You feel that the precipitants to your state are non-existent or inadequate, and you might be right. You need to see a competent, compassionate psychoanalytically oriented psychiatrist who hopefully will have enough skill and experience to help you. He or she needs to be well trained in “biological” treatments for depression as well as psychological ones. Undoubtedly, you have been on anti-depressants. If you have tried four with no effect, it’s time to move on to TMS (trans magnetic stimulation) which has a good track record. The other option is ECT (electroconvulsive therapy)-which is by far the most effective treatment for depression. It has been around since 1930, and in the old days, treatment was barbaric. It has been re-worked over the last 15 years such that memory loss and other complications are minimal.

      Ketamine infusions are currently somewhat popular, but I don’t think they work so well for major depression. They may work better for bi-polar depression.

      Good luck and take care.

      BTW: what was done to the patient in, “One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest,” was NOT ECT. It was a procedure used in the 1930’s and 40’s to remove sections of the patient’s frontal lobes. It was usually done on schizophrenics, but. It always Ieft the patient largely unresponsive and dull. It is illegal now and has been for some decades.

      President Kennedy’s elder sister Rose received the treatment because she was considered to be “rambunctious.” It is not clear what illness, if any, she had.

  136. Rethink says:

    Stacy, I just stumbled upon this again, while contemplating this possibility more and more, and I couldn’t disagree more with the “evidence” supporting this article.
    Perhaps the most valid point here would be a statistic which states that 90% of people who attempt suicide don’t die that way….. I went and clicked on the link at it gives an error. Presupposing this to be correct, is it fair to deny even that 1 out of 10? Also, is it not possible that if some other health condition didn’t come up first, they wouldn’t eventually choose this method of death?
    Second, the circular logic that supports the argument that 90% of people who commit suicide have some sort of mental health issue just seems ridiculously based upon self-serving assumptions, and highly questionable. Can you deny that there IS A SELFISH BENEFIT to the mental health industry to keep someone alive that might not want to be? It could even be argued that this is a form of torture, and there are very well written articles that make this case! I clicked on the link to find NO OBJECTIVE evidence of this!!!! I actually have a degree in Mathematics, and I have seen how easy it is to skew numbers and only include evidence that supports finding in research.
    Is it really beyond the realms of possibility that the psychiatric/psychological industry is perpetuating a myth that many in the population would love to support in order to make money at the expense of someone else’s suffering?
    There are so many ways to ask questions and to create bias in these “studies” that you have to question at least some of the objectivity of them.
    I recently read a list of fallacies, and one I thought was quite revealing was the Psycologist’s Fallacy seen here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychologist%27s_fallacy
    You can also look up regression fallacy, or even a little bit of Retrospective Determinism. Have these studies ever been cross-examined, and challenged? I clicked on that second link and they have a convenient disclaimer that this research is a “work in progress” which begs how seriously you can take them. Can you legitimately counter the argument that retrospective determinism is a fallacy that is just widely embraced in this research that states so many that commit suicide are “mentally ill”? If mentally ill means imperfect, then everyone in the world is mentally ill, so how many other rights/freedoms are we going to take away?
    I just cannot understand what gives some “expert” the right to impose their beliefs on someone when the basis is so questionable, self-serving (you can’t deny that psychologists make money off of people they call “mentally unstable”), and yet so weak in pure measurement objectivity. I hear this self-sustaining faulty logic all the time, and am baffled at how few actually question it! “If you are considering ending your life, then you are mentally unstable. If you are mentally unstable, then any perspective of yours has to be questioned.” Yet WHO, and by WHAT MEASURE are they deemed “mentally unstable”? By some norm in society’s perspective is in disagreement? As you mention, life is in constant flux, and so are the perspectives of this society! Hence I really think it is a slippery slope calling someone mentally unstable.
    There are times when someone has truly evaluated the pros and cons of living vs dying, and if one has no dependents, should have EVERY RIGHT to terminate this existence. We weren’t asked if we wanted to be here. Sometimes there are financial pressures that weigh on people’s decisions, and they logically don’t want to be a burden on others. There can be LOGIC to this decision, and in my experience, I have seen more logic on the side of those contemplating this gruesome scenario than many in the psychological community that constantly produce self-serving, weakly supported “research”, yet agree in masses because IT BENEFITS THEIR PROFESSION with the research.
    Please, at least acknowledge the potential for bias in this. If there really is measurable evidence that only 10% continue to commit suicide, well, that might be a somewhat valid indicator, but there are even flaws with that. I wish all psychologists and psychiatrists had to have all their work cross-checked with the list of common fallacies, because I think this profession would be MUCH IMPROVED.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Rethink,

      Thank you for your thoughtful comments. I’m learning, perhaps belatedly, that my participating in this debate does little good, so I will observe the process with curiosity and receptiveness. In the meantime, I want to share with you a couple things. One, this article will probably interest you: Mental Disorder and Suicide: A Faulty Connection, by Saxby Pridmore (2015). I’m linking to a PDF version through ResearchGate; be warned that those articles can disappear at any moment.

      I also want to thank you for letting me know of the faulty link, which I have replaced with the current URL. I alone run this website while working full time as a professor and psychotherapist, so I regrettably don’t have the time to check all the links. I appreciate when people let me know that one is out of date.

      Thanks, and I look forward to reading your further contributions to this debate.

    • Alexander says:

      Rethink —

      A few more thoughts.

      The 1990s and 2000s were glorious decades to be a psychiatrist. It seemed as though each year several new, potentially life-changing medications were brought to market. Options became available to tackle long-standing, treatment-resistant disorders. It did not hurt that big pharma had deep pockets to promote the new offerings. Stigmas were falling, more people were seeking help than ever before, and just about any psychiatrist could brag about patients who, with the right medication and a little time, returned looking more confident and reporting fewer symptoms.

      Today the shine has DIMMED…. The mental health of the nation may have even declined in the past 20 years. This trend is what Thomas Insel, former director of the National Institute of Mental Health, calls one of the “inconvenient truths” of mental illness. Suicide rates per 100,000 people have increased to a 30-year high. Substance abuse, particularly of opiates, has become epidemic. Disability awards for mental disorders have dramatically increased since 1980, and the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs is struggling to keep up with the surge in post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD).

      The most discouraging assessment came in 2013 from an in-depth analysis by the U.S. Burden of Disease Collaborators. Hundreds of investigators gathered data on 291 diseases and injuries between 1990 and 2010. Combining premature death and disability to calculate the burden of each disease, they found that the toll of mental disorders had grown in the past two decades, even as other serious conditions became more manageable.

    • akaisha says:

      I agree with you from first hand experience I’m 25 and have been miserable my whole life went to the mental ward 4 times and all of those times they did nothing for me except leave me in a room with a bunch of other mentally ill people and ignore us all and come around to pass out medications 2 of the times I was sent their by the police, once by a family friend and once by myself they also lie saying if you admit yourself your free to leave at anytime that is bullshit they kept me there for 2 weeks and offered no help to me at all. they didn’t believe me when I told them I believe I was drugged (my relatives dad dealt drugs and had been sleeping over at our house) I demanded blood and urine to prove drugs were in fact in my body they refused later I got the tests no drugs present but that relative also started acting crazy at the same time as me and soon their dad disappeared after an argument about drugs being found in the bathroom trash can by another family friend after using the bathroom. so does it sound coincidental? I think not but of course they didn’t believe me nor help me they wanted money and used me a guinea pig and fed me medications that drove me nuts I’m better since I stopped using meds from them in fact I had been taking meds prior for about 3-4 weeks because I told a dr I was depressed they didn’t care to ever talk to me just write me a prescription yet never diagnosed me even with a mental illness I’m currently applying for social security because I have a lot of issues but I’m being postponed because I have no diagnosis from a doctor despite being hospitalized and on meds twice in my life, I began seeing a therapist she was a waste of time I stopped going to her and went to a counselor who also wasted my time they try to talk in a calm voice to me but ask me the same questions every time I go ummm hello are you even listening to me at all? I had 4 or 5 appointments with the first and 3 appointments with the second all of which provided me no help, support or comfort when I was being abused by a relative I called and emailed the counselor asking her for help and she didn’t help me I thought they were mandated reporters? oh I get it you cannot talk to me unless I’m at an appointment and you know you can bill my insurance otherwise I’m a waste of her time obviously. she proved it also by calling my relative and asking them to get a hold of me because I had no phone at one point and when I called all she wanted to know was if I was going to be moving back into town and did I know my insurance was being cancelled soon and if I wanted to remain a patient I needed to figure that out. so yes they do not care about us and us being alive all they care about is that they can bill us or our insurance and gain a profit from the pharmaceutical industry to the doctor to the nurses etcetra that’s all they care about is that they need us alive and miserable for the rest of our lives so they can continue to generate a stable income for themselves. one mans trash is another mans treasure well one mans miserable life is a doorway for a successful comfortable life of another who capitalizes of his misery.

    • Peter says:

      I think people classed as having a mental illness are likened to the psychology theory of people having a functional role/being able to function in society. This is a core objective of psychiatrists and specialist counsellors and the thought of not being functional is both abhorrent and considered by them a failure.

      This being the case, similar to other fields where someone has a vested interest in their career or “selling” something (be it a message or item) you do have to take what a qualified professional says with a grain of salt. They wouldn’t have a job if it was as simple as just letting people who want to loll themselves go. It would do them out of a job!

      A lot of people classified as wanting to die because they have a mental illness is more palatable than accepting the reality – and that is that some people SHOULD be allowed to go. If that’s their choice.

      Sorry Stacy mate – what you are selling I am simply not buying.

  137. Abby says:

    I think suicide is okay. No one cares how you “live” your life until the moment you decide you don’t want to live it anymore. Say someone wants to die because life is strenuous and laborious. Constantly empty and doesn’t care to “better themselves”. Then let them leave. Clearly they don’t think being alive is worth anything so why keep them here to suffer? Fuck life in my opinion.

  138. Mike says:

    I don’t believe all suicides can be or should be prevented. Can a person learn to cope with mental pain or stress? Yes. Is that always a positive thing? Consider someone with chronic physical pain. Can they learn to cope? Probably, especially if they have external help such as pain killers. Is that a positive outcome, merely coping with the.pain? Most other people would not object to the person in pain saying “no”.

    • Suizou says:

      Precisely, Mike. Thank you. How long “should” I continue with chronic, debilitating degenerative physical pain on top of lifelong chronic depression? I’m going on my 46th year and have given each one of those years my very best effort. Is there a trophy for most days accumulated? Nope. The medical industry, however, benefits greatly from each day I remain here.

  139. Anonymous says:

    Just as there is the right to live, so there ought to be the right to die. If someone is unhappy with their life and that over the years there was no improvement, then why should one prolong their torment?

  140. Matt Crawley says:

    Death is pain… I’d like to avoid that as long as possible…

  141. joe says:

    I wanted to commit suicide because I don’t have a girlfriend and feel I am not good enough for women I have seizures and irritable bowel syndrome can’t work on disability i can make 800.00 working but hard to find jobs that won’t hire me.I have a friend that wants to line me up with someone which is awesome don’t hurt the ones that do love you

  142. Nina says:

    I simply want to die. Why bother with life it’s boring anyway.

  143. Anonymous says:

    No I am a schizophrenic and have been suffering for 10 years nothing changes my family life is ruined and it is not getting any better. It is easy to be healthy and pass judgement on people and it’s quite a different story to live it and continue living a horror story for rest of ur life…

    • Brittany says:

      I deal with schizophrenia your not alone <33333, i know how you feel it is so hard and tormenting but take heart the Creator overcame the world <333 I am living proof of being alive i almost killed myself many times because of that thing.xoxoxoxo please dont think about killing yourself it is not worth it and I do not want anyone killing themselves. I am here to talk to anyone. heres my email jesuscaresforyou777@yahoo.com

  144. Anonymous says:

    No, not always. Sometimes there is no one to prevent it, and that itself is reason enough to have no reason to live.

  145. Anonymous says:

    No…if someone wants to die let them. It’s a free country and no one has the right to tell them they can’t die!

  146. I get rather sick of this ‘it’s only temporary’ cliche, people who say that have no idea, they are smug and condescending and wish to minimise the reality that there are people whose lives really are ongoing misery.

    I am 63 now, I have had 3 serious suicide episodes, I recall the first major one when I was about 23, I remember thinking I would either die and that would be fine my suffering would end, or I would live and people would acknowledge my pain, offer me friendship and support and things would improve, so either way it was a good idea – how naive I was….nobody gave a damn, the doctors at the hospital virtually ignored me, nurses treated me like a nuisance, they couldn’t get rid of me quick enough.

    A while later I visited a GP, when I told her I had been in ‘ward 6’ for a week after taking an overdose of sleeping pills she was abusive and told me she would never prescribe anything to me again, the few relatives I had were sarcastic and indifferent, I had no friends.

    Anyway I decided to give things another go, found a new job, sadly I was forced to continue to live with my abusive husband because I had a kid and nowhere to go, I even managed to form a separate life from him so limited his ability to abuse me, then I realised he might kill me in my sleep, he would never have dared do anything while I was awake because I would have flattened the little worm, I worked nights so I slept in the day and really believe he might put a hammer through my head.

    Anyway decided to move in with another man, we had had sex together few times, I didn’t want him but he had a house so it was somewhere for me to go and I was prepared to make an effort.

    As soon as I got there I knew he would never be any use but I gave life the best shot I could and made the best of it.

    He was a major passive aggressive and took pleasure in rejecting me and my son, again nowhere to go so had to accept it eventually when my son was 10 I was able to leave, I truly hoped I could finally find a real partner, I lived on a benefit which was virtually impossible so I was still dependent on my ex for money, another suicide effort, this time I had no delusions of anything and had learnt from previous failed attempts and thought I had done a better job.

    I was unconscious alone for a week, when I started to come round I had very frightening hallucinations and I didn’t remember what had happened.

    Crawled to a phone and was taken to hospital, said I must have had an accident because I did not remember, it gradually came back to me, and I am sure the hospital knew but they weren’t interested so I didn’t say anything, again they couldn’t get rid of me quick enough.

    As I had no-one a hospital ‘social worker’ drove me home, she waited outside with the engine running so I could go in and put clothes on and give her the hospital gown back, she left without one word of concern even though I was obviously still under the influence of the drugs I had taken and had other injuries, so I was left ill and alone.

    Yet again I decided to see if I could create a life so I moved and got a new job, hounded out of that for being stupid enough to report sexual harassment, abandoned by everyone, destroyed in court this time I did a double, drugs and hanging, today realised that was 20 years ago, I have not had a happy day in over 30 years, if ever, a good day for me is one where nothing really bad happens.

    I am now dependent on my 2nd husband for my home and income, I hate him but I have developed strategies for limiting his control, he lives in another town but comes here whenever he feels like it, we had a sexless marriage (his choice not mine) but at least he has never tried that.

    Until about 10 years ago I still thought I might find someone but I have not been touched for over 20 years, it is an awful way to live.

    This realisation it was 20 years since my failed hanging, losing my job, savings (scum lawyers stole that) home, yet again I moved and tried again, maybe in time I would find love, friends ….but unsurprisingly that has never happened, I live a marginalised, isolated existence.

    At 63 I am still working but have nothing, as a non-citizen I have no entitlements to any support anywhere so once I can’t work I starve, my only hope is for my ex to die.

    I so wish I had died in a previous attempt, misery for many people is not temporary, do not allow people to lie to you. For many there is no such place as ‘rock bottom’ there is ways farther to fall, sometimes life is so bad that anything worse is unbearable.

    If I was to name the biggest single failure it was being unable to attract a partner who would like (maybe even love) me, we evolved to pair bond and, despite what some people say (they’re lying) we need a partner.

    • M.C. says:

      I understand. My life has been hell. Im 37 no children. No real love interest constant monetary set backs. Everything I’ve tried to do to improve has back fired. So yes people don’t understand.

    • nolove says:

      I’m 40. Never been married and I have no children. Most of my relationships never made it pass 3 months. They would just break up with me and tell they just want to be friends. Every attempt to make my life better has failed. No love interest whatsoever. Tired of being disappointed by life and heartbroken by love. I sit here thinking about taking pills and washing it down with alcohol. I tried talking about it with a close friend but he doesn’t fully understand. I’ve been dealing with this for way too long. I can’t take another failed relationship or failed attempt at life.

    • akaisha says:

      Hi I read your story I’m 25 but your story is very similar to my life and ive felt it wont change and seeing your in your 60s and still miserable I guess my intuition was right. I too have been to the mental ward 4 times so I know how that feels and no one wanted to pick me up so I took a cab home once maybe twice cant remember if i was picked up the 1st time and the bus another time. I also know the doctors and nurses do not care about you at all just giving you meds and ignoring you the entire time I spent 2 weeks the last time I went but only 6 hours- 1 day the first time. I also have an abusive boyfriend he works nights so I get some time away from him and in the day hes mostly asleep but when he wakes up he puts me down and weekends he is the worst hes gotten better since he stopped drinking at the time the police was at our house every other week or week at that and sadly because of race they always blamed me even with him blackout drunk in front of them and over 20 beer cans present in our kitchen and our rooms they would say I have aggressive attitude or I’m loud because I’m black im sure which is racist because I’m a really quiet person. I’m also pregnant for the first time and these 7 months have been horrible my whole pregnancy is awful I had lost my insurance from moving the new county has taken months and still wont give me my insurance and I’m stuck going to a community clinic they have treated me like garbage make me wait 1-3 hours to see the dr when I have a appointment and the dr will talk to me for only 1-3 minutes -5 minutes if I’m lucky. I worry about the effect all of this will have on the baby at birth and growing up I know the abuse, medical neglect and police harassment and brutality will leave her with mental illness and I’m afraid also her dad is schizophrenic I found out after finding a doctors letter in his glove compartment he claimed it was a relatives when he snatched it from me and ripped it up and threw it into the trash well if it wasn’t yours why the crazy reaction over me seeing that someone else was nuts then? I knew that moment it was his paper he told me he will take his meds and he will change he has improved but I worry if he stops taking them or as he ages becomes senile since he is 16 years older than me and kill me or us. I depend on him because I do not work I had surgery last year for a break to my ankle on both sides and after a year since the injury I’m still limping and get swelling and pain in my foot, ankle and leg and I also don’t know how to drive and have no license I get anxiety when I try to drive and panic and I get very sleepy when in the car and don’t remember the rules of the road due to my poor memory and concentration skills. I have no family never have my mom didn’t want me after age 2 because my dad molested me and she told me as a teenager that I stole her man WOW! She passed 2015 as did my grandma who raised me in her place and was always verbally abusive calling me fat, ugly, telling me I stink or ho ever since I was about 5 she also bashed a chair into my back as a kid, hit me with stitches and pulled a knife to my throat and threatened to kill me but a family friend intervened and stopped her by jumping in front of me. I called the police they didn’t care said theyd arrest me because shes elderly and must have been in danger because I’m a heavy girl as a kid I called them they said no bruises no crime I had scratches they told me they will heal and I told a social worker who had came for an inspection I was hungry and being abused she didn’t care said theres kids living worse than me and at least theres something to eat I told her yes but I’m allergic to peanut butter and don’t know how to cook since that was what she’d bought they didn’t care. she later started buying food I could make but not for me but relatives when they moved with us later when they moved she stopped cooking and grocery shopping and would occasionally but I was old enough to feed myself. long story short because there is so much more to be said but I rather not I’m to tired and stressed out what advice would you give me? how has your miserable life affected your son? what can or should I do while I’m still somewhat young?

  147. Anonymous says:

    Im 11 and nothing good its chistmas eve

  148. Brek says:

    I’ve been feeling like I’ve wanted to die for a very long time now. I try to distract myself from it but the notion is always present in the back of my head. Friends, family, hobbies and doctors don’t help me at all. I’ve tried pretty much everything I could that’s supposedly anti suicide but it never really made me think any differently. Even when I go to sleep I’m plagued by dreams that don’t really bring any relief. It’s like constantly I find myself being told to kill myself by my conscious over and over again. I’m surprised I’m still alive to write this now. Before I was mentally depressed I weighed 180 pounds 5 weeks after that I dropped to 110 pounds reason being I was pretty much starving myself eating as little as a piece of toast every three days. I still weigh the same weight today even though my appetite is better then it used to be. People who see me me call me crack head/bulimic because I’m pretty much bone. Which is extremely hurtful to me, I never took part in either of those practices. The only drug I’ve used in my entire was marijuana. One of my family members have passed away and left me $8000 dollars im almost certain that I’m going to use that money for airline fare to the Netherlands and seek out euthanasia. What’s the point in living if it hurts to be alive? No one on my side could ever give me a answer.

    • Anonymous says:

      You may not be bulimic but anorexia yes have you been treated with meds yet

    • Joe says:

      It’s tough for a foreigner to be allowed euthanasia in another country, especially if it’s just for depression. You’d need to have a terminal illness. I recommend using the 8000 bucks you have to go travelling around the world you may just find inner peace and harmony, or someone who loves you, or whatever it is that makes you feel warm inside.

  149. Carla says:

    Recently, the moral status of suicide has been scrutinized by the poet and philosopher Jennifer Michael Hecht, in a book titled, Stay: A History of Suicide and the Philosophies Against It. Hecht wrote the book in the aftermath of two suicides—both victims were close friends and fellow poets. In essence, Hecht argues that suicide cannot be evaluated solely in terms of “personal autonomy,” as some modern ethicists might claim; rather, we must hold suicide up to the clarifying light of communal values. In an audiotape accompanying her book, Hecht argues that “When a person kills himself, he does wrenching damage to the community.” And this, surely, must be counted among the “moral harms” of deliberate self-destruction.

    I agree with Jennifer Hecht.

    The bottom line for me is that all of us, as part of a human community, must face and consider the enormous emotional toll suicide takes on those LOVED ONES who survive. We can empathize with, and respect, the tremendous pain that may drive some to suicide, and refrain from passing any harsh moral judgment on them… But we can also strongly encourage anyone who is suicidal to take some time to consider other options; to discuss his/her feelings with an empathic counselor or mental health professional; to avoid making an impulsive decision; to seek treatment for potentially reversible psychiatric problems; and–within the patient’s own system of values**–to discuss the effects suicide would likely have on friends, family, and loved ones!

    • Olufemi says:

      A particularly sick perspective. It is the stench of “communal values” that causes people to become suicidal in the first place.

    • Rethink says:

      I am sorry, but I don’t see how you can “empathize with, and respect the tremendous pain” that someone contemplating such possibilities might be going through if all that is thought of is “Loved ones”. How do you know that people considering suicide haven’t tried the things you propose, and those very people haven’t failed miserably? Don’t you think in many cases the person considering suicide hasn’t mentioned this to loved ones and those very people have selfishly ignored opportunities they had to help with a situation?
      The only exception in which I do believe one has a responsibility to continue on, is when that person has dependents. You brought someone into this world, and you do have an obligation to them. How can you expect someone to suffer on and on and on, just so someone else doesn’t have to go to a funeral? Isn’t that inflicting pain on the person suffering? I am just having a hard time seeing the genuine empathy, and respect for someone’s situation who may legitimately just be better off at peace. Keep in mind, that many times those who are contemplating, or carrying out the suicide have been ROUTINELY let down by that “community” Hecht seems to describe. Has she ever been to a state of desperation that those considering suicide are at, or is she just philosophizing? Sure, there are effects, but to make others in the community such victims all the time seems very short-sighted, and isn’t a perspective that really should be given much weight without further inspection. Often those in the community have made many many contributions to such a decision, and DO hold SOME (not all) responsibility. They aren’t always victims, and if they truly care about the person, should consider the pain that is being lifted off of the shoulders of the deceased.

    • Amelia says:

      Hecht was interviewed by Krista Tippett on her radio show/podcast, On Being. If interested, see link below:

      https://onbeing.org/programs/jennifer-michael-hecht-suicide-and-hope-for-our-future-selves

    • Peter says:

      What loved ones? Carla gave up to it you are going to die anyway and they have to face it. I would rather my 6 year old see me pass in a long sleep than have to live with a jibbering wreck post stroke

    • J W says:

      “But we can also strongly encourage anyone who is suicidal to take some time to consider other options; to discuss his/her feelings with an empathic counselor or mental health professional; to avoid making an impulsive decision; to seek treatment for potentially reversible psychiatric problems; and–within the patient’s own system of values**–to discuss the effects suicide would likely have on friends, family, and loved ones!”

      Ok. So what about the people that HAVE done that, for like….20 years? Not all mental health-problems are reversible. I’ve thrown tens of thousands of dollars over the course of two decades at various treatments. I literally bankrupted myself and spent every ounce of energy I had trying to get better, genuinely believing that I could get better…but I actually got worse.

    • Liz says:

      Um…”friends, family, and loved ones”?

      You realize if I actually had any of those at any time in my life, I wouldn’t be contemplating suicide now. Without exaggeration, no one wants to be my friend. I don’t make the cut. No one wants me in their life (and in my condition, I can’t fairly say I blame them). My own family abandoned me when I was desperately ill. No children, no pets. No job. And don’t even get me started on therapists–I can’t afford one. I could literally die today, and no one would know about it until the stench of my rotting body gave me away.

      Yes, social isolation like this exists, and may persist even when the individual is extremely proactive in trying to overcome it. You’re lucky you have such a well-connected life you can’t even conceive of this.

      So tell me again about the toll my death would take on someone. I’d like to know, for real.

  150. Anonymous says:

    I suppport the idea that if a person wants to die, it’s their decision and theirs alone. No group or government has any right to tell me or anyone else what to do with my/our bodies, and anybody who believes otherwise is a damned fool.

    Honestly? Pharmacies should start handing out nazi pills. Maybe require a thick stack of papers or something to be signed beforehand to make it “legal.”

    Some advice to you teens graduating from highschool: the whole ‘best years of your life’ schpiel is true; enjoy it while you can. Cuz if you don’t have any plans or connections afterwards, you’re basically screwed and you can thank our high and mighty government and hypocritical society both for it.

  151. Zack says:

    I often wonder if the people who write these articles truly know the pain of what people like me and others who contemplate suicide. Maybe it’s my cynical way of thinking, but I’m tired of reading, “Things can always change and life can always get better” in articles like these. It’s a painfully generic and conventional way of thinking by society that isn’t a solution to our own individual problems and pain we are each facing.

    I would love to have a positive perspective of living as much as the next person, but we need more unique ways of treatment for suicide that are specific to the person’s individual pain and not viewing everyone as the same.

    • nobody says:

      thank you zack. indeed the author being a therapist once again reaffirmed to me why it is hard for me to imagine them even beginning to help me. lets say that they can’t understand what it’s like, do they also lack all reason and imagination? more importantly they don’t respect the people they purportedly want to help? i mean, unless we are talking about children and adolescents, most of these comments, in their obviousness and oversimplification, are for many people actually are disrespectful, even offensive? heck they could even be akin to emotional abuse in some cases (in a gaslighting kind of way). they can’t even bother to consider maybe we have tried to live by and believe all of those things and they don’t work, or we ran out of fuel waiting for a positive change. especially at my age/disabilities/achievements/courage/education/career/achievements. I don’t mean $ or superficial aspects like that but my life in itself is testament to me having been a person who is resourceful, persistent, hardworking and capable of positive attitude and hope – else it would not be possible to be who I am/where I am today. it is not only disrespectful but also irrational to not consider I would have already had or encountered each and every idea in these “N things …” lists and thought them M times over (where M is > 1000^N) – what does it say that with despite proven record of ability to get things done, giving the situations and my inner attitude time to show any improvement, given that I have given daily consideration of suicide for three decades, multiple times daily for 15 years (chronic pain onset) and still not done it but I am saying that this is it, I am unable to find any solution but to fold this hand I was dealt? either they are wrong, or they are implying that I am a liar or fraud. yeah, you’re saying there are these simple solutions and I was somehow not using them, instead choosing to live an endless nightmare. if even real, how bad could my my pain and suffering have been if I didn’t try to alleviate them, but instead consider ending my life?

      these discussions and ‘treatment’ need to absolutely be individual, like you said. not all suicides are irrational, or even things to be sad about – factors that led to it sure, but not the suicide itself.

      ironic that they have a problem with that cliche with the ‘permanent solution’? excuse me, what part of not existing any more is not a solution to the problem of unbearable existence? perhaps the more unpopular aspect of this we need to consider is “a permanent solution” of any sort is not in the interest of the author and her ilk. if we don’t need them any more in the event of finding any permanent solution.

    • Abby says:

      Yessss! You understand. ♡

    • Paul says:

      Zack, to put it in simple terms those people that say things such as life will get better and so forth are thinking in terms of them self and not you or anyone else. The reason they say it is something called projection, they are projecting their feelings of life and death on other people. They do this thinking that it will help the problem, but what most people fail to realize is that none of the people on the planet think exactly the same. Also there are many broken people, and not all of them are thinking of suicide.

      Keep in mind that normal in psychological terms means that they are somewhere in the middle when it comes to abnormal psychology. The people who do best in the world are psychopaths, as the feelings of others and projected feelings of others have no effect on them. At the other end are people that are very attuned to the feelings of others and they are so empathetic that they are a threat to their own life as death is better to them than living in such a hurtful world. Normal people are able to function in society and exist somewhere in the middle of those two extremes.

      Also the only way that you are likely to have a positive outlook is on a few things that you know and love well. Things such as certain hobbies, or working a certain kind of job or a position in a company, etc. In other words you will have a positive outlook towards a certain thing or things, but not the world as a whole.

      I hope that this explains why some say the things that they do that are so hurtful, as I constantly have people that do the same thing. They live in a world in their mind that is completely separate from the world that I and others live in. Could say that they live in the world of illusion created by people thousands of years ago called religion. They do not see that people are telling the truth when they talk about the world be it Malcolm X, Ron Paul, Trump, Richard Dawkins, Stephen Hawkins, Alan Greenspan, Richard Feynman, or even Jesus Christ. If someone is talking and it does not fit in with their delusional world view they think that they are lying and that they are a fanatic. Also there is little that you, me or anyone else can say that can help them to see the world as you, me and everyone else that feels what is going on in the world is seeing (as they are blinded by delusion).

  152. m.m.mokhtar says:

    the world is corrupted enough , i made my own survey , about 90% of all i approached want to quit life for it is only sufferings and pains they said , but no one dared to take action because they simply scare the consequences , i am inclined to justify the support of the action legally if it is really impossible for one to live , we are not free anyway to take our life because we did not choose our birth in the first place , in terms of religions , socials and law we can not argue to let them accept such a commitment , but to make a piece of fun, who wants to live in this hard world with its all ridiculous obligations ?, and i noticed that most of the ones calling to decline sucide out of bravery are the first ones to welcome death in dignity and let go , indeed we should help those who are extremely desperate by offering them a solution if we can not do that then why do we unnecessarily keeping them to suffer ?, let them go may be they will find solutions and better life , i mean this decision is not taken lightly , the best person to know his status is the person himself let us respect their choice , i think we should pray too much to god for a redeem before one go to death in humiliation , high morals are not achieved in this life so far , enough deception , any route of thoughts that will not harm the others is logically tolerated , i am feeling really very very sorry for all who wrote their sad stories and i just want to tell them you had more than enough if it is your decision to let go just have a final look before you are committed and if there are no hopes then may be you can let go without regrets

  153. Someone Somewhere says:

    Leave them alone, let them die with some dignity (which is why I support euthanasia and assisted suicide of course) for goodness sake since they apparently couldn’t find any dignity being amongst the living. At least bother LISTENING to what they have to say (as opposed to simply hearing their words) instead of throwing tired cliches at them in which many make absolutely no sense on any level of basic logic, but it’s extremely rare to find anybody that actually does. I mean, don’t get me wrong, I think it’s extremely sad when minors (since they didn’t really give life a chance) or parents (because they abandoned their children) commit suicide but I mean if you spend every decade, year, week, day, hour in misery and/or incurable sickness, nothing makes up for it, you cannot afford to live or if you can it’s all moot because all your time and energy is gone once you DO earn it and there’s nothing going for you nobody should make you feel bad about cashing out early.

    I think the anti-suicide and pro-self esteem movement irritates me a lot because of the simple fact that they’re empty, hollow and not based on ANYTHING. Essentially nobody is allowed to face their own flaws and shortcomings; we have to wait for others to. People (especially children) are lied to from birth, told that they can “do anything they set their mind to so long as they work hard and never give up” and for some people this is true… but for those like me who are borderline-retarded and simply can’t and work hard only to end up exhausted for a whole lot of nothing, we’ve had the rug pulled from underneath. I angrily grit my teeth whenever someone calls someone else “lazy” or tells them “if I can do ____ you can too!” We all have different abilities and different levels of said abilities, and in this overpopulated sphere of god-crap floating in space, sometimes “our best” just isn’t enough. At least societies like feudal Japan had the guts to tell people they need to commit ritual suicide if they weren’t “good enough” and were “dishonorable” and actually mean it instead of this soft, fake smarmy crap they have today telling people they’re “perfect just the way they are” and everyone getting a “participation trophy” only to have that all slap them back in the face twice as hard once they face the real world. They want people to live on not because they actually CARE about anyone that’s suicidal but people always need SOME sort of scapegoat right? It’s just like how the bully doesn’t actually want the receiver of their harassment to die… if so, who would be their mark right? Society says don’t kill yourself and you can be as miserable as you feel, just don’t disturb the rest of the workers on the sweatshop floor with your crying and angst.

    I apologize for anything stupid I’ve said as this all is hard for me to articulate and I am far from an intelligent being… this is just my 2 cents.

    • PyroFalkon says:

      I never thought anyone would feel like I did. “Someone Somewhere,” you absolutely pulled the words out of my head. I don’t think you said anything “stupid” at all. It’s really brilliant, actually.

      I want to die. Life hasn’t gotten any better since I hit adulthood 15 years ago; it won’t in another 15. And I’ve heard tons of people tell me that my attitude is just a sign of “a pity party,” a phrase I absolutely loathe.

      If my shortcomings are my fault — and I’m open to the possibility they are — then doesn’t it stand to reason if I put a bullet in my head, I’ll be doing the world a favor? I’d get out of everyone else’s way, and my organs would go to someone who wants life infinitely more than I do. Seems win-win to me.

      ~PyroFalkon

    • Paul says:

      Actually you are correct I say this from an educated standpoint. We live in a fake society just as you stated. Problem is that most people are too as you put it retarded either because of their faith or mental blindness to the world around them. In fact I see as many people as insane in the basic definition of the term, that is they are disconnected and unaware of the world around them more so than a person doped up so much that they do not know what is going on around them.

      The key thing is that most people that are locked up as mentally a threat to themselves are the ones that are least able to ignore the pain that living in this form of society causes. I also remember a video by John Allee about Does Religion cause Insanity. Fact of the matter Faith is insanity, as it is believing things that go against all that can be proven and shown as fact of the real world.

      I put forward a question to think about God is all good, God is all powerful, God lets suffering occur in this world. In fact this is a false statement, but many try and prove it true. If God were all powerful and there is suffering, this means that God is NOT all good, and if God is all good then God is not all powerful. In fact this old saying mostly says that God just does not exist.

      Also I have noticed and others as well that those that are mostly afraid of dying when they are ill or quite old are those that have faith in God. They are the ones that think that there is a Heaven or Hell that awaits them when they die. It is rather ironic that those that many would think would have the most to look forward to in an afterlife are most afraid to go. In fact those that do not believe in an afterlife because they are Atheists are far less afraid of dying. They believe that when you die that is it, nothing after that. Personally I believe that it is somewhere in between based on the things that I have personally seen happen in my life that make no scientific sense.

      Just one thing that many are not aware of in the USA, UK, and some other countries our government sees us as Chattel, something to borrow money against for their national debts by the possession of our birth certificates. Why else would a country want people to exist that basically are unable to fully function to the point that they are able to fully enjoy life. To this I say it is better to be dead than a slave, and the only way that a society can counter such thoughts is to negate them with religion.

      There is the real world in a nutshell, simplified form.

    • Anonymous says:

      Try being the loved one of someone who committed suicide…your tirade is so naive. The majority of the time suicide is due to an untreated mental disorder. Those left behind suffer every single day. They suffer because we don’t acknowledge mental illness and stigmatize it as a society. You are the problem. I would never wish this kind of pain on anyone. I lost my life, my love due to this…and you are still alive and get to feel self righteous…

    • Someone Somewhere says:

      you are wrong anonymous. I HAVE lost people who are very near and dear to me to suicide. At least two of them were some of my best friends and though every day it does pain me on a personal level that they’re gone and I wish I could’ve helped them in any way even if it meant I wouldn’t sleep for over 24 hours, the fact remains that they are dead and at least they aren’t suffering anymore (I don’t buy “hell” of any sort either; just another thing to scare people away from thinking for themselves.) In fact, a few years ago I learned one of my uncles would frequently attempt suicide and because my family keeps me in the dark about EVERYTHING it’s possible he may have killed himself. Not knowing if he did or not torments me all the time too.

      I’m very sorry you’ve lost a loved one to suicide but my point is, from personal experience, it’s usually best not to assume things about others.

    • J W says:

      You actually come across as highly intelligent and articulate, and I enjoyed reading what you have to say. I agree with it all.

  154. tammy says:

    If people consider an abortion a womans choice because of the my body my choice then suicide should be the same because in abortion its not your body its murder of a living body inside yours. In suicide it is your body so should be your choice.

    • Paul says:

      I’m a guy and agree with you, and it is for this reason I have no children. Why would someone want to bring a child into the world when that child later when they become an adult are not fully in control of their body because it is basically not your own property.

    • Anonymous says:

      please abortion and suicide are not the same thing

  155. James G says:

    36 yrs of tearing down and rebuilding and tearing down and rebuilding……someone please make it painless

  156. Diana G says:

    Suicide is NOT automatically caused by a mental illness. 25 years of abuse, (even from strangers), debilitating chronic pain, disability that results in having to live on $700/month in which one can’t cover the BASIC life necessities like food, hygiene, shoes, etc. Burying 2 children, 2 Siblings, both Parents, 2 Husbands, literally being alone, being disfigured from symptoms of RSD, NO monetary help available….. There’s not enough room to post everything. I did attempt suicide & ended up on Life Support for 9 days. No I’m not happy I survived because short of a financial windfall my Hell will never get better. My 2nd Spouse died from Cancer December 21st & Son died Jan. 2nd from SIDS. My B-Day is on Christmas & I as usual have $6.41 for the rest of the month. (No food banks don’t solve the problem b/c people with medical conditions will also have dietary restrictions).
    I’m sitting in a dump roach infested apartment alone again & then another year comes and it starts all over again. Pain, grief, sadness, & being stereotyped / glared at because a large % of people falsely assume that I’m homeless/ have a drug history (RSD can cause tooth loss), then I’m treated like a cockroach. I’m a College educated retired EMT/ Medic.
    Well I don’t know what more to say….
    But thanks for reading this.

    • Paul says:

      I hear you, and not all of us automatically judge people just by appearance. As many in the world today are not able to do as well as we have in the past. It is things just as you say that make me wish that we all lived in a country that really did care about people and realize that life is more than just mere existence, and be willing to think about Maslow’s hierarchy of needs and realize that when people are not able to work it is not always because they are lazy, but because they are no longer able to do so mentally physically or both. Also for them to go on they need to have many needs met. There are some countries that treat people better than here, but they have been overwhelmed with migrants lately because of greedy people driving them there.

  157. Anonymous says:

    I’m tired

  158. AC says:

    I think we should be allowed to die if we choose. The mental health system sucks and you can’t even have honest conversation with your doctors about suicide without being doped up or locked away. You can’t talk to friends or family without them being afraid. Perhaps this is because people always assume living is best. If we can’t truthfully communicate our experience, because of the cultural discomfort of others, we are then further disconnected and isolated. The world is crooked and phony. I want nothing more from it.

    • Plus,if you think about it, being able to choose the when can be a perverse locus of control.

    • Brent F. says:

      Being alive is the worst gift imaginable. If it had a numeric value it’s the most negative number than can be stored in the computer. If I were omnipontent I’d go to my deity and demand that I get my money back. That is the main reason why I will go out of my way to never have sexual intercourse with another organism to the best of my ability for all eternity. I am dissatisfied with the product. Society tells a lie that the fact you are concious and alive is some sort of gift. I can’t imagine a gift any worse within the space of all nouns in the multiverse. It is dead last of things with a value. Even worse is the fact that killing yourself does nothing (a complete no-op) and you still continue to live forever and ever.

  159. Jennifer A says:

    I can’t remember a time when life was better than death. I’m apparently invincible, the only reason I haven’t tried again is that my children don’t understand that their lives would be better without me. I took 120 Xanax, 90 ambien, 170 baclofen, 75 soma, 100 80mg mscontin, and 40 30mg oxycodone, and 50 Phenergan. Yes, all at once.
    So, I realized I fail at even this.
    My children are 16, 17, 22. Soon they’ll understand that me being gone could only make their lives more joyful, relaxed, relieved, and then they’ll have my family that hates me, in their life.
    I know y’all have a knee jerk reaction and try to say the pain is temporary… well it’s not. There’s a few days I go without constantly thinking about it, but those are far and few between. I’m only waiting until they are old enough that it won’t break them. They’ll grieve for a moment, but I know they’ll get over it and understand.

  160. Chron says:

    I’m not sure I want to kill myself even though I tell everyone that I do. I think I’m just chronically unhappy and ungrateful. I think I’m a grown-up child who doesn’t really know how to correctly cope with my shitty life. I attempted suicide once before. I cut my wrist and wound up in a mental institution, but the therapy doesn’t really help that much. This may sound shallow, but I don’t think I would have this problem if I were very wealthy. I think if I had enough money I could at least distract myself from myself for at least long enough to die of old age.

    • Paul says:

      Keep in mind that you are correct, also death as you put it would not even be on your mind if you were wealthy. As a society (this society, not tribal) the way we kill and harm others in a socially acceptable manner is to make them poor, the less money that they have is the way that people are harmed in this society, and when the harm goes far enough they die.

  161. Paul says:

    You are wrong about people not able to understand that the world is mostly lies. Most people that understand how society functions in whole know this is simply a fact of life. Problem is that most people are unable to handle the fact that they are living a lie. Life did not start off this way, but has progressed this way as society has declined over many many years. There are times when society is improving and there is no need for lies to get people to contribute. One thing to keep in mind is that what we are going through now is nothing new, just new to us in this society and country. Rome, China, Greece and many other countries have gone through what we are now. However it hurts and we are not willing to admit life is getting harder for most people while a small minority are doing better than in the past. This is our standard of living. It is not your imagination, and to live in the moment you have to be aware of it. Don’t let the God will fix it crowd get to you, as they are part of the problem. If people do not work to solve problems, the problems do not go away but get worse till it all falls apart, then it will get fixed.

  162. Dale W says:

    Am I just spinning my wheels here. More proof that I am correct, in that there is no help for anyone who is truly disabled. It is pointless to ever even try. I have long been considering a hunger strike. May as well. I can’t afford to eat any more anyways. Also avoid fraudulent mental health abuse and exploitation, as hunger strikes are constitutionally protected form of protest under the first amendment to the Constitution of the USA.

  163. Larry says:

    It’s no longer emotional for me. I’ve been on my own for 7 years of my life. George Carlin talks a lot about luck, about how people are born with it. There are some people who have lots of luck, and others…

    I haven’t had any luck. I made a career for myself, moved away, started something with promise. All of it is meaningless, it’s all status, everything I own is just something to distract me from my real feelings.

    I’ve felt this way my whole life. I’ve put up a front ever since I moved away, because I didn’t and still don’t want anyone to know how I truly feel. People judge you a lot for saying you want to die, with good understanding.

    You know that feeling, when you’re loved by someone, and love yourself. I haven’t had that. I’ve had girlfriends, been “in love” before, but never, truly loved someone. It’s really depressing. Incredibly so.

    I don’t feel pity for myself, I don’t feel like I want to die because it’s the easy way out, I feel this way because I’ve tried so hard to succeed emotionally, physically, mentally. I’ve tried my whole life. I’m tired of trying. I’m tired of being tired.

    There’s going to be a point where I am no longer going to vent about this and take actions into hand. The only thing stopping me? My parents and siblings. I know it would irreversibly kill them to know I feel this way, and that I did what I did because I wanted to die.

    Please tell me there are people who feel the same. I can’t be alone…

    • Paul says:

      The only person you and others really only need to love and be loved by firstly is yourself. We all need to love ourselves more than anyone else to get enjoyment out of life.

      I hope that this makes sense to you, as we are not able to be really loved by others if we do not love ourselves first.

    • LarryCan you see me says:

      I want to understand you Larry. I just made this fake account to respond to you. I don’t want to be a cliche and say I get what you’re feeling/ going through, but. I feel a need to be around you or interact with you.
      I’m sorry.
      – English is not my native language. I wish i could see you.

    • chancerylane says:

      You are not alone. I feel the same.

      I have tried, tried, tried. In the end I got what I wanted, only to be struck down by a chronic illness, which is not serious enough for any organisation to have mercy on me.

      So my only option is to exist. The thing is; I don’t want to exist, I want to live, but I cannot.

      I had my fair share of happy, wonderful memories, and I am ready to go, but I don’t know how. All of the readily available options seem messy and prone to failure.

    • Anonymous says:

      You are not alone.

    • lila says:

      I feel that way every single day

  164. Dale W says:

    What about my situation? I have to die because I can no longer live without a lot of help. I am permanently disabled, physically, and there is no real help for the truly disabled in the USA. I am in so much pain all the time and have been treated so inhumanely that I will be better off dead. As I said, I have no choice. Continuing to live is an impossibility. I can no longer afford to live. Any attempt to get any kind of help has resulted in me being mistreated in some way. Health care professionals have strongly urged me to commit suicide, as they would rather I blow my brains out than have to treat my pain.

  165. Anonymous says:

    My mother shot herself in June 2011. Im 39 but she had spoken of suicide shortly after finding her father had committed suicide…Ive had down thoughts….always smoked pot n wouldnt take pharma drugs like my mom….this past january my wife was killed by an unlicensed driver…I dont wish to kill myself…I have 3 kids from a marriage that dissolved after my mothers death which left me incapable of functioning. But when my wife was killed I lost my mind. I lost my job. I lost my house…everything. They didnt charge the driver…but now I see…I see the desire to go home. The desire to be with my wife…if the afterlife is real Id rather be there…If its not then nothing is better or worse except for my kids…which keep me here….but why? My mom told us for years she kept me or one of my sisters around to prevent her killing herself…she wouldnt go to the store alone. I cussed her out n said then do it after years of hearing how much she wanted to…every drug in the country every dr available…even a pacemaker device to shoot happy drugs into her from her own brain…all the drugs did was mess her internals up…all her drugs would work a week then not…but her body felt the experimentation…maybe life just sux for some…if anyone else doesnt see it…but it does…as for me…Im not long here…I believe in God…humanity…but Im ready to take judgement and just be done with this test…my kids make it where I have to stay here…Im so fkn ready to check out…I dont have shit to give them anyway but a shadow of the man they know…you people talk about solutions…maybe its a mercy provided by the self

  166. Rian T says:

    Yes i feel similar to other comments, “suicides feeling are fluid” shows a blissful unawareness of the magnitude of the problem, and why so many people (the third biggest killer of men under 50) for example, chose to kill themselves. It is not done lightheartedly, as if there is another choice. Many i suspect are middle aged at least and have suffered for 30 or so years looking for an answer from their mental torture.The only reason people don’t do it or regret their decision after trying, is because they still have an element of hope there. This does not mean that their hope is logical. After 30 or 40 years of depression for example, i suspect that after that period of time, that the hope is misplaced, and if they have not found a cure after all that time at trying, that the hope is false, Of course no one wants to die, they would prefer their mental anguish to end, and the hope keeps them going. Just because people have survived suicide attempts, it does not mean they are happy or would not prefer to have died if this is how it remains for them. Hope keeps them going. In most cases regretfully, mental illness will not be cured if they have suffered for so many years, they will keep going and find ways to cope, often because of family/children they have. This is far different to being content or happy after suicide attempts.

  167. I really think you underestimate people. If a person wants to end it, they’re going to. No justification is going to help them – in fact, it may push them even further.

    • Jessica says:

      I absolutely agree with you as a lot of it describes me to a tee. I live for my children and my husband not for myself. If it weren’t for them I guarantee I wound not be here.

  168. Sofia says:

    I’ve been miserable since I was 8 years old Now 40 years old I lost my beloved Son I just want to die trying to find the easy way

    • Julie says:

      The loss of a child causes pain that’s indescribable. You are not alone. Please know that I am here to talk.

    • joseph1777 says:

      I have had depression for 40 years now and it has not gotten better but more so it has become worse over the years. It makes for a very miserable life. I have asked God for healing and though I believe He hears our prayers I have not been healed for whatever reasons He has in His will. Now I just ask for Him to take me home in my sleep. I dont feel much like living but I do not believe suicide is the right thing to do as it is considered ~killing~ which is against God’s commandments. That’s why I ask Him to make the choice for me. I feel mental illness and depression is the worst feeling one can experience. It is like your shadow and follows you every moment of your day. I would do anything to be free of this terrible illness

    • joseph1777 says:

      I am sorry that you grieve so much and it is understandable after what you have been through, I have suffered as well from major depression and it is the most awful thing I can think could happen to us. I pray for God to take me home. I do not want to suffer anymore. We only have God to put our trust and hope in. Gods love be with you my friend~

    • Anonymous says:

      I hate my life my family doesn’t care for me meaning I’m the least favorite my brother tells my friends untrue things about me and I lose most my friends because of it everyone makes fun of me because of my voice and I feel like a ghost that nobody even notices me

  169. Lucy says:

    Well no its not possible in reality. We live in a world of dualities and opposites that are forever bound to one another, no life without death, no happiness without suffering, no up without down. As for my own situation which you cannot ascertain I will only add that I am not opposed to suicide on any level which means every persons life is his.

  170. Tom Hal says:

    Stacey, please don’t take my comment as an attack, but after reading your recent comments (14 November…) it is clear to me that what I and others have suspected is “true” is enough so to justify our decisions not to engage the professional therapeutic community. It seems to me there are two camps present in this comment section, and this delineation is manifest just about everywhere–among lay and professionals–where right-to-die arguments pop up. On the one hand are those who are suffering–terribly and for decades–lives they just don’t want and which therapists haven’t been able to provide sufficient (if any) relief from. On the other hand are those who, for many different reasons, enjoy the luxury of deliberation–of hypothesizing and building abstract arguments and speculating. The former live-and-breathe suffering while the latter get to utter lines like, “It is one of the strange discoveries a man can make that life, however you lead it, contains moments of exhilaration; there are always comparisons which can be made with worse times: even in danger and misery the pendulum swings.”

    There can be no compromise, I think, where someone wants something for herself that is fundamentally a private and personal matter (like whom she loves or what she aspires to or when she is ready for life to end) and imperatives passed down by the state that circumscribe individual rights on how we exist (like banning affection among lesbians or preventing blacks from learning to read or forcing the suffering who wish to die to continually reevaluate the lives they don’t want and stay alive).

    And while I don’t at all mean to be cruel, the Greene quote has nothing to do with the decision to end one’s own life. That is an evaluative judgment, not a matter of empiricism. Unless cognitive neuroscience has since rigorously demonstrated a treatable global cause-effect molecular-cellular pathology uniquely responsible for suicidal ideation, at least for many of us the decision to leave life is a free response to our experiences of life, which are valid regardless others’ impressions of their own lives–and life in general.

    Nor should the possibility of abuse among some obviate the right of the rest of us to decide on our own lives, especially possibilities like the extreme circumstances you’ve outlined. Just as I have no business deciding for a woman whether she should or should not have a child, I do not see it as anyone else’s business how and when I die, so long as I am not a threat to others. Thank you for demonstrating to me just why participating in discussions like the ones in this comment section is fruitless, for me.

    I wish my country were advanced enough ethically to recognize my right to leave life in a legally and medically sound and compassionate way, but I won’t beg or argue anymore. Thankfully, I am able-bodied and can act as I see fit without seeking anyone else’s permission.

    • Bella says:

      I love you, Tom. I’m in similar shoes, but I think you SHOULD realize your potential to inspire. I feel like shit every single day, yet YOU made me feel a bit better. Thank you. You are loved.

  171. An art channel says:

    Suicide should NOT ALWAYS be prevented, as you’ve stated some people have temporary problems, or they feel stuck in a situation! However when the suffering is due to a total disconnect from the world and people, and if one lives his/her life without being able to communicate, share and contribute then suicide could be a way out! What’s the meaning of life if one cannot live it with others? Or even without others as we are all part of a big organismic system! I’m contemplating suicide and physician assisted would help me end the daily sufferings! It is very painful to see the world with your eyes wide open and your senses alert, while people simulate the “walking dead”

    • i no longer have a connection with any one in this world… i am drawn to some Thing beyond explanation… i encounter it during deeep sleep.. this world is All Lies, and Deception and Propaganda…. living the Lie is Too Painfull… no one seems to understand. .. I’ve told both my parents, in detail… and they were both too busy to put together any sort of response…. my dad actually stopped talking to me…. a year ago now. Daily life is pure suffering… rarely do i go a day without contemplating suicide. I know this world is some sort of training ground for souls, … there is no thing left for me here…

    • Paul says:

      Just because someone is totally disconnected from society does not mean that they should not be able to enjoy life, only thing is that when totally disconnected are they able to live as a hermit away from society and enjoy it? If true they really have no reason to want to leave their existence.

      Why must everyone live in a way that others say is normal, what about what is normal and feels right and is enjoyable for that person?

  172. mokhtar says:

    no body will encourage you to commit sucide simply because they do not feel the way you feel even they can understand you, life is too short wait for natural death because you do not know what is waiting you on the other side it may be worse than what you are suffering right now and i hope it will not be so, from your message i understand you are very sensitive person, awesome but you actually you did not find your proper enviroment, try to change your location even temporary you will discover new life and new ideas that can make you satisfied, you are still young and who knows that chances are waiting for you, give more time before taking your decision, understand you are not alone others are suffering more than you, if you intend to terminate your life just wait because natural death can come even before your attempt

  173. James G says:

    “I can understand you ­and a lot of people (­including myself) are­ concerned about what­ those checks and bal­ances will end up bei­ng but I can’t see an­y example you’ve brou­ght up that would pas­s any criteria that w­ould be in place. Of ­course I may have mis­sed some so excuse me­ if I’m incorrect.

    It’s akin to laws put­ in place for someone­ charged with murder ­for example. For the ­most part evidence is­ required and guilt beyond reasonable doub­t is required to sent­ence someone to priso­n. ”

    Perhaps some simple guidelines. Minimum age of 30 or 35 years of age. A waiting period of 2 to 3 weeks. Time for examination of medical background by professionals to prove history of attempting to treat illness. Here is part of my story.

    A few days ago I unfriended everyone on FB. I do mean everyone. Why ? Because it is painfully clear that it is hard to be my friend. I spent endless hours on fb checking to see what everyone was doing, I badly wanted to be a part of their lives. I was living vicariously through everyone’s posts, making funny
    (stupid ) little comments. Some were received well, ok, Kerri Xxxxxx was really the only person kind to “humor” me. In hindsight I think it was one of those, awwww poor Jim things. Still, she is always sweet.

    There were others who ” liked” my comments but mostly I was ignored and rightly so. I now realize that I have done this all my life, inviting myself into other peoples conversations, activities and lives. Kinda creepy now that I see it. I kinda knew that I was trying too hard to become involved but the nagging feelings of emptiness and loneliness were running the show.

    I’ve been bothered for a long time by the realization that I’m very rarely called by anyone. Let alone invited to something. Most people didn’t want me in their lives to begin with. The rest are family and they have just seen enough. Most people will take a look at a car accident when passing by but if it’s
    bad, injuries, blood ect., we quickly turn away. It’s too hard to see. I think I’m the gory car accident. Just too hard to look at .

    I actually had a couple people honest enough to tell me “dude it isn’t easy to be your friend.” Hell, 20 yrs. ago a friend told me that I had an abrasive personality. Took me this long to really get it. Also, it’s finally sinking in that I wear people out. Family, friends, coworkers, and lovers eventually start to
    distance themselves from me. In hindsight I don’t blame any of you. I’m a downer. I’m needy. I’m unpredictable. I’m a drunk and drug addict. I’m a pain in the ass.

    There has been 48 yrs of having trouble making and keeping friends. I’m 48 yrs old now. So yea, always. I used to think I was broken, that something inside me just wasn’t right. A birth defect maybe. Actually I like the sound of that. No one is ever looked down upon for having a birth defect. Then I
    could blame God, lol, if I believed in God.

    I’ve tried to change. I’ve gone to great lengths to change but here we are. It has also recently occurred to me that I have not once in my life pulled myself out of a tight spot. Whether the problem was financial , legal , drinking or drug problems, I’ve always had to lean on someone. Pathetic ,sad, disgraceful . 48 yrs old and not once picked myself up and pushed on.

    At a very young age I experienced what some might consider hell. Around 14yrs old without any specific provocation I swallowed 200 asprin. I began creating my own hell. Throwing gasoline on everything that mattered to me. My shrink and I determined that the depression started around 12yrs old. I didn’t have a clue how to fix things. Apparently I still don’t. In high-school some called me “suicide” man. Also, for as long as I can remember have often had an intense feeling that there was something wrong, something huge missing. When I say intense I mean
    the kind of thing that feels like life or death. I’ve proceeded to try to fill that with anything and everything that helps quiet the feelings. Doesn’t matter if it’s good or bad, just STOP the noise in my head.

    The noise, maybe 20% of the time, is a mild nagging set of thoughts. Constant and clear. “You SUCK!” “You’re worthless!” “ You should just kill yourself!” Yes, compared to the bad days, that is mild. The rest of the time depending on the circumstances, it becomes deafening. The stress level, the
    anxiety, has it been cloudy or sunny, these things make a huge difference. On my best day I feel tired and small. My worst? I can’t fucking describe noise in my head. At this very moment I am vacillating between thoughts of suicide and asking for help, again.

    In the last 3 years these symptoms have become much worse. I now know what Bipolar is. Driving down the road and having a good day in the morning to bawling like a fucking baby after lunch. This has become a regular thing in the past year.

    I’ve been thinking about suicide every day for the past year and a half. Six weeks ago I quit my good job of 10 years. I had a very understanding boss but I couldn’t safely operate my Semi because of the distracting noise in my head. I intend to end all of this a few days after Thanksgiving.

    There needs to be a way for a person with a proven history to safely, calmly and without disgrace to leave this all behind.

    • Anonymous says:

      I feel for you, and want to leave too. I have the same thoughts run through my head, but my condition is more of a Borderline Personality Disorder. So I have a lot of situational anxiety and depression, with bouts of rage and hopelessness.

      The only thing that brings a shred of relief is seeing my family, or escaping reality.

      The only way I’m still holding my job is that I mainly work alone, without too much supervision. When I start having to deal with additional work though, or co-workers too often…it gets bad.

      And I understand about the Facebook thing. I tried to reach out to my list of friends and family and was sorely disappointed. No one wants serious talk, just humorous and carefree. So I quit my account.

      So anyway, I get you, even if that doesn’t matter. I hope whatever you decide to do works out for you. Meaning, if you truly want to go, don’t screw it up like I did.

    • John says:

      I hope to hell you don’t kill yourself. Our stories are almost mirror images. You have a decade on me and had a good job otherwise our issues are similar. I wish I knew the answer, but I don’t. I hope you find some peace.

    • Tom Hal says:

      Thanks for sharing this. It’s very meaningful to me. Wish we could speak.

    • lauren says:

      Your story sounds like my story. I am 50 years old and female, that is the only difference. I would love to find a peaceful way to be able to die. I have thought about dying every day for the past 3 years. I was fascinated with a story about suicide being legal and assistance available in France. I would go there if I could. I guess I’m saying you are not the only one who is going through the hell of living a life you don’t want live anymore.

    • Anonymous says:

      James. Hoping you’re still here NOT because I want to blow sunshine up your ass, but because your post TOTALLY resonated with me. Same age (diff gender), pariah over time, hard to be friends with/close to.
      Came on this site to philosophize and try to get perspective. I have MMO but not balls. So far.

    • Amy LifeStar says:

      Dear James,

      My name is Amy LifeStar! As a starting point in the conversation in relation to what you posted; “Friends in actuality and in the 5th Dimensional World and Space are not that important or even important at all” because ultimately, you are your own best and true friend or at least try to be your own best friend at all times despite how tough the world has been—for and to—you!

      Even when a person has tons of friends, it does not mean that those so-called “friends” would hold this person’s hands and pat on his/her back when this person is falling or in deep water! This occurs because “many people are not being sincere, kind, and empathic per se; and most likely they are not even being kind, genuine, empathic, etc. to themselves let alone understanding and accepting themselves for who they are; what they are; how they became what they became; the future image/development they desired to become, and so on so forth!”

      Therefore, there is no need to “desire for insignificant and superficial friendships or relationships in our lives.” In essence and in truth, you would be the one who has and needs to face and handle whatever comes your way in a “Courageous, Appropriate, Creative, Wise, and Honorable Way!” Nevertheless, despite our best actions, intentions, and perseverance to make it work and make it beautiful for ourselves; there are and will be people in our physical surroundings (not necessarily our friends, family, or acquaintances) Standing in Our Way—to Stop Us to be in the Exact and Necessary Pathway(s) that We Needed to be in—in order to proceed or progress to the level of “Liberation of Our Wounds, Torments, Sufferings, etc.!” The truth is there are many evil, dark, and twisted beings (people) on earth and around us; and this reason explains why there are so many human beings “wanted out or wanted quit”
      from a Tormenting Life (whatever kinds of torments that Forced these human beings to desired to exit Planet Earth: ending its own sufferings and torments by not existing (commonly distorted term: suicide).

      Ultimately, “Understanding, Accepting, Acknowledging, Loving, and Honoring Oneself throughout Time and Space is extremely crucial to continue to Exist in the constant Turbulent, Unkind, Merciless, Unethical, Devious, Vicious, and Twisted Society and World—the 3rd Dimensional world!”

      —By Amy LifeStar, HD & Ethicist

      *For more insights on the subject matter, please refer to my comment on November 12, 2016. Take care, James!

  174. Anonymous says:

    “Do you think suicides should always be prevented? Yes or no, what are your reasons?”
    NO

    Well, humans do euthanize their pets because they think its more humane to let them die then to live but suffer, they kill other soul, yet telling that human shoudn’t kill them self?
    it’s their own life, they can decide it themself, human should be allowed to suicide if they suffering in life

    I am a failure, no one needs me, no one wants me. Everyday feel so lonely and painful, it’s hard to sleep because it hurts so much, I wanna cry every single night but I can’t anymore
    Life has no meaning at all, I have no purpose in life

    Don’t say u care about me…about people like us, not even our family and people around us care
    and you here in internet are just strangers, who only write sweet words with no meaning

    “Think about it, there always tomorrow”
    I already want to die since elementary school, and now I am almost 30, there is a lot of ‘tomorrow’, and here I am, life isn’t getting better at all, it’s just more and more painful
    Back then whenever I feel bad, I use scissors, knife, needle, or cutter to cut my body, that kind of pain is better than the pain inside me, at least it can distract me for a while
    I drunk almost a bowl of detergent, that thing can’t kill, just makes your body feel horrible for a night

    I want to die so bad, but I’m a coward, I don’t have the courage to do it,
    if only they could euthanize me too, I will be really thankful that finally this all can end

  175. Nikki says:

    this just made me extremely sad… This is scary.

  176. Cristian says:

    Well if the person has no family, no friends, and most of the world hates them or treat them like an outcast because of internet shaming what’s the point in them continuing to live. Especially when the few people who do care about them avoid hanging out with them so that their reputation doesn’t go down. Suicide is never a good idea, but some times a person really has nothing to go on for.

    • Anonymous says:

      I’ve been Suicidal off and on for 7 years (20 to 27). I think about death all the time and I can’t even work my cushy job.

      I can tell you are a teen and I’d say this: it gets better, it gets worse, it gets different. Popularity is fickle. Post high school you get more control over your friend group, especially as you earn money.

  177. Donald Prettyman says:

    Tell them nooo0…….. theirs Always tomorrow 🙂

    • Brittany says:

      we are not promised tomorrow or a second. God can take us anytime

    • John says:

      That’s the problem there is always tomorrow..and the day after .and the day after…day after day…of things that I CANNOT change..and that’s what I NEED…CHANGE…the change I want not the change others want for me..I can’t be myself, no one wants me…If I be what They want me to be, I’m not myself..I’m screwed

    • Sam says:

      Endless suffering everyday and tomorrow, so meaningless is your comment.

  178. Anonymous says:

    Bipolar Depression is not temporary

  179. Alex says:

    Stacy,

    The right to die has been hotly debated for decades. In this area, as well as in the area of abortion, we observe two fallacious positions: one right-wing, religiously-motivated faction which seeks to impose life on everyone and everything, even corpses, and one slightly less right-wing, liberalism-motivated faction which proposes a “moderate” position.

    Just to be clear before I continue, by right to die I include all the ways by which one can voluntarily die: suicide, assisted suicide (where the means of death have been provided by someone else) and euthanasia (where a third party performs the act).

    First, let me reject some arguments motivated by irrational worldviews. First, the Christian belief that killing ourselves is an assault against God’s ownership of human beings, and the liberal/Libertarian belief in self-ownership as justifying bodily destruction; I have debunked both of these as they pertained to abortion, and the same reasoning applies here (self-ownership is tautological, God’s will cannot have any ethical consequences, the Bible does not consider suicide to be unethical).

    So, is there such a thing as a right to die? There is a clear conflict between those who wish to die and those who try to stop them from doing so. Following Tucker’s theorem (that the invader’s values must be subordinated to those of the invaded), our criterion to choose who is in the right is by looking at who is imposing their values on the other.

    From this point, the arguments from both sides go roughly as follows. The anti-right view would hold that the prospective suicides are interfering with their own values by desiring to extinguish them (even going so far as to call it “self-murder”), and would also argue that the suicides, if their plan succeeds, interfere with society as a whole and with God’s plans (the latter point, of course, can be dismissed). The moderate view accepts the personal and social losses as being relevant, but balances them with the expected future of the suicides, so that the freedom to die is acceptable in some circumstances as a self-determined choice, and not in others.

    I reject the utilitarian arguments on the ground that we can’t possibly make any inter-subjective comparisons. Whether the suffering that the suicides spare themselves is greater or lesser than the suffering of their loved ones is a pointless question. As for social losses, not only is it another consequentialist argument, but studies have shown that when we take into account the potential losses to society due to old age costs and psychological issues, suicide is actually economically beneficial (to the tune of around 150,000$ per person in the US), so I also reject this as a consideration.

    So, having whittled down each side, we have two simpler conflicting views. The first is that the suicides are fulfilling their values and that the suicide-stoppers are interfering with the suicides’ freedom to express their values. The second is that the suicides are interfering with other people’s values (say, the suicide’s spouse, who depends on em in order to fulfill relational values) without their consent, and that therefore stopping them is just.

    Now the answer is clear. The former narrative is the correct one, because no one has the right to demand that any specific person help them fulfill their values. Again we come back to the house on fire example: if your house is on fire, you can rightly expect the firemen to deal with the fire, but you don’t have the right to demand that any random bystander run into the house to save someone. Likewise, I have no right to expect a specific person to remain alive because I need my relationship with them (the case of a person with children is another matter, which I will take up at the end for the sake of argument flow).

    Another problem is that we cannot use emotional distress as an objective standard. While it may be true that a suicide may inflict emotional distress on those around them, this may also be true of someone who decides to remain alive and burden people around them. Should we therefore mandate suicide on that basis as well? I am open to arguments for mandating suicide, but prima facie this seems unreasonable. It seems much more likely that distress is, like all emotions, not sufficient evidence to indicate that criminal harm has been inflicted on someone.

    So I conclude that the suicide is actually in the right, and anyone who tries to stop them is in the wrong.

    Let’s look further at the issue of consent. In order to be justified, any action must necessarily involve the consent of all parties involved. The anti-right view means imposing the continuation of life on a person without their consent. This is unjustifiable and wrong. As we know life always involves an element of suffering, to force the continuation of life means to impose a certain amount of suffering on a person. If anything is wrong, this must be it.

    Note that I did not make any distinction of age or medical state here, because it is not relevant at all. Nothing in my arguments indicates that age or medical state has any relevance whatsoever. It is wrong to impose the continuation of life on a child or an adult, on a healthy person or a terminally ill person, on a person of sound mind or a person of unsound mind. Granted, whether a person of unsound mind can be said to meaningfully consent is a different matter, but as long as pre-written consent is given there shouldn’t be a problem, like how do not resuscitate orders and advance directives are not inherently problematic.

    We may evaluate that a given person’s expected future is “good enough” for them to continue living, but our own personal evaluation is not relevant to another person’s decision. We can’t meaningfully make such an evaluation as anything but a personal opinion, so it’s irrelevant to whether another person should be allowed to commit suicide or not.

    Let me make myself clear, so I am understood fully: if a person who is completely healthy and of sound mind declares the intent to die, they should be allowed to die, no questions asked. Age is not relevant, health is not relevant, expected future is not relevant, mental state is not relevant. Death should be provided to anyone who desires it.

    One may reply that, while they agree in theory with my conclusion that anyone should be free to commit suicide, my position is callous because suicide is a bad thing on the whole, and that we should be trying to dissuade people from killing themselves, not help them to kill themselves.

    But this sort of moderate position is based on an incommensurate belief in human life as a positive thing. At least the anti-right position is shameless in its authoritarianism and, while professing to be “pro-life,” clearly has no respect for life. In that respect, the moderate position doesn’t really make any sense. How is human life so great that a supposedly rational calculation proves that we should feel justified to force it on other people?

    Not only that, but many believe that human life is so valuable that forcing it on people is good for all expected futures except a future of constant, unwavering suffering. This is such an extreme position that it’s hard to believe that it’s actually the mainstream position. When we spit on people’s desperation and freedom in the name of “life,” you know that we truly are fanatics for the cult of life in this society. Like any other form of violent mindless fanaticism, it truly sickens me.

    I have already pointed out that it is impossible for any person to rationally conclude that anyone else’s suicide was a mistake. We are bombarded with propaganda trying to indoctrinate us with the opposite belief: “suicide is selfish” (as if other people have a claim to our continued existence), “suicide is the coward’s way out” (see my “losing team” point below), “suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem” (not all the problems being solved are temporary), “choose life” (why?), and such pap. All of these propaganda slogans are meant to obscure the fundamental fact that suicide puts the person’s death in their own hands.

    Here is Bill Zeller’s suicide letter:

    >”People say suicide is selfish. I think it’s selfish to ask people to continue living painful and miserable lives, just so you possibly won’t feel sad for a week or two. Suicide may be a permanent solution to a temporary problem, but it’s also a permanent solution to a ~23 year-old problem that grows more intense and overwhelming every day”

    The cowardice propaganda, I think, is especially pushed. There is a strong correlation, I think, between this propaganda and the objection that antinatalism puts us on the “losing team”; again there is this belief in life as a sports game and longevity as the points, and if you kill yourself you’re running away from the field because you just can’t take the heat.

    As for “choosing life,” they don’t really want you to “choose.” An actual choice would require viable options, but to my opponents there’s only one viable option, and that’s staying alive at all costs.

    Of course there is a sense in which this discussion, like the abortion discussion, is pointless: people will do it whether it’s justified or not. But, as for abortion, suicide often requires the assistance of at least one other person. And making an act ethically unjustified or illegal does severely lower the availability of such assistance (just as the fanatical belief that abortion is unjustified severely lowers the availability of medical and pharmaceutical assistance). And that’s a real problem that causes suffering to real people. All these debates are really just rationalizations on whether we should force people to suffer or not. My answer is always gonna be “hell no.”

    I think the belief that suicide is good or bad will depend on one’s worldview. Liberalism cannot admit of the righteousness of suicide because it is predicated on unerring optimism about human abilities and the belief in constant progress. There is definitely a tension there between the belief in “self-ownership,” which logically entails the freedom to destroy oneself (but also to sell oneself, which liberals cannot accept either), and extreme optimism, which generates reluctant acceptance. We observe the same reluctance with abortion and the pro-choice position: “abortion is bad, but people should be free to do it, but we have to get people to stop doing it because it’s inherently bad.”

    I believe suicide is good because I hold no belief in human life as having any kind of special status or any optimism about human future (such as a belief in Heaven or a belief in inexorable social progress). It is good for people to be in control of their future, and to decide when it should end. It is not as much that suicide is good in itself (after all, we all die some day, and that fact is not good or bad in itself) as the fact that forbidding people to commit suicide is a fundamental wrong which makes suicide good by comparison.

    Anti-right advocates keep whining about human dignity, but suicide is the height of human dignity, and nothing is more of an vicious attack against human dignity than to force sick people to writhe in pain like mangy dogs. “Human dignity” is always the first rationalization of the authoritarian, but they don’t know what human dignity is any more than they know with freedom is.

    Anti-right advocates and moderates think there is a paradox between suicide as an act of freedom and the fact that suicide nullifies one’s freedom. But this paradox doesn’t seem to come into play when we consider, for example, the actions of suicide bombers, or the actions of people who put their lives at great risk for a cause. The reason why we don’t think suicide bombers are paradoxical is because the very term “suicide bomber” evokes the reason for the action, and it is this reason which provides the explanation for the self-destroying actions. But suicides also have reasons for doing what they do. As long as we keep a suicide in the abstract as an act of freedom, then we’re obscuring the motives, and the paradox appears relevant. When we look at the underlying reasons, then we are no longer confused: the matter can simply be expressed as the fact that there are values greater than life for the sake of living.

    Indeed, I think it is clear that we all hold some values greater than survival. If you ask people if they’d prefer to live 80 years in jail or 79 years of a charmed life, I’m pretty sure everyone will answer the latter. It will do no good to reply that such a choice represents the “suicide” of one year of life. Mere life is not worth that much, and we know it. No human being is contented by the simple fact of existing.

    One may further reply that it is not the freedom to commit suicide that they find undesirable, but the suicide itself. But this sort of objection makes no sense to me. Why would you like the freedom to do something you find undesirable? I don’t like the freedom to utter hate speech, but I also know it is absolutely necessary in order to have any freedom of speech at all (people who confuse their personal dislike with objective facts are the ones fucking up free speech for the rest of us).

    There is no more crucial freedom than to be free to decide when one is to die, and how. After all, suicide is really a person’s only escape, however bad life gets.

    There is really no utilitarian reason for any society to outlaw suicide except the desire to slap a fake optimistic front to some people’s misery. Suicide is one of those things that angers people because it is a signal that there’s something wrong with their society, much like how atheists subconsciously remind religious people that the indoctrination they suffered through was useless. To admit that a suicide is in the right is a blow against all the illusions and delusions we mount to prevent ourselves from thinking about death, and the delusion that we are perpetuating ourselves through our children, our family, our religion, our country, and so on. It is a rejection of the “sanctity of life” that underlies all religions and statist ideologies.

    • mokhtar says:

      very interesting points in your study ,i think to decide whether committing sucide is right or wrong then the answer is we do not know because this answer depends on another questions such as what happens after the suicidal die? is there any life after death ? if there is life after death does that mean one who committed the sucide will have a better life than that one he already lived on earth ?so as you see sucide question is depending on an unknown future aspects that if they are verified then we can judge on suicide righteous or otherwise

    • Anonymous says:

      Thanks for writing all this. I read the whole thing and found no comments. I appreciate that you laid out so much thoughtfulness on the subject, and your views seem to be very similar to mine, so… I guess I have nothing constructive to add, just felt you should have a response lol.

    • Anonymous says:

      Wow thanks for taking the time to write all that so that I could read it and contemplate it

    • L says:

      Thank you for expounding your thoughts. I have found it to be a very interesting and thought provoking discussion. I’m on this site at the moment as I am feeling hopeless. I’m not sure I want to cease living as I want to cease the pain of hopelessness. Your interesting discussion gave me a little sense of hope and possibility. So thank you

  180. David W says:

    Sorry, I wish I could edit my last post to comment on some of your legitimate concerns considering the position you are in as you may be asked to make this decision at some point. Of course this brings up a lot of issues for the doctors not only ethically and morally, but sadly even religious beliefs. That being said have you never had a patient or two who has had nothing but pure and utter suffering for decades with no relief from medications or therapy of any kind?

    In such extreme cases (like a lot of people replying on your site), wouldn’t your decision to allow them to end their life and finally find some kind of peace for once not be one that really doesn’t require a lot of deliberation on your part? I was going to use the word easy but that holds too much connotation and potentially confuse the intent of my question to you.

    Cheers

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      David,

      I appreciate this discussion and your willingness to try to understand my view as a mental health professional. To answer your question, the reality is that I actually haven’t had any clients who had “nothing but pure and utter suffering for decades with no relief from medications or therapy of any kind.” That’s not to say they don’t exist. Perhaps they do. I just haven’t met them.

      It makes me think of a favorite quote of mine from Graham Greene: “It is one of the strange discoveries a man can make that life, however you lead it, contains moments of exhilaration; there are always comparisons which can be made with worse times: even in danger and misery the pendulum swings.”

      I hesitate to include that quote, because I don’t mean to minimize, invalidate, or dismiss the genuine suffering of so many people out there. But I do think that even amid great suffering, the pendulum swings. People seldom if ever feel 100% miserable 100% of the time. There are fluctuations, and those fluctuations usually are what have kept them alive to this point.

      What I have observed, more in line with your question, is people who under the darkness of depression or other despair are unable to remember a time when they were not miserable. Their mind tricks them into thinking that they have relentlessly been miserable with no respite at all. Or they remember such times and think those were a fluke, a lie, a trick, or something else unreal. And then when their mood improves, their memories change, even if only a little.

      Again, I don’t mean to dispute the suffering of others. All it takes is the ability to read a newspaper (or, as you said, the comments on this site) to know that there’s too much suffering in this world. How I wish it weren’t so! Yet even suffering is constantly changing.

      Please understand that I’m not saying people should suffer or should “buck it up” and withstand their suffering. What I am saying, or at least trying to say, is that even abject suffering tends to have complexities that defy conversations such as ours.

      Thanks again for your contribution.

    • Anonymous says:

      Some relief from medications? Are you kidding me? Some relief from medication is why I should want to live? It’s relative isn’t it?

    • Suizou says:

      Suicide prevention is a form of violence.

  181. David W says:

    I think the essence of the problem here Stacey is that what you are asking for is impossible. You will never get this so called line you keep referring to. This isn’t something that can be measured like alcohol concentration in the blood.

    That why there are steps involved to determine if the person qualifies to have their life ended (see Sweden, Netherlands, Canada et al).

    It’s not like anyone is planning to open up a euthanasia drive through where anyone can just go and end their life without any sort of checks and balances in place.

    Frankly this really isn’t as intricate of of a problem as a some people make it out to be. You’ve read the stories shared on here (including my own). I can’t even fathom how anyone would be against euthanasia after reading what so many people are going through.

    And I really do hate to say it but your arguments are banal at the least. You are bringing up situations that are already being taken into consideration by those making this legislation. I know Canada will require two doctors to give approval to end ones life as an example.

    The time for questions are long over and the time for action is imperative.

    Ps: I’m not trying to be disrespectful, maybe just a bit frustrated at this point 🙂

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      David,

      I appreciate the points you raise. The Canada law applies only to cases of terminal illness, and even then several conditions must be met, per this website:

      “A person has a grievous and irremediable medical condition only if they meet all of the following criteria:
      (a) they have a serious and incurable illness, disease or disability;
      (b) they are in an advanced state of irreversible decline in capability;
      (c) that illness, disease or disability or that state of decline causes them enduring physical or psychological suffering that is intolerable to them and that cannot be relieved under conditions that they consider acceptable; and
      (d) their natural death has become reasonably foreseeable, taking into account all of their medical circumstances, without a prognosis necessarily having been made as to the specific length of time that they have remaining.”

      The line that I’m seeking isn’t philosophical or legal; it’s about when to try to prevent suicide in a person whose body is not failing. The difference might seem like splitting hairs, but in my case, I am bound by professional, ethical, and legal obligations to intervene when a person is at “imminent risk” of dying by suicide. (An exception will occur when our state implements the aid-in-dying law that was passed last week.) As a mental health professional, if I were to advocate for liberalizing this policy, I would need to be able to say for whom suicide should be allowed to occur without intervention, and I don’t know the answer to that, Switzerland and the Netherlands and similar countries notwithstanding.

      I didn’t find your comment disrespectful, and I thank you for your contribution to the discussion.

    • David W says:

      While that’s currently true of the Canadian law there are some caveats that must be mentioned. First and foremost it is not what the Supreme Court Of Canada’s decision was in regards to who could end their life. The Senate unfortunately made the law more restrictive. Thankfully the current law here is already being challenged (all of 10 days after the law was enacted) to bring it inline with what the Supreme Court originally declared.

      “The Supreme Court of Canada created an exception, after analyzing Canadian constitutional law in the case of Carter v. Canada (Attorney General), released at the beginning of February 2015. The Supreme Court declared that the prohibition in section 241(b) of the Criminal Code on assisting with suicide is unconstitutional to the extent that it prevents physician-assisted death for “a competent adult person who (1) clearly consents to the termination of life and (2) has a grievous and irremediable medical condition (including an illness, disease or disability) that causes enduring suffering that is intolerable to the individual in the circumstances of his or her condition.”

      As you can see there is no mention of imminent death (which is point B and D in your reply if I’m not mistaken). That was sadly added on later when the law was finally put in place. It also means it should hopefully be fairly easy to overturn the current law to ensure it follows the Supreme Courts decision on this topic.

      FYI the challenge is happening in British Columbia by Julia Lamb and the BCCLA

      Sorry for not posting links but my browser is not cooperating today.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Thanks for this information, David, about the Canadian situation. I look up the information to learn more about it.

      As you know, some countries do permit assisted suicide or even euthanasia in the case of mental illness such as depression. My understanding is that suicide rates are not much higher in those areas, if at all, but I need to read the current literature.

      I actually think that permissive policies about suicide would save lives – that if people could know that they could die by suicide at any time without forced intervention, then they would be more willing to get professional help, or at least stick around to see if things change. But then I return to the same “where to draw the line?” vexation.

      A scenario in my mind is one of a mother whose adult child is intent on dying by suicide, holding a gun to their head, and by virtue of psychosis or substance intoxication not in a sound state of mind to make such a decision. She calls the police for help, and the police say, “Sorry, it’s their right to end their life. We can’t do anything to stop it.”

      Others might say, “Well, if it’s obvious the person’s not in a sound state of mind, then they should be stopped.” And then we fall into the same conundrum all over again: Who decides who’s in a sound state of mind? How is this evaluated without forcing the person into treatment for an evaluation about their state of mind? And so on….

    • Anonymous says:

      So wish such a drive in existed, though.

    • David W says:

      I couldn’t find a place to reply to your last post so hopefully this doesn’t screw up the timeline too much.

      I absolutely agree that just having the option of doctor assisted death could be enough to extend the lives of those wishing to die as there is the comfort of knowing there is a legal and legitimate way out when they finally make that choice.

      I think you may have taken my statement a bit too literally. While I’ve wanted to die for over 30 years now it doesn’t mean that I’ve never had a good day or two or have had hope that at some point in the future there may be some relief. I’m lucky to have maybe 5 days a year which I consider good days and one could say I’m in a good mood. But that I no way negates the fact that the time has come for my life to finally be over. I’ve fought for 30 years and have no fight left. Nor do I (or anyone else) deserve to live a life so miserable.

      I’m sorry but my biggest issues with your examples is that they are strawman arguments. None of these systems to allow for assisted dying include the ability to just shoot yourself if so desired. It’s a process involving medical professionals working with the person in question to determine if their situation warrants end of life. Not some free for all where anything goes. I’ll state it again, there will be checks and balances in place to determine feasibility.

      I can understand you and a lot of people (including myself) are concerned about what those checks and balances will end up being but I can’t see any example you’ve brought up that would pass any criteria that would be in place. Of course I may have missed some so excuse me if I’m incorrect.

      It’s akin to laws put in place for someone charged with murder for example. For the most part evidence is required and guilt beyond reasonable doubt is required to sentence someone to prison. Not to mention the degree of murder which needs to be established. Those are checks and balances to ensure (as much as possible) that the right people are charged and innocent people go free. Of course it’s not perfect but there is no such thing as a perfect system and that will include how this ends up turning out.

      They won’t be allowing someone who has been depressed for a week to be allowed assisted suicide. A lot stricter policies will be in place to prevent if not all, but most of the concerns you seem to have.

    • Danny says:

      David, Your choice of the word “banal” is excellent here. In my comment, I used the word ‘rhetoric”, but it basically boils down to meaning the same thing. It sounds like you and I are on the same page here, and judging by the looks of things, we are both Canadian as well..? I agree with a lot of what you’ve said.

      The advice given here, despite being well-intentioned, is banal rhetoric. End of story. Most cases of anti-suicide counselling usually falls under that category, because the therapist can’t put themselves in our exact circumstances, and they CERTAINLY cannot put themselves in your body where you feel all the emotional and physical pain. That is why psychotherapy often fails here. We rely on that fallacious assumption.

      One thing I can’t help but notice about the physician-assisted euthanasia “requirements” is that it only allows people who have “terminal” illness. Well, what about people who have NON-FATAL, incurable, long-standing, chronic illnesses/disorders that are NOT helped by traditional therapies? These are the ones who are exempt from consideration, even though they can feel imprisoned in their own bodies. In cases such as these (of which I personally fall into), I have to reduce myself to accepting some other human (1 or 2 doctors) telling me that I shouldn’t have the right to die because I’m not suffering that badly, in their eyes? That’s horseshit no matter how you cut it.

      I’ve become very angry, bitter and cynical over this because it seems like terminal patients are the only ones allowed to be considered since they will be passing away shortly anyway. People with non-fatal disorders can be “treated” with expensive medications that incur MORE side effects which require even MORE expensive drugs, and while this is happening they still pay the monthly bills and pay their monthly taxes. That’s what the agenda seems to be here…….MONEY.

      This whole world is backwards and the legislation that is passed forces people to jump through an exceedingly large number of hoops in hope of an escape from their pain, while leaving out others completely. To me, this is not only inhumane but it’s criminal as well. Nobody asked us if we wanted to be brought into this world, and now we’re told that we can’t leave. BULL….SHIT.

  182. PJ says:

    Absolutely agree with Chad N. that you have a logical fallacy in your argument, Ms. Freedenthal. Suicide can be wrong in some cases, yet the correct thing to do in others. When a person has a temporary condition or reduced ability to make choices (such as a child), suicide is inappropriate. But where a person has wanted suicide for many years and has one or more health issues that preclude living a “normal” life, suicide may be appropriate.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      PJ and Chad N,

      I can understand that my comments seem like a “logical fallacy” in my “argument.” I’m afraid I didn’t make myself clear in my original response to Bob. I’m actually not trying to make an argument. I am truly curious about where to draw the line between suicide that should be stopped and suicide that should be allowed to continue without intervention. I do not know the answer.

      Here in Colorado, where I live, we just approved a bill allowing for physician aid in dying, also called by many people “assisted suicide.” I support that law. Someone in the final months of life should have the ability to control when and how they go. But to me, there’s a huge gulf between people at that extreme end of the spectrum and those at the other end, like the child or person delirious with fever who I invoked in my original comment. And if we were to assume that people have the right to end their life in some cases, I struggle with where to draw that line between when it’s a right and when it’s a problem. So my question, “Where do you draw the line?” comes from true curiosity, not a desire to argue or philosophize.

      Chad offered a thoughtful proposal for how that question can be answered on an individual basis. Yet the question of where to draw the line still remains, whether it’s us discussing it on this website or a group of people trying to answer the question in some type of hearing.

    • James R Gorsh says:

      That’s right. Stacey’s perception is not based on knowing and feeling what it is like.

    • Sune says:

      I’ve wanted to die for over 20 years, but I have no terminal health issues to qualify for assisted death. I smoke, hoping I’ll get cancer so a Dr. will put me out of my misery. I wish for a semi to barrel into me on the freeway.

      Anything so that I’m not having to resort to downing a bottle of pills, possibly puking my guts everywhere, and then living through it…having to face family and mental Dr’s. Again.

  183. x says:

    trigger warning

    what if you have been abused your whole life by various people, family and non-family, have had people who considered themselves your “friend” violently rape you and threaten to kill you when they know you are suicidal and then encourage you to commit suicide, have extremely severe ptsd because of it, have gone to years of therapy, and new people in your life always end up abusing you as well because they take advantage of your vulnerability. i have been suicidal for most of my life, since i was 7 fucking years old. tell me it’s a temporary problem. tell me i’ll change my mind. and don’t you dare victim blame me for the things that have happened to me.

    • Nikki says:

      You have to wait for that one person to change everything.. Waiting your whole life is worth it. Try to get positive, just keep living.

    • PJ says:

      Nikki, are you joking?? The idea that there is always one person out there who can change our lives is a big problem. It just isn’t true.

  184. PJ says:

    I think you are right in most situations. But there are a lot of exceptions. If a person takes time to adjust to a bad situation and still wants to die, shouldn’t they becable to? Also, your argument revolves around change. What if a person has wanted to die for 10 years? Or 20 years?

  185. N/A N/A says:

    Very patronizing article.

  186. Krystal says:

    I’ve had four suicide attempts, the last one being six months ago, the day after my mum died.I was in very rough shape, I was intubated and unresponsive for an entire day.The only reason I haven’t tried again is because I have children.But with my mum gone, they are all I have now.Most of my remaining family members didn’t even come to the hospital when I overdosed.I have no friends anymore.My mum is gone, and I might as well have died with her.Im alive because I don’t want to do any more damage to my kids.But I don’t want to be here anymore.Its like being tortured every single day of my life.I absolutely think that it should be an individuals choice, if they can’t take the pain anymore.

  187. Amy LifeStar says:

    Well, it all depends on the nature of the situation(s), especially the “Life situations” in relation to the person who desired to die! For instance, it would be completely Merciless and Unethical for us to allow someone’s Merciless sufferings (i.e. physical/functional sufferings or other kinds of sufferings, especially the ones that arose from the hands and actions of others) to “Capture this Person’s Life Forever until Death” when all favorable and desirable options have been “closed-off” for this person!

    Nevertheless, even when this person could change his/her mindset or viewpoint about the very things that tormented him/her in life, it is never a guarantee that the “Life Conditions would and could Change for the better!” Moreover, the Soul of a person Cannot change; shall not change (and definitely shall Not be Forced to Change by Society, etc.); and Does Not Need to change—in terms of viewing, sensing, and touching the true nature of his/her life conditions—with its own Natural Soul Imprints because the Soul is Honest, True, and Courageous in Needing to do the very things (including ending its own merciless sufferings by not existing) in accord with what it “authentically sensed and undergone throughout life: days after days; months after months; and years after years!” In this respect, we shall not and ought not to Mercilessly Stop a person from Exiting a tormented/wounded life because this person’s life had either never begun or became so twisted, convoluted, and mutated in all aspects for so long and too long— despite this person’s constant attempts to make it better; make it fuller; and make it richer for its own sake! But Life and people in society simply would show “No Mercy and No Empathy to this Person’s Sufferings, Torments, and Wounds!” .

    In addition, it is such a popular and wide practice for psychological professionals to think or believe that a person ought to and need to find ways to cope with his/her Life Conditions or problems as if this person is so weak in not knowing how to deal with its own problems; when in fact “Life Conditions” per se is never constituted as a person’s problems, it is the (Harmful) Events that Infused and Inflicted upon a person’s Life by the hands and actions of Harm-doers. The truth is the very nature of coping of any kind of torments or wounds inflicted upon us is simply Tormenting: whether the core wounds/torments are residing in our body, body functions, psyche, etc. What we truly desired and ought to desire is to “Liberate ourselves and our Souls from the Torments and Wounds in anyway and all ways that we could—given IF the conditions and people in our environment allowed us to do so!” However, many of us do not have the freedom and liberty to be in such favorable and flourishing environment, which therefore made the Life conditions much more prevalent and unbearable.

    Of course we do not want to hasting death, but then again, when a Person’s Life Conditions’ Sufferings have Totally Outweighed and Taken Over the Vibrancy, Beauty, Wisdom, Order, Honor, and Harmony of Life, is there still a Life for this person! Therefore, it is also Merciless for Society to use the statement that “a person ended its own life: aka, committed suicide or desired to commit suicide”—when in fact this person is/was being courageous enough to do the hardest and bravest thing that it has/had ever done on earth by ending its own sufferings/torments/wounds through Exiting because of what and how Life had put this person through: year after year!

    Moreover, not everyone whom ended their own sufferings by exiting Planet Earth has a “mental illness” or other terminologies that many so-called psychologists/psychiatrists have been prevalently used to against a person’s well-being; when in fact such “labeling immediately and automatically demeans a person’s character and undermines his/her Life Conditions” that evidently, prevalently, and Mercilessly Misconstrued and Distorted the Essence of Soul Health or Soul Imprints” for as long as the invention of mainstream Psychology—although it might be true that some have died/exited did have some sort of psychological dysfunctions or malfunctions due various reasons and factors.

    One final note, to see and desire less human beings that will exit from Planet Earth by having to end their own Endless Sufferings and Torments, then, “Simply Being Merciful, Empathetic, and Kind (means To Do No Harms) to these beings—when their Souls (Psyches) and/or Bodies are and have been Tormented and Wounded for so Long!” This practice by far is the Wise and Authentic Answer to Stop a person from exiting Planet Earth; and no medications or psychological treatments would and could compare to this Critical, Authentic, and Sacred Approach to Stop a Person from undergoing Merciless Sufferings, Torments, and Wounds whether the wounds Manifested Physically, Functionally, or Soulfully or in all Three Compartments!

    —By Amy LifeStar, HD & Ethicist

  188. David W says:

    I’ll try to keep this short. I’m 44 now and for 30+ years I’ve lived with med resistant depression and sleeping disorders. Not to mention neck and back pain that in the last few years has become permanent and unrelenting.

    The sleeping issues meant I could never complete even high school. I’m sure depression exacerbated things a fair amount.

    I’ve never been able to keep a job for longer than 2 months due to not getting restorative sleep and eventually always sleeping though my alarms (I’d have 6 set plus another in another room).

    From depression to the 3 sleeping disorders and now chronic pain there is no reason to keep living. I’m single, no kids and I’ve lost the ability to even work.

    I’m a smart person and could have accomplished anything which kills the psyche that much more. I can’t take the pain anymore, I can’t take the exhaustion anymore, and I can’t take the loneliness anymore.

    This is no life for anyone to live and frankly no life at all. How can we as a society consider this acceptable in any manner whatsoever. There should be doctors lining up at my (and others in my position) doorstep offering me an end to this unbearable pain. Is that not the oath they signed? Is that not what being a caring human is all about.

    Funny how we care so much about our animals that we have the compassion to euthanize them when the time is right but God forbid we extend this to our fellow man/woman.

    • Nicolette says:

      If you want to talk you can email me at 0musicmind@gmail.com

    • Jeanette says:

      I have a comment and question about intellectual ability, mental slowness and low self esteem.

      Let me clarify what I mean by ‘intellectually slow person’. Obviously I am not referring to the person who meets the criteria for an Intellectual Disability (also called mental retardation)…. I am talking about the person who has the ability to learn necessary academic skills, but at a rate and depth BELOW AVERAGE same age peers. In order to grasp new concepts, this person needs more time, more repetition, and often more resources from teachers to be successful. Typically, this person has great difficulty with new and complex reasoning which makes new concepts difficult to learn.

      These slow learners are prone to much anxiety and low self image which goes unnoticed by many in society. They often feel ‘stupid’ and begin hating school at an early age. Day-to-day academic life can be very draining and yet many somehow manage to make it through the system and through high school (in the United States).

      The psychologist and intelligence researcher Linda Gottfredson wrote a good piece titled Why g Matters: The Complexity of Everyday Life. An excerpt:

      “Life is replete with uncertainty, change, confusion, and misinformation, sometimes minor and at times massive. From birth to death, life continually requires us to master abstractions, solve problems, draw inferences, and make judgments on the basis of inadequate information. Such demands may be especially intense in school, but they hardly cease when one walks out the school door…”

      Question:

      Can you sympathize with a person who says that one of their major reasons for contemplating suicide often (besides exhaustion) is that they just don’t feel competent to handle the mental demands of life?

  189. Anonymous says:

    No. I don’t think ALL problems are temporary. For instance, a chronic illness with no cure is not temporary and can cause unnecessary suffering for your entire life.

  190. Ayla-jess says:

    What if you have already tried killing ur self and have been in that low point but ur mind set is still the same and u still have the same old goal of wanting to disappear and not return.. I’ve tried I have a pretty successful job and everything else in between but I didn’t ask for this life but Take it how ever u want, me being selfish or what ever but I no longer look forward to the future or anything good because I deserve what ever pain come my way I’m not a nice person and how do U say to some one who’s tried before and not just once either, to stay strong it’ll all get better it’ll all work out in the end. When they’ve made up their mind and it’s set.. No changing my mind. Please tell me why ?

  191. Scott says:

    I’ve had back pain and degenerative disc disease for about 10 years that has increased over time. I also have chronic fatigue and stomach pain and symptoms that make it very uncomfortable to go into public/work. Its a nightmare, I have rectal leakage that smells awful. I’ve sought and received various medical treatments for these things but nothing seems to help much, I’m not a candidate for surgery. Everyday I wake up thinking “oh hell, here I go again” and my back usually feels like a brick and many days I have nausea/migraines and my arm and hand are numb on the opposite side I’m laying. My body is breaking down and I’m 36. Not to mention I’ve had bacterial meningitis/hydrocephalus and have a shunt. I have a sharp pain from nerve damage caused by my last shunt surgery in 2009, which also makes the left side of my face numb many days. The idea of enduring this for another 30+ years scares the hell out of me. Any terminal illness would be a HUGE relief but that probably wont happen. All I can think of is a way to get relief and peace. I think I’m mentally tough but I think I’m at my limit.

  192. Anonymous says:

    22 Veterans kill themselves everyday. Every day i hear 21 voices calling me home. I’ve failed in my life after my time in the service. I was forgotten, tormented, and abused by the VA, my community, my friends and most of my family. I lived in solitude without the basic amenities for 5 years. I lived without health care for 10 years. I’ve been suffering for 15 years. I’ve attempted suicide three times, only regretting my failure each time. I’m tired of suffering. I’m tired of the depression. I’m tired of pharmaceutical cocktails that make the voices worse. I’m tired. I know death is near. I can feel the cold breath of nothingness on my soul. No veteran, no one, should be forced to live in torment. Yet suicide is demonized by society. They call it a permanent solution to a temporary problem; but when the problem persists for years or decades “thier” solutions are no longer viable. No one is getting out of this world alive; why should i suffer today until the enevitible death that claims us all? I am ready for eternal rest. If only assisted suicide was legal. I

    . i’ .

  193. Serapio says:

    Death IS inevitable and most often unplanned and out of anybody’s control. To die is to permanently stop the existence of life. Whether by accident, incident, murder or assassination, war, or one’s own hand is really irrelevant in the end. A person realizing they have made a mistake after jumping off the Golden Gate bridge can easily translate into, “i am not ready to go”. But, is it not possible that the murder victim or accident victim could have the very same “reluctance”? I do really believe that no one wants to give up the gift of life. I also believe that going on through life may not be the best thing, and not only for the main individual, but for the sake of others as well. After all, when a criminal sentenced to die is executed, aren’t “family” of the victim allowed to view for their own personal satisfaction? Because, they WANT the guilty criminal to die and they want to SEE the execution! AND, the law fulfills the ending of that life in that manner. BTW, “murder” conviction in the 1st degree or 2d degree, or whatever “degree” probably does NOT matter to the dead victim. A statement in the bible says that if a lion kills a man, that lion should be put to death. That statement does not bring in to question the “intent” or the “manner” or the “state of mind” of the lion.
    Yes. Death is final and YES, IT COMES TO ALL.

  194. Lena says:

    I have bipolar disorder. There is no cure. Medications don’t help. They make me sick and take away what little of me I like. Therapy doesn’t help. Nothing is helpful. To be told it will get better is a lie. To have people prolong my misery of living with this condition is unacceptable. We call it humane to put down our beloved pets when their quality of life is bad. My quality of life is bad. I will never have better quality of life. Even if in mania things feel wonderful, the madness is always there. It’s sad I can’t have that choice by law. That I can’t do it safely and painlessly. That to end my misery I have to do so violently and hidden, like a criminal.

  195. Bob says:

    I agree life is fluid. This plays out in a multitude of ways – to quote John Lennon – life is what happens to you while you make other plans.

    However given this, and that EVERYTHING about life is fluid, using this argument as an excuse to stop someone who genuinely wants to end their life, regardless of circumstance, is wrong. People make snap decisions, people carefully plan out their next move – it doesn’t matter. Your life is yours – your body is yours. Your experiences – pain, joy, sorrow, happiness are all yours. No one else should have the right to dictate what you do to your body, and if dying by your own means in your own way is your choice, then that should be respected regardless of others views on the matter.

    Sure there are people who may well regret their decision to end it – not that those who are successful at it can be asked their view once they have died. But I believe if you genuinely try, regardless of success that was your decision and should be respected as your choice. If people want help they will seek it – it shouldn’t be foisted on them, nor should they be locked up to stop them from doing something they genuinely want to do for themselves.

    I will clarify that the above relates to you wanting to take your own life. Not someone else’s. And, if you care for others who cannot care for themselves then it is the hallmark of decency to consider those you are leaving behind. But ultimately it IS about you. Life is inherently selfish, and the arguments of people making it out as being so are also selfish in stopping you due to this moral argument – they would rather keep you here over their own selfish views opposed to respecting your choice.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Bob,

      You make excellent points. Many of the comments on this site have challenged my ideas and caused me to stretch my thinking. A problem that I run into intellectually is, would everything you say above still apply if the person is a child? How about if the person is an adult with 106 degrees fever who, in fever-induced delirium, wants to end their life, even though we can reasonably assume that when their delirium is treated they will return to their baseline mood (which, for the sake of this example, did not include suicidal wishes). And if you allow that these both are reasonable exceptions to your argument, then where does one draw the line? That is, if suicidal drives appear to be fueled by temporary despair (like a fever), then should the person be prevented from taking his or her life? My own sense is, yes, the person should be stopped. But that’s no surprise, I’m sure, given my stance on preventing suicide. I’m curious about your views, as well as the views of others who believe suicide is a person’s right.

    • Bob says:

      Hi Stacey

      I’ll admit there is possibly a philosophical debate here which can always translate down harder to individual circumstances.

      In your post you pose the issues of a child, or, of a person temporarily ill. Perhaps applying this more widely, do we as a society intervene where we make an assessment (valid or not) that the person making such a choice isn’t right in their mind, or in a state to make such a monumental decision as to end their life?

      The answer in my opinion to this, is i genuinely do not know. But what I do know/feel, is that to decide on someone’s behalf what is right for them, or to start forcibly making such decisions, is a slippery slope. There is no objective decision making in life as it is all coloured by our individual experiences or views – and this plays out in all aspects of the human condition. We sugar-coat the notion of objectivity, but underlying all decisions are an element of FEELING. From those who advocate right to life, all the way through to right to die.

      I agree it is sad when a person dies – and no one should be differentiating between intentional or non, even if they have had a good innings or not.

      But it’s not my place to judge nor influence as it wasn’t my time here – it was theirs.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Bob,

      Thank you for your thoughtful response to my question. I think we’re actually saying the same thing, just from different ends of the spectrum. It seems like you’re saying it’s hard to draw the line about when suicide is wrong. I’m saying it’s hard to draw the line about when suicide is a right.

      Your last line is very thought provoking. “It wasn’t my time here – it was theirs.” I can tell you with absolute certainty that there are people who, once their suicidal crisis or longstanding suicidal feelings resolve, are glad to have yet more time here. So, intervening with those people still honors that it is their time, in the same way that administering medical treatment to someone shot in a robbery serves their interests. (That’s just one example.) We don’t know who will be grateful to be alive in a year or many years’ time, although we do know that the vast majority of people who survive a suicide attempt decide afterward to stay alive.

      I stand firmly on the side of suicide prevention, except in cases of terminal illness when a physician could prescribe a medication that would make death less frightening and painful for the dying person. Yet as I said in my original reply to your comment, the comments on this site have stretched my thinking. I do wonder if there are times that mental pain should be considered the same as terminal illness. And then I go back to how many people recover from such intense mental pain and are grateful to be alive (or at least no longer want to die), and I feel a responsibility to err on the side of safety. And then I read another sound comment about the other side of the argument … and then I am back to my original question of where do we draw the line.

    • Chad N. says:

      This is actually directed to Ms. Freedenthal. You are trying to apply a logical fallacy to this discussion in that because you can find a possible exception to Bob’s individual choice argument invalidates the argument. If you flip the argument and say you have an elderly patient that has expressed their entire life that they wished to be euthanized rather than fade away due to alzheimer’s for example. Then as the disease sets in they have lucid periods of dementia in which they can’t even remember their own name let alone their disease and therefore don’t express a desire to die. Does this now temporary condition invalidate their life long position so that when the dementia fades you would have them informed they no longer have the right to choose? If you allow that exception then where do you draw the line? This is the logical flaw lies. There is no convenient line to draw. This is messy and hard every time. That’s why it’s so difficult for society, people only want easy answers.

      We are talking about a more than infinitely complex system. Each individual is different and even if they weren’t each individual’s circumstance is different. The situations must be judged on a case by case basis with deliberation every time. That’s the answer. It will likely not be pleasant often and always weigh on the minds of all involved from then on but that doesn’t mean we as a society should pretend it’s not worth doing.

      My current idea on how to handle this situation is simple. Use the same method that we currently use to determine legality of society ending a life. Stand up a jury system with a side to argue both for and against the requester truly wanting this. Given it’s not a criminal trial the process could be streamlined so you come in, hear both sides of the case and deliberate ending with an anonymous vote. Take the decision from the individual doctor or lawyer and give it to the people. Let them decide to grant permission, refuse it or delay their decision and come back to it on at agreed time. My only concern is that our society is not mature enough to ask what’s the right answer for another instead of trying to force the right answer for ourselves onto others. The difference between “what would I want in this situation” and “what do they want in this situation” seems confusing to most people but I think we can learn.

      I myself hope to die as soon as possible. Natural causes would be great but unlikely so I’m trying to figure out euthanasia. That’s what’s right for me in my mind but I know it’s not right for everyone. If I can figure out that difference I have faith that others can as well.

  196. Karen says:

    The only reason I’m here is because I can’t stand to inflict pain on others. “Life can change…it can get better!” Hasn’t in 30 years. It has been less bad. It has been tolerable. And yet always so blinking exhausting. I’m not even one of those folks that hate themselves. I have a lovely support network, nice friends, great family, I am well off. And yet it is so pointless. And there is so much busy work. And I’ve seen it all before. I’ve seen all the marvellous people who inspire me before. Inspire me for what? The human race is, on the whole, a pack of macaques, throwing poop at each other and blustering in their ignorance. Yes I love my individual people and I will stay to not cause them distress, but it doesn’t stop me from hoping for a stray lightening bolt or a quick and dirty heart attack.

  197. Nicola says:

    I think about dying every day I’ve tried pills and hanging myself but unfortunately I’ve failed for one reason or another, I should be able to go to my GP and have assistance with ending my life.

    • pained says:

      is there something that makes you feel this

    • satvik m says:

      Don’t die.

    • kathy says:

      Absolutely do not!!! My SO hung himself 1 year ago.You are beautiful! You leave with all the problems and learn the solutions were here. He is miserable he lets me know. Do your homework on what really happens to those who take their lives never mind the TORMENT we are left with.Stay for yourself.

  198. Anonymous says:

    I’ve always been scared to die, because of the uncertainty if what’s next, but I truly do not have a life worth living. It is full of nothing but pain and hopelessness. I have failed at everything in my life, marriage, motherhood, finances, everything. Perhaps doctor assisted suicide would be best. If only it was accessible everywhere to everyone.

    • Anonymous says:

      yes only over a review period of say two years especially if you dont believe in no marriage in afterlife like christians believe or any belief at least muslims have that right and im not muslim. jesus said in bible no marriage in heaven. what a horrible thought this book has been changed throughout time. when will we ever if ever have our own choice on how we look or live. many planets apparently out there dont let anybody take your dreams away from you now or never

    • Puck says:

      Very few are good at most things in life. Find some friends you can get along with well and do somethings let loose see what happens.
      Toxic parents are at the root of many personal problems, and it affects our relationships with others. Find a guy that likes you and does not want to change you in ways other than get you to have fun.

    • Misery says:

      I truly feel your pain. If I didn’t know better, I would have thought I wrote your above post as my own. I have zero purpose in life and only seem to ruin the lives of the ones I care most about. I just don’t understand why I’m still here. Good people with promising lives and purpose, even innocent children die every day, but I’m still here wasting space. I just don’t get it.

    • Anonymous says:

      This is me 100%

    • Anonymous says:

      What you said is me exactly except I’m not afraid to die. We go on because our soul does not die and we just go to the next life and anything we left unfinished we come back to work through again.

  199. pained says:

    hi since my spinal fusion for a disease in my spine that broke my back I have lived in absolute pain. everyday. I have an extremely awesome wife and 4 beautiful children ages 1 – 13. it brings me to tears to know that I won’t be around 1 day to see all their accomplishments but the pain has never stopped. I work full time as an assistant manager at a retail setting overnights. the work is heavy but it doesn’t matter if I’m at home or work the pain increases as the day does. for a few years I have contemplated the effects that my loved ones will endure. but I also think of the pain and heartbreak they endure now and none of them know the full extent of how bad it really is. but suicide is not something I have taken lightly. I’ve started to write my kids letters to help easy the pain they will feel and nothing would make my wife understand at all. but as the days goes by I get closer to the time when I must have everything ready cause I feel it inside my body the pain growing. and I’m not sure if it’s weeks or another year but I feel it is only when not if

    • Puck says:

      I understand how you feel, and your pain along with the pain I also feel everyday and many others as well. I see it as those who make rules on medications live a life where they can freely hurt and kill people along with their families without any consequences in this world. Things such as this make me and many others realize that we are not just living in the shadow of death, but it must be hell as if there were and afterlife it could not ne as bad as here. Many hurt and kill others by their actions and it is perfectly legal because they work for the government. Same can be said for all countries. We as people created government, and it is the most oppressive and leads to more death and suffering than anything else that we have created. All the privately held arms in the world could never kill as many as governments have in the last century. It is all about control… No surprise that for the most part people with psychopathic tendencies get into office all around the world more so than not. Merkel has been responsible for letting people into germany unchecked and they set fires, rape, rob, etc. Few of us are surprised by this because why else would we also have difficulty getting needed relief from pain, because of those that promote suffering un the world. What happened to to days that such people were often taken to the invention of a French doctor, and Louis 16th and many other such people that caused harm lost their heads.
      My friend please do come up with some ideas to solve the problems as some have with legal medical pot. All medications should be legal, and you and many other would not be suffering, and could die a natural death, not one from OD or some other misfortune to just end your suffering. Move to Oregon or california or another state. Somewhere you can get medications to enjoy life again.

  200. Common Sense says:

    Eventually death takes us all, it is inevitable and unavoidable. People treat death as something to be feared instead of something that is simply a part of life. No one lives forever and to do so would be the mental equivalent of dying a thousand deaths over and over again. You will die. It should be up to the individual to choose when. Whether it is sooner or later.

    • Charlotte says:

      I am with you Common Sense. In the progressive town where I live there is a big “Death and Dying” conversation going on and every week community organizations giving lectures on death and dying….the one true common denominator every single person on the planet shares…yet no one wants to discuss it.

      I worked in the hospice industry for awhile and witnessed on a daily basis patients being discharged from hospitals to hospice care 1-2 weeks and sometimes just days before they died.

      In just about every scenario I witnessed, the doctor, families and the patient all seemed to have been 1) uninformed or in denial of the loved ones terminal illness; 2) the patient was being treated up until the very end by drugs that were not curing their terminal illness and they were suffering with horrible side effects; 3) the patient and family member never had a conversation with their doctor about going into hospice (patients can be referred to hospice up to 6 months prior to a projected end of life prognosis); 4) patients and family members being “shocked” and “heartbroken” and “angry” when their loved one ends up in an emergency room near the end of their life only to be discharged to hospice the next day where they watched their loved one slip away in disbelief.

      My personal experiences as a funeral director’s daughter growing up in a funeral home, my career providing direct patient care in healthcare for decades treating terminally ill patients, and my experience working in hospice have all validated my belief that each and everyone one of us has the right to plan and execute their own death and to discuss their plan with the friends and families. And they should be able to do that without judgement or shame from any one. Generally speaking, as a culture we need to be speaking about death and dying more openly moving forward.

      I support assisted suicide not only for the terminally ill but for any human being who is suffering in any way and there is no recourse for improvement. When walking through a nursing home, or assisted living or even a high end senior living or memory care facility, I do not see people who are thriving nor are they happy. They have been put in these places because society does not value them anymore, they are sick or poor or can’t live alone anymore so their families want to get them settled somewhere so they can stop having to worry about them (we are one of the few cultures in the world who do not revere our elders nor do we personally care for them and keep them integrated into our communities) and so we “find them a home”.

      When I see vets out on the street corners begging for food or money and they are alone and covered in rags and most likely suffering from a mental or physical illness I believe in assisted suicide: when a person confined to a wheel chair for life who confides in me that they would rather die and meet their maker than continue to be a burden on family and friends and be confined to a life they do not want, I believe in assisted suicide: when people are suffering from depression, bipolar disorders or any other number of mental and emotional illnesses that severely impact their lives in a negative and non productive manner I believe in assisted suicide: when an elder, or anybody for that matter, finds themselves alone, with no family and friends, with no financial resources, no home, no access to affordable health care and no one who loves them or cares for them or has the time to help them, and especially if these people live in America where there are no resources to truly help them and improve their life, I believe in assisted suicide.

      Assisted suicide is humane. When I think of all the people every year around the globe who attempt or have succeeded in killing themselves in inhumane ways by gunshot, hangings, drug overdoses, slitting of the wrists, bathtub drownings or jumping out of windows or off bridges, I am for assisted suicide. If people have made the decision that they cannot go on any longer they should have the option of a dignified and medically induced death. Not everyone in America is living the dream. Not everyone in America is loved or cared for. Not everyone in America can afford to live in a home and have enough to eat. Not everyone in America has someone to depend on or take them in during the tough times. Not everyone in America is healthy and strong. For some people in America, life is to be endured and these people suffer relentlessly every day of their lives. For some people in America death is what will bring peace.

      With the baby boomers aging out over the next 10-15 years I do believe more and more of that demographic will consider assisted suicide if they find themselves alone, poor, or living with a chronic or terminal illness.

      I remember reading a book of short stories by Kurt Vonnegut book (Science Fiction) called “Welcome to the Monkey House” One of the stories was about your “expiration day”. The planet had become so crowded and science and medicine was so advanced keeping people alive much longer than they should be, the government implemented a death lottery so to speak. If you were over a certain senior age you would get a lottery ticket in the mail that designated your termination date. It was just like a birth announcement but it was your death announcement instead.

      Society accepted it, death was out in the open and discussed with your families and friends. It was a planned event and on your termination date you met all your friends and family at a restaurant for your last dinner all together and then you were escorted to your death by way of lethal injection. Even to my 13 year old mind, this seemed the most humane way to perish. I for one do not want to leave my death to chance. If we are all dying I want to be in control of my death. And nobody should judge it or argue it or try to stop a person from planning their death. Yes there needs to be a standard of assessment certainly but I do believe we are moving toward a similar model of death and dying as the author Kurt Vonnegut foresaw half a century ago.

      I think nearly everything a science fiction author writes about comes true.

  201. Samantha T says:

    I know I will die at my own hands eventually. I’ve attempted several times, but unsuccessfully. I’m bipolar, and I’m miserable. I’m on meds that help some, but it’s a never ending battle. I get so exhausted riding this emotional rollercoaster. Physician assisted suicide should be legal!!

  202. chris s says:

    death should be welcomed not prevented. even in cases of said “mental illnesses” it should be left up to the individual ONLY. its the individual’s life not anyone else’s. since when did mankind change their minds to say someone else can make choices for another as if the other person’s life is their own?

    • Tom Hal says:

      “since when did mankind change their minds to say someone else can make choices for another as if the other person’s life is their own?” HEAR, HEAR!

  203. Anonymous says:

    I hate myself. I hate everything about me. But I have a child I love more. So, I can’t be suicidal. I hope sometimes an accident will take me. Sometimes I hope love will take me.

  204. Anonymous says:

    I was suicidal when I was 3. A boy was playing too rough and I couldn’t breathe and I panicked. After that, and got a little bit older I tried to hold my breath for death. Then I imagined what a butter knife could do. I was very little and not sexually abused. I have extremely young memories. So I know my self hatred wasn’t caused by abuse. So, why do I hate myself so much? I think if I stop wanting anything, nothing matters.

  205. Anonymous says:

    I have given up. Life is not worth living. Death is on my mind frequently, and I wish to build up the courage to finally end my miserable existence. I never asked to be born on this earth. To experience pain and suffering daily… I can’t handle it anymore. I want out.

    • Anonymous says:

      To read your words, makes me sad–not pity but sad. I’m sorry to hear you are in pain. As a religious person that I am, I pray that you will find your peace and joy.

    • Puck says:

      First of all none of us asked to be born into this world. Also Buddha said that life is suffering that is one of the many noble truths. You have to choose as each of us do, what do you find interesting and seek it out. Sitting in front of a tv is one of the worst things that people can do. It is filled with programming to make people feel bad about themselves. Is the idea that you would be a better person if you buy their garbage. Seek out things away from tv and magazines. Have you thought about being a goth?

    • Andrew says:

      I know the feeling but each new day offers something new and a new positive potential for your life even if it is really really small to begin with. The world is a cruel mistress but each day you can pull yourself from miserable existence into a meaningful life day by day. I am not fully there yet but I know the darkest hours of my life I am glad I did not go through ending it all.

      That thought that you never asked to born is a true one but perhaps the existence in you before you were born wanted the chance to be on this earth, listen to the quiet voice in yourself and not the loud one that can’t handle it anymore.

    • Anonymous says:

      What are you afraid of? Death is your end, so make a list of everything that scares you and do them. Then, decide, was it that scary?

    • Anonymous says:

      As someone who feels the same way, I must ask the question…what do you want out of this life? Sitting back and waiting for it will fail. If you don’t fear death, than why fear life? It’s all you have. Your life is all you have so why fear anything? Certainly, death is worse than anything you want. Right? Fuckem. Be who you are.

  206. Tom Hal says:

    I’ve been reading these comments (thanks to the auto-inform function) every few days since this is one of the most important modern (would be) rights battles to me. I want to respond to and encourage–is that the right word?–everyone posting here so much of their searing truth. But I don’t, out of fearing to offend. If only policy makers would listen to the perspectives, feelings, experiences of millions of adults begging for a medically competent and humane exit from life. As others here and elsewhere put it, it’s irrational at once to make life difficult (especially for those who already cannot manage life’s stresses), and at the same time to forbid those who want out to leave.

    If you cannot care for people, and you argue the system cannot be made gentler, then minimally allow those who cannot play your game the freedom to leave the room.

    • Joan Of Arc says:

      I feel like in the end the decisions are ours.

    • Tom Hal says:

      Joan, I agree with you, that the decision is ours, despite what “the authorities” say. Those experienced enough with the mental health system know–or quickly learn–that if they are serious about leaving the last thing they should do is announce it, as the system is empowered to incarcerate those who set in motion their departure.

      But without professional, near-certain means available, the results of the decision are far too often extremely painful. The last thing someone who’s overwhelmed with a lifetime of pain needs on making a decision to leave is to suffer while leaving–or worse, to suffer and then not even succeed in leaving.

  207. Cynthia says:

    Being a chronically ill person that has died and been brought back 5 times, i feel it is up to the person to choose to continue to suffer and to just be allowed to say i have had enough. I had dnr orders in place and they still went against me. Have a heart, this is not living it is merely surviving amoung the living. Waiting for the end, but it seems to take its time….Legalize assisted suicide in all states

  208. Dg says:

    Everyone should have a choice healthy or dying, and there should be institutions helping to die. Life with severe depression is so unbearable, I pray every night so I could die asleep. It is not temporary I’ve been this way all my life and I have enough.

  209. Linda says:

    This is not by any means an end of life situation… a person paralyzed trapped in their own brain, inability to express any wishes or desires !

  210. Anonymous says:

    Well people want to die because them might be having problems with there family or friends and no one cares about them

    • Anonymous says:

      What if nobody cares? Not one person cares? Does that mean no one will? If you are my age, no one will. Or maybe, you haven’t made the effort to find your world. Or maybe you have. Maybe, there is something in this life that makes you happy. Focus on that and a brand new world opens up to you.

    • Sandra says:

      thats right like me

  211. Paul says:

    I do not think that suicides should always be prevented, but on the other hand.

    There are those that would not be even thinking of suicide if our systems worked properly in the first place.

    We have people that due to lack of money and regulations suicide is basically their only option, and I see this as terribly wrong.

    We as a society should not be pushing people to the point that they basically have no other option.

    Those people should be stopped, only if we are going to hold those accountable that pushed them to that point in the first place.

    Due to the corruption that we have in this country I really do not see that happening anytime soon unfortunately.

    • Tom Hal says:

      Paul, are you a US citizen? I ask because, otherwise, the postage might be quite expensive to mail to you your gold star. Terrific comment, mate.

    • Paul says:

      Tom, I live in southern california. I have seen Kaiser nearly kill me, my wife and a number of my friends due to refusal to do simple tests. Also I am in pain much of the time because we live in a society that thinks that using pain killers make people high. The only high that I and most that I know have ever had is a brief relief from pain that is much like being on fire electrocuted and drawn and quartered. Of course people are happy they feel like they did before they were injured.
      What I personally do not get is the live at all costs mentality. There are many things that are far worse than death, such as pain 24/7 being burned alive. Or as many of us would say in constant pain. Pain so much that we no longer enjoy the taste of food, no longer get really any more pleasure from sex than just holding someone close. This is a cruel world only made more so by control freaks that are more worried about the possibility that someone might get a buzz from a medication or potentally abuse it, than take into account that without such medications life really has no enjoyment. I quit worrying about possible health problems, the possibility of heart or stroke. Also in a way look forward to the possibility of a full on nuclear war, as my pain and suffering and that of others will be gone along with those that get enjoyment by having us live in pain each and every day. I in no way have any ill feelings towards myself, but if a God was coming that was going to wipe out most of mankind as in the great flood I would say that he would be right for doing so as it is just as wrong to let people harm innocents as it is to do it yourself. We as a species have the ability and have shown to be the most destructive and cruel of all the animals on this planet. However there are exceptions, some strive to be better, and some even strive to be Ubermen that look to make the world better for all, but unfortunately they are a minority.

    • Paul says:

      What gets me down is back pain that hurts worse than a 3rd degree burn. Getting medication to get the pain down is very difficult due to the CDC saying that opiates don’t help chronic pain. Also reclassification of hydrocodone. In addition morphine does not help a whole lot.

      It is because of the level of pain and the great difficulty of getting any doctor these days to prescribe pain medication so I can function that I have been thinking of suicide. It is very sad that I have been forced to the point of thinking about suicide because of laws being more important than my life. I love myself and my family, but when I have the franchise tax board and others after me because I am hurting so much most of the time that I am unable to fill out basic paperwork that should be a breeze to anyone with the legal, science and engineering education I have. Most of the time I am unable to figure out how to send people bills. This is insane that I have to live with such debilitating pain. My family and many others are worried about me. However it is illegal for me to make what I need to function and difficult to get doctors to help me. Death is the easiest solution, but it will do the most harm. However that looks to be the final result as I just can’t take care of myself as I should be able to do so because it has been made illegal for me to do so.

    • Tom Hal says:

      Paul, I’m sorry I’m only now replying to your comments. First, and most importantly, I’m terribly sorry for your pain. I get what you’re saying. Living with chronic pain can evaporate all pleasures. And those who are not living with chronic, extreme pain cannot fathom what you’re going through. Yet they tell you how you should live your life–what you should find bearable. Reprehensible.

      And you’re also right that our concern for addiction, legally and medically, has created a culture hostile to those living with chronic pain. Together with the corruption of insurance companies, the challenge of enduring worsening pain through the decades for many is just insurmountable.

      Maybe worst of all, eventually those who are NOT living with chronic pain (may) choose to abandon those who are. They call it self-preservation. Funny how we’re free to abandon people, but still, those whom we’ve abandoned we refuse to allow to exit life.

      Again, I’m terribly, terribly sorry you’re in pain. I wish I could take it away.

  212. kws says:

    some of us have unsolvable problems. mine is the death of my spouse. how will continuing to live ever solve that? how is that a “temporary problem”? why should the rest of my life be an unending series of coping mechanisms, no true happiness, just to make everyone around me feel comfortable? living for others is not a life, it is living death.

    • Joan Of Arc says:

      The answers are all your own. I will not pretend to understand your pain, but I do know pain. No one can justify the date you choose to exit this world, that is all on you. I say that because in this life I feel like we’re not in control of anything in this world, but I’d be a fool to give someone jurisdiction over whether I choose to live or die.

  213. X says:

    I used to think that I lived a charmed life. Happy childhood and all that. When I really look back on it, it was tough. Lots of issues in the family. Abuse, instability of all kinds. I guess I just got good at blocking it all out. Just to get along. In the past couple of years I’ve been through a divorce after a 20 plus year marriage and all that comes with that. Loss of two houses, job loss, bankruptcy, homelessness, though with help I’ve managed to stay off the streets. For now, anyway. Been pretty bad. I have no contact with a step daughter I helped raise for all that time. Heard she just got married. I wasn’t notified. For the best I’m sure. Still, it hurts. Don’t know what I did that was so bad but life ain’t fair bla, bla, bla. People are so critical and judgmental, especially in my family. It always hurt. I never judged suicides. I get it, especially now. The marriage was very difficult and I’ve thought about suicide many times. Life was very hard as a teen and I thought about it alot back then and since. I think that if a person wants to end their life for whatever reason they should be able to do so with dignity and as little pain as possible. They’ve had enough of all that. For now, I just wish I wasn’t here. I feel like I’ve done what I’m here to do. I just want to leave. Not a FU to anyone or anything. I’m just really tired and very disappointed with life. Just very weary of it all.

    • Sune says:

      I sympathize with you. I am very tired and sick of this life. I have felt this way for over 20 years now. There’s nothing more I’m interested in experiencing, as most things and people have just caused me pain anyway.

      I have no fear of death, and have attempted years ago, but was unfortunately saved. The only thing keeping me here now is the pure agony the attempt put my dad through. I don’t want to cause him pain.

      But I’m just so..done. I feel like I’m just hanging on for other people’s happiness, wearing a mask.

  214. Ddp says:

    I truly believe that if an individual who is contemplating suicide confides in someone enough to tell them…well, I don’t think they will actually commit suicide. Instead, it’s a last ditch effort and a cry for help. Most people who finish the deed don’t say anything and most of the time, friends & family have no idea how bad things really are. Suicide is not a cowardly, selfish or selfless act, but a relief. A relief, no more pain, agony, misery or suffering. Unless, you have been in a similar situation or dealt with severe or major depression it’s difficult to relate or understand for that matter. You have no idea what the other person was feeling, what they dealt with on a regular basis or the struggles they endured. The ones who expect someone to live in so much pain & misery are the ones who are being selfish!

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      This is beautifully said. I do want to make one correction, though. Research studies have found that most people who die by suicide did communicate their wishes to someone else (often more than one “someone else”) before doing so, usually a friend or family member. I add this information only so that people will not minimize the risk if someone they know discloses a wish to die by suicide. Telling others does not mean the person is not truly in danger of ending their life.

    • Heber says:

      Finally someone who speaks the truth. Thanks so much for that please post everywhere.

  215. Anonymous says:

    No they should not be stopped if a person has been thinking of suicide for ages. If it is something maybe for a year or so then they should be stopped

  216. Heber says:

    If there is a possibility of getting better then yeah but after years of suffering then why put people through what you wouldn’t put a animal through. Have a heart.

  217. No says:

    Yeah as females we are told we are equals until the ex absolves all responsibility then we have to walk into a life that works for a female & maintains their previous earning capacity. Guess what!!!!!? There’s no equality do what you can

  218. Lewis E says:

    It’s strange when you sincerely give thought to ending your own life. Personally I have a rather logical method of thinking. It can be both a boon or a hinderance.

    I’ve been playing with the thought of cutting ties for around eight years. I’m 24 years old, average Job, decent education and a caring family. I’ve never had a real interest in starting a relationship with someone. My sex live is non-existent and my sexual drive even more so.

    Many will sit and list off their reasons for ending it all, and many others will try to categorise these individuals. Giving them a “label” so to speak. I.e. Depressed or mentally unstable etc. In my own opinion, these labels exist to make the sheer thought of suicide acceptable to others. “If we can categorise it, we can try to medicate it; understand it.”

    Well, if I may I’ll share something I stumbled across when I was much younger.

    Growing up, I was always taught to think ahead. See plan your road ahead before flying blind. This, I now know and see as mental conditioning. I was conditioned in such a way as to always worry. Worry about bills, who may be a friend who may not. Worry about if I’ll grow old alone, or if I got the perfect grade on my exams. Think of the future and worry your ass off thinking about everything that could go wrong. This way if I’ll do everything in my power to stay on the right path always worrying always concerned about what may lie ahead.

    I can confidently say I’m not depressed, I have no real gripes with who I am as a person and I couldn’t care less what anyone else may think of me.

    I weigh 310lbs, and spend most of my time either working, or listening / playing music.

    However, I’ve always thought to myself, why?

    Why work when I don’t care about money? Why socialise if I don’t care what others think? Why eat healthy if I don’t really fear death? Why excersize if I don’t fear about my phisique?

    Why?

    And there isn’t an answer, many will try to justify it by saying, what about your family? Or what about your dreams or ambitions? Or some will even say you’ll eventually find a way to cope.

    What if there was someone out there like myself that didn’t see the point in existing? People thrive by defining goals. Oh’ I’ll buy my house when I’m 27, or I’ll get married by 30. What if someone didn’t see the point in defining goals. Ultimately we all end up in the ground anyway? Right?

    And yes some can say, “it’s all about the experience of life…” what experience?

    From what I gather a nine to five job, juggling what people think of you and trying to keep up with the trends of today are all superficial? What’s the point? It always equals the same result.

    I can’t comment for most but I don’t fear death. I really don’t, I fear what may be after it. But only because I don’t know what that is.

    I’m not religious, I have no thoughts on the supernatural ongoings; or even a belief in reincarnation. But I still don’t know.

    Ultimately what I’m trying to say is, I want to cut ties. I know how to and I’m not afraid of the process. However it’s not because I’m depressed or mentally ill, lonely or for any other reasons you might think.

    I just wanna quit. I’f I were to try to explain it really simply, it’s kinda like exiting a game. You quit because your bored. I guess you could call it that. Boredom. I’m bored of this life and the sorry excuse for existence people call living. So why continue.

    If I’m alive 60 years from now, I’ll still be thinking the same way. The only difference would be that I would be thinking, what was the point in that?

    Ultimately I guess I’m frustrated with how people always categorise suicide. Oh he had depression, or she was clinically mental. What about the guy that just wants to quit simply because he can.

    • Puck says:

      Louis, your words do reflect life. They go along with many of the great thinkers and philosophers in recorded history. In fact Monty Python did a movie about it called the meaning of life. A few other things that you may find interesting one is The God Delusion, and another is by Peter Gilmore his book on Satanism. You may find some meaning in Modern Satanism. As you said no fear of death, not sure if there is even anything after life.

      Something that most do not get (mainly the Faithful) is why go on when you have nothing really good to look forward to in life. If life is nothing but suffering no pleasures. It is not really life, but purely just existence. For life there needs to be balance. Even Buddha said life is suffering, but when existence is only suffering and pain with pain more and more each day. One has to be into enjoying harm coming to them to go on. One should not live to the point that they are suffering to the point of writing on the walls with bodily fluids etc. In other words why cause yourself suffering to the point where it causes insanity.

    • Tom Hal says:

      Bravo!

    • DeezNutz says:

      I’m in the same boat….in going on 28
      ..
      I first realized I wanted to die when I was may be 3 4 or 5 years old…all this time later….I’m the selfish one that needs to get help?….as I tell everyone that gets sad about a death “you couldn’t be so lucky”

    • RaIn says:

      Seriously Lewis.. When people say:” You just took the words out of my mouth ” Well. This is one of the those cases, This was spot on EXACTLY what i’m thinking about life. It was honestly a little bit scary to read, because it was just like my words that i’ve said to others for the last 2-3 years. The only part that differs is that i’ve thought that i have suffered from depression.

      But is it really depression?

      I have no desire in the world anymore, and i’m not interested in any job working from 8-5 everyday and come home to dinner. I’m not interested in socializing with people going on trips long away having “fun”. I don’t want any new experiences, because i simply do not enjoy it. It feels like i’m just an old soul who’s tired of life in general and just wants peace and nothing. And i’ve felt this way since i was 12-13 years old. Now i’m 24.

      The one thing that scares me though from exiting this game, is what i fear is gonna come after it. Like what the hell happens? That scares me a lot.

      I’m glad i read on this site and found you Lewis, it was such a relief that someone else share the same thoughts about life as i do.

      Therapists doesn’t understand me, or refuse to. They don’t wanna see the truth behind someone’s life. People can call you crazy for saying stuff like that, but you know what i think? I think it’s just more awareness. You are more aware then other people. You think a lot deeper, and you need something more. Doing this superficial things isn’t enough for you. You need something that gives you an emotion. Like music for example. That’s the only thing to me that gives me a real emotion and i actually can be happy,when i listen to it. Or if i watch a FANTASTIC movie. It’s sad that it has ended up like this, and i wish i could just enjoy life as my friends do. Without any worries and just have fun. But it’s not that easy for me. I’m on another level..

    • Brent F. says:

      It especially maddening for myself in the boredom department in that problems other people have that they bring on themselves I find no problem avoiding. Don’t have sex, don’t do recreational drugs, don’t get married, avoid working too hard….this is so trivially boring and predictable…it’s not a challenge…. If this was the biblical times my arm would be so tired throwing the first stone. Being a total vacuum of sin has it’s perks…but why is everyone else having so much trouble…Boooorring!

  219. Heatre says:

    I have high functioning autism, bpd depression and anxiety. I have lived with it all my life and am so tired of it. I think people should have the same right to die as they do to live. I have no quality of life, spend all day alone in bedroom with no social contact except my once a month to check if I am dead yet. Let the severely mentally ill die if they choose to.

  220. Anonymous says:

    I think having major depression, anxiety and severe OCD which cannot be cured the person should be allowed to die with no quality of life.

  221. abcd says:

    suicide is very personal and i think only the suicidal person’s opinion is valid. i think suicide should be legal (it is laughable that it is and had been illegal in so many places) and access to safe and humane suicide should be legal.

    • Tom Hal says:

      “suicide is very personal and i think only the suicidal person’s opinion is valid.”

      If our species survives ourselves, in the distant future humans will look back on this assertion as self-evident. It’s a profound commentary on how fallible we are that an entire professional discipline has evolved in direct opposition to this concept, and worse, has coerced the law to deprive us of the freedom to exit life–the same law that enables structures, like different classes of discrimination, refusal to uphold laws enacted to protect the elderly, the infirm, and the disempowered, legal representation far outside the reach of most in cost, financial depredation on the poor…, which make life so detestable for many who then seriously contemplate leaving life.

  222. john says:

    I believe that if a person’s life is truly miserable, physician-assisted suicide should be legal. There is no point in living if you’re just going to be miserable. Why take anti-depressants or painkillers because those are just a temporary solution to a possibly permanent problem?

    • Tom Hal says:

      “(Treatment is) a temporary solution to a (possibly) permanent problem.” Very nice way to turn a hackneyed, vacuous statement on its head. (“Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem.”) Just as treatment only sometimes works (and often doesn’t), life problems are sometimes permanent.

    • Brent F. says:

      These pharmaceutical companies do not create cures. They create CUSTOMERS. In a fire house somewhere there is a light bulb that has been burning since 1903 with almost a million hours on it. Making such a light bulb is no way to sell light bulbs. If they made a cure for being a child-killing maniac they would not be able to sell pills that fight the global warming of their mind with central air-conditioning. It’s the old spear and shield paradox. Humans have the ability to make their world wonderful and far more wealthy than it is now, however we choose the local optimum.

  223. Anonymous says:

    I have combat-related PTSD, and am completely unresponsive to medication and therapy. Since I have to live with it for the rest of my natural life, and since my self-destructive behavior and extreme loneliness show no signs of abating, suicide seems like a good solution to end this suffering.

  224. Mrsomeone says:

    Fuck life, they say life is a gift but just look how damn miserable things are, wish i never come to this stupid world, been bullied by my father over years, been bullied by my familly as well, been bullied at school to the point i was damn afraid to go there, have no friends, have no girlfriend, no money, all alone, despite all i used to enjoy a lot of things like music, girls, going to church, learning new thing, computers, videogames etc… but dude, now im so messed up that i dont even give a heck about anything, even porn, and now i hear that bullshit that if you suicide you go to hell, what the hell, life is already a mess

    • Puck says:

      Makes one think about if God is really good and letting such things happen, the devil must be the good guy. Much as in the book 1984 where peace is war. Love is hate. Etc.

    • nunya says:

      I feel you, im all alone. no one to help me. grew up dirt poor, less than a thousand a month. dad died when i was two. no family. always getting screwed with. why bother. why suffer. ill have to break the law to get any real money then ill go to prison. whats the point.

  225. Anonymous says:

    When I finally get the courage to end it I don’t want to be stopped.

    • Puck says:

      This is one reason that one should not talk to any doctor about this. They will only be interested in stopping you, and have no interest in resolving the problems that make you feel that way in the first place.

      One such thing for me is Chronic Pain, and getting medication for it is insanely difficult.

      Why are doctors, and other heath care people along with law enforcement and many others more concerned about drug abuse, and possibility of addiction than people being so miserable in pain that death is more of a Godsend than just an end to ones life.

      Fact of the matter when a doctor says that they are worried about your safety, they are actually saying that they are more worried about possible legal action against them than your life or the lives of your family members left behind.

      Do not believe for one moment that your elected officials will do anything to solve this, as they are only interested in control

  226. Robert w says:

    I have leukemia;a horrible cancer. I have a wife that is a pathological liar. She lies especially for money. She steals things from me, the house, etc to sell to get money for I don’t know why. I’m tired of trying to live with my 48 years of grand mal epilepsy, heart surgeries, and now cancer that can manifest itself itself in wherever and whenever it wants. I’m tired and just want to get out of the stress. pray that I will Very, Very soon! I’m 61 and tired and fed up with fighting. Hopefully I won’t live to be 62.

  227. Heather K says:

    NO, I do not. Life is hell. If you haven’t been in this person’s situation do not judge them. I am. I have demons, killing me slowly at their own will. I have two sons grown and living their own lives. My parents are gone. My siblings are either passed or have their own families they love and celebrate with. I have one “friend” who really has her own family and life to continue on I have my dog who is growing old having her own problems, seizures, strokes etc. When she is gone I am alone. I am miserable in life. I do not have a significant other. And My future does not look bright and hopeful.. When you have someone who feels like this, why would you deny them something who could bring them peace? Life is not happy. Life is hard, life is miserable, life is heartbreaking, life is painful!!! I have lived my life through my children who have been EVERYTHING to me!!! And now they are grown and living their lives. I am a burden to everyone who knows and knew me. I WiSH I had to courage to take my own life!! Why can’t I?? I pray and wish every damn day for someone to hit me head on, something that happens to others, don’t take them, take me!!! I want to go. I don’t want to stay in this hell that I live in. yes, others are worse off than me. I am struggling with depression, bipolar, anxiety! PLEASE, PLEASE take me! I wish, I beg, I pray that this will end! If those that are struggling with severe mental issues can’t get out, isn’t there some way to help them???? Medications only do so much!!! Therapy only does so much!!! PLEASE tell me, PLEASE I beg of someone to please get me out of this hell.

    • Tom Hal says:

      Thanks for sharing so honestly with the rest of us. I think a lot of people around the world feel as you do, but they’re frightened to be open about their feelings. You notice that most of those who forbid others to take their own lives and who block all attempts to legalize euthanasia (of humans) are also those who advocate self-reliance, taking care of yourself, in a world even they admit is extremely competitive. They won’t give people jobs who desperately need them. They won’t provide housing and other survival resources that quality-of-life is intrinsically linked to. And they are so busy with their own lives that they won’t be there to keep us company through the long, hard night. No, they tell us, instead, we have GOT to find ways to entertain ourselves, to care for ourselves–as if merely saying “got to” translates into viable ways to do so. You’d think that, so fed up with the incompetence of those who can’t or won’t adapt to the world the successfully acclimated have created, the anti-suicide pundits would be happy to be rid of the social burdens who will never conform or become what is expected of them.

    • Joan Of Arc says:

      I feel exactly the same as you, except for the fact that I have no human kids. I have a dog and a cat and they are my world. If anything were to happen to them that will be my ticket out of this fucked up vortex called life. I say the same things as you do. I wish I had a loving parent like you. I’m 30 years old and feel like this life was given to me as a torture mechanism. Everything consist of slaving from 9 to 5, pay bills, eat, pay more bills and stress about my upcoming doom. Reading what you’ve typed is hurting me in many ways. I feel like I’ve known you for years. I wish that I can let you know that you are needed and loved by so many including me. Know that you’ve done your best, you gave your kids an amazing foundation to build on, loving arms to run to when needed. I love you and I hear you.

    • Puck says:

      Have you ever thought of selling everything you can, dispose of the rest. Then move to another country?

  228. Dee says:

    I believe that assisted suicide is good in some cases. We live in a society that is fast paced and leaves little empathy for people that are living with daily excruciating pain. Pain medication helps but it also leaves one with a feeling of numbness. When you can no longer partake in life, all you do is stay in bed because you are too weak to get up. I believe it is a welcoming end to allow you to move on into a peaceful afterlife.

  229. KK says:

    I have been constantly making mistakes in school, work, and life for the past 34 years. I live in constant anguish, despair and severe mental pain. I nearly always feel as if my stomach is full of writhing snakes. No matter how hard I try I screw up in ways that often have a huge negative impact and look incredibly foolish. People ridicule then avoid me. I switch jobs every couple of years to escape. Many rounds of therapy, medication, education , meditation havent helped. I live 22 of 24 hours in misery.

    I have no friends. I don’t know how to make friends. People seem to forget me even after meeting me several times. I hate it.

    I attempted suicide in the summer of 1990 but didn’t pull the trigger. I thought that I would give myself another chance for things to get better. They didn’t. I now wish I put that .41 magnum bullet through my brain. I think about that multiple times every day.

    However, now I have kids and it is more complicated. As much as I am truly a loser I risk damaging them emotionally at their current ages.

    However, I reserve the right to end my terrible pain. When the youngest turns 19 I will do it. The revolver and rounds are patiently waiting for me.

    Depression is a disease. In my case, the cause is extreme screwing up. Diseases
    can be terminal. That is my situation. I hate being told that depression can always be cured. They don’t say that about cancer. Forcing people to suffer endlessly is the height of cruelty.

    We do have a choice and one of those choices is suicide.

    • Puck says:

      Have you thought about moving to another state that requires doctors to help those in pain so that suicide is not the only option available to you. It is very sad that people here in this country are helped none or very little. Then the problem only comes out when people die. Instead of doing the right thing and helping before that is the only way out of the problem. There are many ways that someone could do such, but the question should be what and how you want to be remembered. Christ basically committed suicide by allowing himself to be taken for the sake of his followers. We all hurt sometimes physically other times mentally and both. However those that are usually said to be sane are the ones best able to hide their pain. This is something that all should keep in mind.

    • MB says:

      I wish I could make you feel better KK. I believe people should be able to choose plus get support in that. I hope that things do change for you, you seem really sweet and people should be more supportive of you. I hope life becomes great soon and you make good friends too. Not to prevent suicide but to make you feel better.

  230. Puck says:

    First of all I love myself and do not like the way that I am treated by overall society and by government control. Suicide would be one of the most powerful ways that I could take control of my life, that has been taken from me through oppression and suffering that could have easily been prevented. I have spinal problems that cause me great pain, difficulty with balance, and ability to walk. I have not been able to run in years. I could have been helped years ago by forcing medical providers to perform surgery for my back problems due to stenosis and frontal sinus pain as well. However medication was the route chosen for me because it is less expensive. Then years later have the medications that I now am dependant on as a result of that path that was chosen for me to be regulated to the point that now getting the medications that I am dependant on through no action of my own doing to be made more and more difficult to obtain and more expensive out of my pocket as well. Suicide is the only option that I can afford at this point for things that could have been medically solved years ago when I had good insurance compaired to no insurance now thanks to ACA and our government.

  231. Dad says:

    Suicide – The only mistake you will ever make that’s permanent!

    • Chad N. says:

      I think it’s great that you feel that way. I’m jealous in fact because I don’t feel that way at all. I want an end. I know more could come and that I may be able to eventually fool myself into thinking I’m happy with the completely different life than what I actually want. The issue is I just don’t want to. I am by no means going to try to force you to want what I want so please don’t try to force me to want what you want. Mutual respect, that’s all we’re asking for. You go enjoy your life ending slowly as you want and we go enjoy it ending quickly…. either way we’re both choosing our own way for it to end.

    • Tom Hal says:

      The assertion that suicide is a mistake is, and I do not mean to attack anyone, absurd. First, taken literally it’s illogical. By definition suicide is intentional, not a mistake, excepting scenarios in which somebody tries to stage a suicide but accidentally kills her-/himself. Taken as a broader claim about what one ought to do, the assertion is insulting and presumptuous. Elsewhere, others have already argued that life can be unbearable DESPITE therapy and drugs and faithfully following the counsel of so-called expert-after-expert. But more importantly, just as it’s no one else’s place to declare that someone who chooses divorce, or dropping out of medical school, or countless other major life events is making “a mistake,” despite the substantial consequences of those choices, it’s also no one else’s place to decide that an adult’s choice to leave life is “a mistake.”

      Just because modern psychology declares suicide is usually the consequence of some kind of mental problem doesn’t make that statement true beyond the obvious–that those who choose to leave life must very much dislike their experiences of life. Duh. If I am wrong, please share the empirical evidence–including the cause-effect biomolecular model of pathology, not mere statistical associations among psychosocial variables.

      If YOU do not want to commit suicide, then don’t commit suicide. Otherwise, I suggest it’s a more effective intervention to lower suicide rates by working on making the world the kind of place people want to stay alive in.

  232. V says:

    It’s my life and I would like to have the option to end it with dignity, without being pushed to have pieces of my brain splattered on the wall or something similar. I don’t want it, I never wanted it, every day is painful and I wish it was over already.

    • terri says:

      I feel the same way. I am hoping for a sudden natural death so my family doesn’t have to deal with me killing myself, but holding on is getting harder every day. Right now, I am in constant physical pain (this is stupid) and I am hoping that the amount if NSAIDs that I am taking will kill the one kidney I have. I can refuse dialysis. I read that kidney failure isn’t too bad a way to go. I’m pathetic.

  233. Anonymous says:

    Seriously contemplating killing myself and i do not begrudge anyone who did so.

  234. Cavepool says:

    I love what the comedian Maria Bamford says about suicide: “If you stay alive for no other reason, please do it for spite.” Damn right. That said, it’s a personal choice and no one else’s business.

  235. Anonymous says:

    i feel like dying right now

  236. Angel says:

    Desperate attempts to keep those who wish to leave is very arrogant and bigoted. Death, in my opinion, is not the end. But it is a new beginning. Whether we die and go to heaven/hell, whether we die and NOTHING happens just lights out, or whether we are incarnate/reincarnated into another life or form of life, death is an illusion and is not “permanent”. You will, no matter your beliefs, enter another life where your soul/plana/chi/etheric body or consciousness, will continue. I know this to be fact, but because we live in such a left brained fear based society, I cannot claim this indefinitely per my own experience. That is for you to decide. Death is a human construct that is a derivative of our fear of the unknown. Us, as humans, fear that which we do not understand. But if you delve into your “SELF” and ask yourself the right questions, the fear will subside as the right answers come. Nothing is new under the sun, and no matter is created in this universe, yet is only redistributed, since the mass of the universe(s) remain finite. Don’t fear death, welcome it as it is inevitable for ALL of us in this form. BUT, understand that if you do resort to suicide, much like Tylenol, it’s only a temporary solution to a temporary problem. And you’ll find yourself, aware of it or not, fighting the same battles in your next life/stage, of your life.

    Do not for one second think that your problems will go away, because that is a common misconception. Trust me, someone who struggles with manic depression, I know the struggle all too well. But it won’t fix anything. You’ll instead be denying yourself the opportunity of fixing this issue NOW by prolonging it, to be fixed in another present moment.

    I won’t tell you, or myself, to “NOT KILL YOURSELF”, but I will say that YOU DO MATTER!

    I know this all too well, and wish that someone said this to me, but it isn’t the case. And I know that sometimes all we want is to hear that from family or those we care about, but know that we are all family. That we are all in this together. That this TOO SHALL PASS. It is only the beginning. Not the end. So make your choice based on your own free will, and understanding of what is to come. Two choices are only available to those who are contemplating these measures: 1) Kill yourself and deal with your residual energy (emotion – energy in motion) or 2) refrain from doing so, and get the help and support that you need, in this life.

    Whatever you choose, peace be with you. Namaste. And I LOVE YOU!

    We never truly die, we simply transform and evolve. However you wish to understand this passage is your choice. Know it to be truth.

  237. Adam says:

    According to numerology the holder of the name AMY suffers a lot,try to change your name to a strong name such as Sara

  238. Grumpy says:

    I think there should be always the choice to die. Even if you are content with life and still want to leave. i always want to die. Just do not want to be part of this system. You work to live . I do not want to. Nobody gave me any choice if i wanted to be born. I see what people do to this planet and i just don’t want to be part of that. Even if you try to be better the system requires you be part. You need to eat. Need to work .need transport yourself. Need heat at home. Multiple times per day i wish i would die that night. I don’t want be part of any relationship. I do not want to be here. Not this planet. Not this time. Not this universe.

  239. Tina says:

    I think suicide is a great way to end suffering. Life is terrible. Just die if you want to. I mean, what’s the point of life anyway?

  240. Anonymous says:

    I’m ready right fucking now

  241. Anonymous says:

    I believe suicide is a relief from a life of torment from depression. I have had depression for 25yrs. The demon never fully goes away. It always lurks and taunts. There is no peace. Every day is a struggle. It’s not so much a matter of wanting to die, but one of life being unbearably painful. And having attempted suicide twice, i can tell you the body really doesnt want to die. I still want to die, but am broken after two failed attempts What a REAL loser. Life is no more than a prison sentence inside a defective body. How cruel…

    • Tom Hal says:

      “Life is no more than a prison sentence insides a defective body.” Wonderful line.

      Some people have “defective” bodies but still choose to go on. That’s their right. The rest of us who’re living in emotional and physical pain, abandoned by family and friends for being too unpleasant (while being exhorted to “be honest”), ought to have the right to turn our backs on life. We’ve paid our taxes, even when we couldn’t afford to. THEY made this world we’re otherwise obliged to live in. Our taxes ought to guarantee, minimally, a medically competent, painless, instant way out of life.

      Come to think of it, you know who’s “fault” this suffering is? Parents who get to decide FOR us that we should be yolked with life.

    • Gypsi-medb markey says:

      Think yourself lucky very lucky ! My partner suffered depression made several attempts to end his life which had been one of mental physical and emotional abuse bullying and a father that committed suicide whom he watched self harm as a child his 1st attempt put him in a coma the 2nd caused nerve damage to his leg and foot leaving him crippled in pain and having to wear a calliper for the rest of his life his foot was so damaged after hearing this his 3rd attempt he succeeded and died in my arms ……he was 23yrs old . I read up about depression and suicide statistics show 75% of those that attempt suicide tend to be successful on the 3rd attempt …….I asked mental health for help I alerted them they ignored me and my partner lost his life as a direct result of not being listened to by mental health services which was proven after an inquiry ……

    • john says:

      Exactly. Self methods of suicide do not guarantee instant death. Many people who have jumped off the Golden Gate Bridge do not die instantly, they are alive for a few minutes. Those few minutes are total hell as their bones are broken from the impact, they are slowly suffocating in the water. Physician assisted suicide or antidepressants are the solution. Although medication does not fix things permanently, they can still hold you off until it is time for your body to cease. Is it not better to be in a fake state of a good mood than live many years feeling utterly miserable? Depression really takes a toll on the immune system and can lead to even more illnesses.

  242. Patricia says:

    I think people should be able to kill themselves if they can’t deal with life anymore. I am sick of other people and laws intervening. It should be an individual choice.

  243. Anonymous says:

    I want to write something here, but I am concerned about my privacy.

    • Stacey Freedenthal, PhD, LCSW says:

      Please feel free to write a comment and not use your real name or any identifying information.

  244. Amy says:

    No one notices you or the pain when you’re here so why do they care when your gone?? We have the struggles of living but the burden of hurting others left behind if we leave! I’ve gone my whole life feeling alone unwanted unloved invisible yet i pour out my kindness n love onto others so they dont have to feel the pain i feel everyday i wouldnt even wish it upon my worst enemy now im 25 with 4 kids im finding it harder n harder im getting weaker n weaker to hold strength

    • Anonymous says:

      Whoa Amy, not to be a bearer of bad news, but why did you have so many children if you’re so unhappy with life? That’s the problem with people who think like you; it’s easy for you to lay down and be pleasured and not think about the child or children that would come of that. I see people living in shit dirt poverty with 5 kids and their solution is to create more. I’m sorry, but the Truth has to be said. I’m 30 years old with a dog and a cat I will not be bringing any children into this wretched world. I struggle with my thoughts of suicide only because of my two boobies; my love for them is what keeps me going. All life is, is pain, bills, injustice and greed. Your decision to have 4 children in this world is a selfish one and screw anyone who tells me I’m being harsh or judgemental.

  245. jason says:

    hello. my name is jason. i was born with a very rare physical disability in which my kneecaps pop out of their sockets. i have no warning of when this will happen, and i have no control. i broke my arms, my teeth, and almost everything else from falling down when i was smaller. i was born with an ovarian disorder that makes my hormones completely insane. i am autistic. i am ugly. i was abused by my best friend for many years, and i now suffer ptsd. i have depression, a whole bunch of anxiety disorders, and some of my doctors think i’m schizophrenic. i cannot concentrate. i cannot fucking concentrate. i am literally dying a bit more every single day of my life, and all people do is smile and ignore my pain. nothing helps. my knee surgery was a huge failure, i cannot take the hormone supplements for my ovarian disorder due to me being transgender. none of my fucking anti-depressants ever helped once. talking makes me feel worse. i hate every single part of my body and i live a constant nightmare. the only reason i stay around is the guilt of how awful my family would feel, and who knows if they’re a simulation or not. every single time i extend my love into the world, my big heart gets broken and beaten and crushed. no one cares for my heart, and no one helps me. even my drug dealer sucks. the endtimes are upon us as we speak. the world is literally getting torn apart…

    and you expect me to stay alive for the vague hope that someday my life will be “better?”
    if that’s not torture and abuse, i don’t know what is.

    • Tom Hal says:

      Jason, first, I’m really sorry for your suffering–for the suffering of everyone posting… You raise a very important point: what is the advice for those who aren’t marginally-different, but rather radically-different–in ways society happens to deem very-wrong? Those so far on the periphery of society that meaningful integration, even after many faithful attempts, is extremely unlikely. Yes, the professionals also tell this subpopulation they must “stay alive for the vague hope that someday [their lives] will be ‘better.’ ” Why should anyone–professional or otherwise–be entitled to make such a decision for anyone else–and especially those who’re objectively being scathingly ostracized, deprived of even a modicum of ameliorative socialization?

  246. Anonymous says:

    I love how therapist and the like will tell you that your feelings don’t have to be justified by others and then turn around and tell you your desire to end your suffering is unjustified because they don’t agree with it. Yes if you live longer you may find something to make you smile but whether one smile is worth a lifetime of pain is a personal decision. I could see an argument on society getting to weigh in only if it would be a risk to the continuation of society. As in when mankind was recovering from the Black Plague. We’re 7 billion strong now, so stop oppressing free will.

    • HollowLife says:

      ////Anonymous October 9, 2016 at 1:18 pm.//// >>> I agree with you completely, and this is the sad situation, that if life is without any problem, societies will create one just so they can help you even though you don’t need any help. This is the artificial intelligence and the great fall. LIES LIES LIES.

    • Anonymous says:

      Thank you for the agreement. I like to think society just hasn’t figured out that there’s no problem here to fix. I wish they realized that the best thing is to ask the person if there’s anything that could be done to make life better and if the answer is no ask if there’s anything that can be done to make dying better. It bothers me as well that people try to negate the desire of those suffering but not immediately dying to prevent further suffering. Suffering is suffering and having to endure it longer shouldn’t make it ok.

    • Tom Hal says:

      I just read your line, Anonymous: “the best thing is to ask the person if there’s anything that could be done to make life better and if the answer is no ask if there’s anything that can be done to make dying better.” That is the most humane and lucid proposal I’ve read anywhere.

      I think if humans survive another century without having so demolished the ecosystem, and one another, that we can continue to afford to give philosophy much thought, it will seem obvious that it is inherently wrong–for the state, physicians, and any therapist (especially so-called therapists)–to force another human being who has decided she doesn’t want life to remain alive. This is only compounded by the obvious: that the state cannot afford to provide for the obligatory survival of such people. So, having been commanded to stay alive but having no will to live, we are then relegated to the growing pile of humans for whom there are precious few means to physically survive (all with the cost of ever mounting competition) and who then … die of deprivation. Charming. We can’t leave life unless it’s slow and tortured because we can’t afford life.

      I suppose its morally easier to let people linger and die, financially destitute and utterly abandoned by support networks research keeps telling us are vital, since you can then claim they were guilty of the great sin of not-enough-effort, than to allow them access to quick, clean, painless euthanasia.

    • Anonymous says:

      Completely. But I mean completely.

  247. Stuart says:

    When trying to prevent someone from committing suicide it’s like trying to convince them to continue suffering the pain and depression they’re going through. If someone wants to end it then it is unacceptable to make them continue through the life of hell they are in. Not to mention that whether or not they commit it’s not like it would make any difference compared to them dying later in life. In other words, if someone commits suicide then all they are doing is choosing not to continue going through the pain in their life instead of suffering it through the rest of their life to the time that they die in their future life. I mean it’s not like if they don’t commit suicide then they’re going to live forever compared to the way most people act, but even if they did all it would be is a constant life of suffering the pain and depression. It is unnecessary to stop someone from committing suicide. If they do decide to, it is their choice. Let them decide and choose whether or not to stop or continue on in life.

    • Tom Hal says:

      I wish we could applaud audibly in comment sections. 🙂

    • Anonymous says:

      Agree 100%. I would even add that painless suicide medication ought to be available over the counter. Nobody so far has been able to give me one good reason why not.

    • Cara says:

      Well said.

      Camus argued that suicide is what happens when someone decides that life is not worth the struggle….. Fleeing one’s suffering, in my view, is a rational strategy in the game of life. Sure, we can construct some sort of aesthetic to suffering, that Schopenhauer, Nietzsche, Camus and others all tried to do in their own way. But I see this as a coping mechanism, nothing more. If life is so bad as to warrant not having children, then it should also not be worth living.

      In any case, it’s hard to see how Schopenhauer’s asceticism isn’t ALSO a form of fleeing life’s suffering. I do have sympathies, though, for theories that advocate the continuation of life in order to maximize one’s utility. Von Hartmann was one thinker who advocated this.

      In general, though, I have to agree with Sartre and Tolstoy: people continue out of ignorance or weakness. It is the strong who manage to kill themselves.

  248. Broken spirit sweetie says:

    Absolutely not. A grown adult is capable of making their own decisions. We have to live with our own pain locked in our soul and body.

    I remember looking at a doctor after trying to commit suicide and he smirked and told me I was a threat to society…and I ask really, how? ? I don’t even eat animals, or kill bugs+ I would give my last dollar to anyone that needed it.. I only try to do good and would never hurt anyone besides myself. Why should you force someone to suffer and he just threw the papers down and jumped up.

    • Joan Of Arc says:

      Just out of curiousity, what was the doc/asswhole’s response when you asked him how you’re a threat to society?

  249. chris says:

    i have already died once. i feel if i want to go back, i should be allowed to, even helped in getting there. suicide prevention has gone too far.

  250. April says:

    Suicides should not be prevented. A conviction is just that, a conviction. Why waste time trying to stop someone when they felt it was necessary for them?

  251. Logic101 says:

    This article is a piece of shit. At the moment, I am doing what I love, feeling good and looking forward to going to a mates place in about an hour. Do I still want to die? Yep. I have no future, and I have known it for 12 years. I hate who I am and, through 100 attempts, I have not been able to improve it. I know I’ll feel shit again eventually. I go to bed thinking “wouldn’t it be nice never to wake up again”. My suicidal desire is not irrational. I have weighed up the pros and cons, and I know that sooner or later I’ll end up feeling miserable all the time with nothing to live for–probably once my folks die and I have no one left who loves me. I realise that sounds stupid since I am going to a mate’s house, but this is a mate who invites 199 friends and never really cares if I show up or not, so it’s just for numbers, but I enjoy it so I’ll go. But yeah, I still want to die. I hate articles like these because it takes that decision out of my hands; so some people are irrational, what of it? Should the logical people suffer because of the emotional people?

    • HollowLife says:

      The whole of existence is an existential business and we are nothing but a species to contribute our fees and dues to higher forces who have so conditioned life mostly for their own purpose and amusement that also keeping us in bondage through religion and biochemical conditioning… The ones that would like to be set free must find ways to be released from this matrix. I am contemplating over my death/suicide and I would like to speak for myself as I have come to realize and somehow penetrated through this game/manipulation. If mankind reaches the point to voluntarily commit suicide then the higher powers and the powers of the world will be threatened from their higher positions that is why the church prevents birth control and also suicide, We are just business and money for those in power. The question is how to extinguish oneself so completely by seeing the facts that life and the entire existence is too boring and full of headaches. By force we arrive to this world, by force we live, and by force through deterioration we also die… and/or to be forced even further after death. I must enquire deeply until I come to the point to be fed up and not want any more life but complete EXTINCTION. ((((((0)))))) Here’s a quote on Buddha’s enlightenment:>>>>///”There is, monks, a realm where there is neither earth, nor water, nor fire, nor wind… neither this world nor the next, neither sun nor moon. There, monks, I say there is neither coming, nor going, nor remaining; neither deceasing nor being born. Without foundation is it, without continuity, without support: this is the end of suffering” (Udana).///

  252. masteroftimeuk says:

    life is not fair, the saying is you reap what you sow, but in my case, it i choose to live my own life and god had his plan, so what am i meant to be a robot? if you do something in life and it was good then why are people being abused, by god, because he break his own word, i’ve never thought of suicide, until god wanted to test me, now i feel like committing suicide thanks god, your own selfishness let you down because you must play god with everyone’s life

  253. Anonymous says:

    I’m just really tired of having to push through adversity. I’m not a victim and I am aware that there are people who have seemingly more difficult lives than I do but it’s all relative.

    Needs are highly influenced by environment and in my environment, I barely get by. Constant management of scarcity is the theme.

    It sucks to live like this: worrying, trying, worrying yet managing to try some more to improve my life but not able to. Call it failure or not, makes no difference. This cycle is demoralizing and I fight each day to figure out what the F I am doing here.

    I don’t really care why things are difficult for me anymore. I don’t care what other people think. I just don’t want to feel like this anymore.

    If the pattern I live in were in a different context, people would readily advise to stop it and do something else. They would even support you ending whatever it is. Like that common definition of crazy, doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

    So I’m not obsessed with trying to kill myself but I just want to stop living. I want to stop the pain and internal struggle of each day. Dying seems pretty rational when I consider it this way.

    • Anonymous says:

      Beautifully put. I see death as a relief from the struggle and internal hate. I wake each day wondering how in the heck did I make it this far. I’m not physically, mentally nor I’m I financially built for this world. Some days are good, but the thought of death is constantly present. I pity those who look down on people who contemplate suicide, because suicide ( the thought or the action) is a scary thing. I mean none of us know what’s after death, I silently grieve for all my good brothers and sisters who feel hopeless and tired right now.

  254. Samantha says:

    I think suicides for all children, teens, young adults & those under 40 should be prevented unless they have a terminal illness, including mental illness. Those without terminal illness under 40 have enough years to heal, find support & turn their lives around. Adults over 40 who have been living with chronic pain, have no support system & limited financial resources should have assisted suicide available to them because at least they won’t have to die alone, risk bungling it if no gun is available or experience extreme pain en route. Also the cost/ benefit factor is at play. Cheaper to purchase euthanasia rather than more yrs of medications for illness, housing, food…for what? Low standard of living, feeling like you’re a burden on society. For isolated people with mental illness, no one else is impacted by their death so it’s a win-win situation.

    • Tom Hal says:

      Did you actually type, “For isolated people with mental illness, no one else is impacted by their death so it’s a win-win situation”? What a disturbing assertion, given your platform of “[t]hose without terminal illness under 40 have enough years to heal, find support & turn their lives around.”

      I can only imagine how the suicidal over 40 reading that felt. And, for that matter, what those under 40 who’ve been trying very, very hard for significant percents of their lives to “turn their lives around” but who’re still in grave pain despite professionals’ interventions felt reading those lines.

      No disrespect meant, but the ideas you’ve expressed here are among the very ones self-determination antagonists use to justify proscribing physician-assisted suicide, due in large part to the slippery slopes of those arguments.

  255. Anonymous says:

    You know how to actually help? We need support. Real support. We need to set up networks and safety for people who are suicidal. Do you know why I feel suicidal? I don’t have anyone, and I can’t trust anyone. The people I care about can’t handle my emotions and suicidal thoughts, so I CAN’T talk about it. I can’t afford therapy, so I can’t talk about it. We need to destigmatize. We need to actually offer support for the suicidal instead of treating it like a private thing to shove in the closet and only talk about with a shrink. Rationalizing and saying all the stuff that anyone who’s suicidal already knows- it doesn’t help. Helping helps. Direct action helps. If you wanna support someone, do it. Don’t make them feel worse than nothing.

  256. Hybert says:

    I agree with most of the comments. It’s really stupid how wanting to die is taboo, and shamed. Why do the folks who feel this way turn into pariahs? It has to change. People who feel suicidal aren’t stupid, they know how stop the suffering.

  257. vivi says:

    I want to die,sometimes,just because Im so tired. But okay. I won’t say it. It’s just an idea comin from my head several times. I was victim of violence who is smart. I saw so many people gossiped and talked bad things of me which are not true until now. Im not perfect child just like my late younger brother. I want to end my life because of depressed of hurtful words of my mother. I want to run away out of home. Escape. Im so tired.

    • Tina says:

      Please find help from school or your city human services department. You have a long life ahead of you.

  258. Unknown says:

    I agree with pretty much everyone on here. I don’t mean to sound like a heartless bitch but a person should be allowed to control his or her own death, seeing as none of us have control over our lives. They say we do, but we don’t. I don’t particularly have a bad life, but I’ve always been a good person with a big heart and yet somehow I’m always the one getting hurt in the end. I want to die for myself but I want to live for the ones I love, because I know they would be devastated if anything happened to me. Some days I actually do feel glad to be alive. But for the most part, I find myself constantly battling depression and I fear that one day I’m going to give up and lose altogether.

    • \ says:

      I agree that it is your life but others would be hurt. Life sucks.

    • Tom Hal says:

      You don’t sound at all like a “heartless bitch.” You sound like a rational, realistic person who understands her own life better than anyone else can understand the same life. And these assertions of your, in particular, strike me as fundamentally true: “…seeing as none of us have control over our lives. They say we do, but we don’t.”

      I agree–despite the philosophical mumbo-jumbo about autonomy, and the moralistic ephemera about personal responsibility, not to mention the deeply culturally embedded fallacy of meritocracy–we’re not in control of our lives. Our decisions are constrained by countless variables we have no control over. And whether traditional religion or the modern religion of mental health, we’re told some responses to stimuli are good and others are bad, that we suffer because we keep choosing the “bad responses.” The therapy is, of course, re-educating us to choose what others deem “good responses” to the painful stimuli of life. Most of us react to circumstances, make choices we hope will work out. Very often we’re wrong, and for some of us those wrong choices, as for most other animals in nature, can eventually be catastrophic and irremediable.

      The one piece of peace we could offer the suffering masses, among whom I certainly number, is the freedom to choose to leave this game of life with expert medical intervention that would quickly and painlessly bring an end to our suffering.

  259. Cheerful on the outside says:

    Even when everything is good on the outside (good job, happy family, etc), a part of me feels hollow. I keep thinking I should be grateful for what I have and that this is enough. I have had a dream for a long time and I am afraid to pursue it because I will have to move away from my family to another country. As I live my day-to-day, I noticed I have grown numb. I follow through the motions and react accordingly to what’s expected. I have not told anyone of my feelings because they are too busy venting their own problems to me. I do not want to hear it now. I want to tell some of them that their problems will not go away because they are NOT taking responsibility for their actions. It can’t ALWAYS be someone else’s fault for every problem they encounter. And I do not want to hang out with these kinds of people even if it’s family. I feel like they will not understand until they lose it all to realize the value of what they already had. Sorry for the ramble, but it occasionally drives me sad to the point where I have bad thoughts and consider numbing the pain forever.

  260. Anonymous says:

    I don’t think suicide should be prevented in the adult population.

  261. Normal Person says:

    Does it really matter if we die? Aren’t we gonna die anyway? This is what we were born for: suffer and then die. And it’s just fucking stupid. Life is just too bothersome, why do we try to force others to live? I want to take my own life. I don’t want to die. I just don’t wanna exist anymore. I don’t wish this on anyone else, but what the fuck can I do?! I don’t know what to do. And neither do you. I mean, we’re all fucked, some of us more than others. Don’t they turn shit off at the hospital once everybody’s tired of waiting for someone to be able to breathe on their own? Suicide is like plugging it off. Let people fucking die. Who gives a fuck. We’re all gonna die haha we’re dying bro

  262. Sean says:

    People want to stop others from suicide because of the empowerment they feel and excitement they get from saving a life. Also, people love being right. They will tell you that if you kill yourself you will go to Hell. If they can convince you of this not only will they have saved your life, they will have “saved your soul”.

    • Anonymous says:

      Well to bad for them. I’m Atheist. Plus. I’ve had people prevent my suicide and they were sad. So ya know. Have experience before you presume. I’ve tried. Multiple times.

  263. Anonymous says:

    There is no joy in living

  264. Odie says:

    I have been depressed most of my life. My first attempt at suicide was 8 years old. I have taken every antidepressant known to the United States psychiatric community and they do lose their usefulness after a year or two and at best, they help make the acting “happy” easier.

    I’m done with life. I’ve tried meds, talk therapy, group therapy, floatation tanks, rebirthing, and the latest, mindfulness and meditation. They help temporarily but here I am planning my end of life. I think that we all should be free to choose our time of death if we have tried everything available for depression or any other illness. I have been diagnosed with major depression, PTSD, de-realization, major anxiety which doesn’t make for an easy or even a meaningful life. Who wants to feel like this all the time?

    I’m planning to go to Switzerland where chronic major depression is accepted as a terminal illness. I don’t understand how anyone finds life desirable. I most certainly don’t. I say that if you can get through your depression, then I support your willingness to live. As for me, I want to choose to make my transition and finally find peace.

    • Tom says:

      I love you Odie. I hope you find peace.

    • Anonymous says:

      I want to meet you. I wish I could be your friend. I already love you.

    • HollowLife says:

      To odie: To my understanding, it’s not only dying physically, but the importance is dying psychologically… dying to the world period…until you come to the point where nothing can attract you any more. Slowly you rearrange your mind and built in determination, cut down to the meds/drugs, bear the pain and do aimlessly walking, Stop eating and drinking and within 10 days you will experience departing this world consciously. NOTE: before we came to be, we were not…now that we are, we cannot be for too long and neither without suffering and death lingering over our heads, and the last card and will is to be used by our will and determination. The greatest way to die is not to feed this body/nature any more by refusing it’s involvement. Stepping out of this cycle.

    • Tom Hal says:

      I second “Tom” from 30 September 2016.

    • Anonymous says:

      Please keep posting
      Actually ur text sounds like me
      Just wanna get past that stigma
      In nc in therapy and on meds
      But no help
      Please give any advice

  265. G says:

    Ive been so depressed. I want to die, I don’t want to die. But nobody actually helps. WTF kind of article is this? Nobody actually understands unless they’re in the same f*cking boat! I can’t tell you how many times I’ve been told I’m being dramatic and others have it worse- nobody wants to help!

    • Anonymous says:

      I do

    • Samantha says:

      I think one of the worst things anyone can say to a depressed person is “others have it worse.” They’re not hearing you, they’re invalidating your feelings, it’s a dismissive tactic. I’ve battled depression since 14 yrs. old, my ignorant father used to say that & it shut me up but I was also left feeling I didn’t matter. So next time someone says that, you tell them they are invalidating your feelings as if you don’t matter. There’s no comeback for that!

    • Tom Hal says:

      I agree with you. What’s most damaging about “professionals” in so-called mental health is that these human beings OUTSIDE the experience of your mind get to tell you how you ought to feel, and worse, get to force you to act a certain way concerning JUST your life and body. None of this is guaranteed to help, and if it doesn’t help, you’re now obliged to continue suffering, hurting. Until when? Decades of torment as new-“treatment”-after-new-promising-“treatment” fail?

      It’s as if the “professionals” write for themselves and others who feel and think as they do. But the rest of us are labeled wrong and defective because we feel and think differently. And there’s no discussing these matters with them. They actually believe, just like the dictatorial religious in centuries past, that they’re justified in deciding FOR you both how you (should) feel and what you should do with your own flesh. It boggles my mind that a culture as “intellectually advanced” as ours supports this. In the meantime, those of us actually LIVING our lives continue to come to our conclusions, regardless the official (but separate from us) pronouncements of mental health boards, and, silently, make our plans, and carry them out.

      The only thing gained by commanding people who want to leave life to stay here, besides our continued suffering, is gruesome endings due to the determined among us desperately seeking out uncertain and even painful ends.

      In the distant future, should humanity survive, people will look back on this age of the religion of mental health as a dark smear against both empiricism and personal freedoms–especially in the context of inescapable suffering. Imagine telling people we have to accept the horrors of lives we never chose–chronic under- or unemployment; explosive college tuitions; crushing “good” debt with no conceivable way to escape it in our lifetimes; fragmented families; chronic loneliness; ubiquitous judgments (too tall/too short/too fat/too skinny/too…) that dehumanize, isolate, and legally (thanks Supreme Court) justify employment, and hence survival, discrimination; and a government–and local authorities–that the globe’s best scholars demonstrate don’t care what the masses want. Add to this unremitting pain from injuries or illness, ever mounting costs-of-living with no way to pay the increasing costs on a life you don’t even want in the first place, and a myriad moment-by-moment vexations (like barking dogs you have no control over, or daily bullying, or…), and it’s PHENOMENAL another human being would presume to command us to subscribe to the doctrine of life-is-good. Simply phenomenal.

  266. Anonymous says:

    I’Ve been living with depression since I was about 8……My father is an abusive alcoholic who always finds a way to hurt me and my mom is a drug addict who doesn’t listen to me anymore because she doesn’t care about anything anymore…..I’m an only child and don’t have any other relatives or any friends at all…….and I would get bullied badly at school for how I looked and because of my shyness…….I hurt everyday of my life because I have no one else to talk to i’m just waiting to die…..I don’t have money to do anything I can’t pay for a therapist I am hurting everyday of my life I’ve prayed to a God that never listened……I just want to leave this world so badly it hurts to breathe in such a toxic world…. My heart has scars on it that can’t be erased…. They all just tell me to get over it because others have it way worse….

    • Adam says:

      Hi Anonymous
      I really want to talk to you, if you’re intereated. I know how hard it may feel and I really want to help you. Please let me know, if you want to talk.

    • vivi says:

      Hey, Im also an only child who lost my late younger brother 4years ago. If you want to share your story, we can be friend through email. Send me before dying(Well, I also get that idea of suicide,too): vivi.trump@gmail.com

    • 0fuckinbitch says:

      Hey, I forgot to tell you my email. If you ever want to talk to anybody, just drop me an email. Eventually we can become friends.
      adam.pierson@mail.ru

    • Anonymous says:

      I’d rather not talk to anyone about my problems I heard the same thing all before believe me, it’s gonna get better, it’s all in your head, others have it worse than you just no stop it I know what it means when someone says lets talk they mean they’re going to tell me to go to a therapist and get medical help or that it’s all in my head…….. I’m just tired and there’s no one in this world who can help me I know that now….. and I’m tired of getting my hopes up when people say lets talk it’s the same bs over and over again….i’m just stupid woman who needs to die…… and it’s not heartless to tell someone to die when they really want to or in some cases need to in my case I’m going and I can honestly say my life has been absolutely worthless and it has all been in pain everyday of my miserable life I wake up crying and go to sleep crying it’s been like this since I was born, yes I was diagnosed with depression at 8 but I was suffering long before that I’ve been abused by every single person I ever came across and was never loved ever I never been in a relationship…… and I never will be I wasn’t loved I was hated no matter how much I loved everyone they hurt me all of them my parents beat me (even though I’m an adult now) people at school beat me and my parents take my money so I can’t save up the money to move out………I was abused in every way possible physically, mentally, sexually, and emotionally…. when I was four I was beaten and molested by an old man who kept doing it until I turned 5 and finally had the courage to tell my father also I went home one day with a black eye….. but it messed me up pretty badly and I became sexually dysfunctional……..I don’t mean to sound like a bitch or anything I just know that no one can truly help me and it just hurts talking about it…… it hurts everyday of my life knowing I don’t have anyone or anything I don’t feel safe and I definitely don’t feel loved I should have every right to die knowing I don’t belong here…… and that’s exactly what I’m going to do…….

    • 0fuckinbitch says:

      Sorry, if I hurt you anyhow, I really didn’t meant to. It’s ok, if you don’t want to talk. And actually I wasn’t going to tell you anything like “it’s gonna get better” or “go to a therapist”. In fact I never say that, because I don’t trust them.
      I just want to ask you to think about 2 things.
      1. Is there something, that you like and enjoy doing? There must be at least one thing. I mean anything: music, art, movies, books, looking at the sky… Any little thing.
      2. What if there’s a way out of that situation, that you just didn’t happen to find yet?
      I’ve never been in a relationship either, and I also have suicidal thoughts, but this things help me to keep going. You don’t have to answer, just think.
      Wish you all the best.

  267. Anonymous says:

    I suffer from PTSD due to living and then policing in a country ravaged by terrorism and find it a struggle every day to find a reason not to give up but now my wife has been taken from me due to a sudden illness and I have lost that reason.

  268. stuart says:

    Anonymous I totally hear you. Throughout the last two and a half decades of my life I have hated it along with about all people I see. Even though my parents pay thousands of dollars on me as well as assist me through college I still come to a failure from being frustrated and puzzled with the fact of thinking about committing suicide throughout 90% of my life. Most of my life is nothing but spite and hatred. Living life is like living in hell. The times about ten years ago when I was in high school and got beat half to death 4-5 times a week from people including my family for the fun of it. Lots of times these days I imagine myself getting out a 45 hand-gun and shooting 7-15 people in my sight. Most times these days I just keep thoughts of suicide to myself because talking to someone else about it would just make it worse despite the fact of them just constantly talking about how much you hate life along with everything else. What difference does it makes whether one person out of trillions dies or not. Be the same as one ant out of 10 colonies dies. Not like if we don’t commit suicide we are going to live forever. If you ask me, the only difference it makes is dying earlier than other people(everyone dies eventually). If someone wants to commit suicide then so be it.

    • Joan of Arc says:

      I get it, lately I’ve been feeling dazed and confused; lost and shattered. I sometimes get lost in the anger and disdain i feel for my parents for having me. I mean they were both poor, of different race and their only thought was to pleasure themselves and in the process I was given the chance to be birthed, hated, humiliated, beaten, scorned and betrayed. I wake each day and carry on because of my doggy and cat. They’re my nutrients. I feel for you and wish that in some way we can help each other.

    • Dale says:

      If you want to die then that is your right as it is your life but please do not kill others that may want to live and may even be doing some good in this lousy world.

  269. Due to the nature of the subject and that of many of those who have found there way here, this post will go largely unread……but for the benefit of those who might read it….
    I have been following these comments for quite a long time now and too much of it is from people telling tales of how bad things are for them rather that keeping focused the actual reasons why what we now call suicide, should be legal and accessible.
    Stories of woe make a person seem as though they are of the victim mentalitity, are out of their mind and are not rational at all.
    This plays the ball very nicely in to the court of the “mental health professionals” who immediately use this lack of composure to back up their backward outlook and fighting very hard to keep our right of life away from us.
    This in no way helps the cause and gives undue credibility to those who believe that suicide is never a rational choice.
    Let me put it this way, if i go to the chemist screaming for codeine because my head is killing me, they will look at me like i am a crazed drug user and they wont give me anything except a security escort to the door.
    However, if i go in calmly describing my headache symptoms, they will most probably say, hey, you really need this product here that has these active ingredients.
    We will get no where if we appear as crazy as the rest of the world seems to want to believe we are.
    So, please dont come here with ” i am xx years old and have been abused since i was xx and no one loves me so i should be allowed to die etc etc etc”.
    Let me say that the vast majority of people leaving comments here also have real and shocking stories but they do not even need to come in to it or be posted here.
    If we are ever going to be given our rights, we must do our very best to display to the world that we are in fact rational, sane and have given this serious and delicate subject immense thought and consideration.

    • Orangeoctopus says:

      I agree – however people aren’t educated to a high enough degree to understand this. Thats all part of the twisted system. Well done for explaining it. We must show that we are rational – that we have thought about this for years – without doing it because we are rational enough to know – let me put it like this, a guy in a bi polar depression jumped in front of a truck and messed himself up in a terrible state – thankfully when he survived he could still walk – he probably scared the truck driver for life – let alone the ambulance (many paramedics I speak to are traumatised after they leave their jobs)

      This guy was not rational. He was happy one minute and sad the next – he had a psychosis. This raises the question of whether he should have been allowed – what do you think? Clearly he would have died if access had been easy – and he would have saved all that suffering and cost to others but could we consider him rational?

      Perhaps what we also need to do is look for and be each other advocates. Also in countries where they are Euthanising for mental health reasons you still need to see therapists for 3 years and plenty of sessions before its considered. I don’t think that is a bad thing – at the end of the day – if there are people that love you but can’t help you (such as myself) I would like to be able to say good bye to them – they MUST be considered important (the people who want you to live – family- partners-friends) because otherwise they will protest – its like keeping the enemy close and letting them think they re in control.

      My family would be horrified if I ended my life – and if it was done legally they would probably protest against it and start a whole movement to stop it as they can not conceive that life just simply isn’t worth it.

      These people “controllers” worry me – like the pro lifers etc – How they are doing it in the Netherlands should be commended and be our example. I know the UK with the Royal family and the religion will never allow this. I just hope to save up enough money so I can go as more and more places open up abroad. Good luck everyone.

  270. jester says:

    What I find funny is “solution to a temporary problem”.

    Hah.

    Like in the last 20 years has anything changed for me ?……..hmmmm……..nope!!!.

    Its still the same, i still want to die, I still am force to drink and smoke to somehow bring on terminal cancer so FINALLY I will HOPEFULLY be allowed to get euthinasia injection etc.

    Its seriously BS to me.

    WHY STOP PEOPLE.

    You want to know the sick reason why there is this drive to stop suicide etc ????

    Because if everyone could freely use a peaceful drug to die then the rich wouldnt have anyone to do work for them!!

    The rich would all of a sudden be like WTF?!?! Where is my food!?!?! where is my new shoes!!?!??! WTF??A??A

    OMG DONT TELL ME I HAVE TO FARM MY OWN FOOD NOW?!?!?! NO FUCKING WAY!%()!*)%^*@^#

    That is the real real agenda.

    You can try to deny it, but in the end, its all like an ant colony except there is more than 1 “queen”. Say maybe 10000 or so super rich ? (basically the queens of the ant colony)

    If all the workers had a choice and decided to go, F the queens id rather die, well the queens wouldnt be very happy would they, they need the workers to support their lifestyle or they DIE.

    • Tom Hal says:

      You stole the thoughts right out of my head. Yes, I agree with you.

    • Orangeoctopus says:

      You got it. They actually re wrote the bible in the middle ages due to this – the bible said that after death we were re incarnated – like in Buddhism but this caused the ‘Serfs’ to all end their lives and they thought they would be reincarnated and get a better chance – they rewrote the bible so that suicide was a sin!! Its Religion that is our enemy.

  271. Ash R says:

    I don’t know what ‘illness’ I have. But I’m 25, and since 16 I’ve felt really alone, shattered and miserable. There is an immense pain that I go through on a daily basis which nobody understands. I don’t know why I haven’t committed suicide yet but I know that the time to do it is getting closer and closer. I’ve just had enough of people who pretend to understand what I’m going through when they don’t. Therapists, Psychologists, Psychiatrists etc have no idea- they live happy lives, they have qualifications to tell us broken people how we should ‘cope with our feelings’ but they know nothing about our anguish- they don’t truly understand and they will never be able to.

  272. robin s says:

    Life is pain sprinkled with brief moments of waiting for the pain to begin again. I have existed for 55 years and I have never been happy to wake up and see another day. I have tried every antidepressants and all they did is make it so I have to not only pretend I’m not wishing for death everyday but I have to fake a libido too. I really can not think of one reason to go on. I don’t kill myself because my insurance policy would not pay out.

  273. Cat says:

    To some ending the suffering is not negative. But a direct course to solve an imbalance. To die is not horrific. Its taking the next journey that is waiting. I look forward to the powers that compel me to continue and give myself to the inevitability. I dont so much want to die as to be dead. I am not afraid and wait with happiness for my turn.

    • Anonymous says:

      I’m impressed with your writing. I love how your brain works. I’m with you. I feel the same.

  274. Anonymous says:

    To me, preventing suicide from those who genuinely want it is abuse. You’re forcing them to live life when all life is to them is pain. I’ve had depression for 2 years and everyday breaks me down more and more. I take a lot of medicine, but it doesn’t help at all. My mother is afraid that if I take any more, I’ll have an overdose. I can’t stand to be around anyone. Not even my parents or siblings. Whenever I’m around someone else for more than a few minutes, I start to boil inside because I hate being around anyone. Whenever someone does something annoying to me, even if it’s a slight breath that I can hear, I start to scrape my head and all I can picture is me mutilating them. For example, my dog is breathing on the couch next to me and I keep yelling at her to shut up and I just want to kick her in the face, even though I wouldn’t do that. I can’t handle the slightest amount of stress. Even when my mother does most of my work for me and just has me write out the answers, I complain and want to cry because I can’t even write down a few words! What is wrong with me!? There are so many things I want to achieve, and I can achieve some now, but I can’t even come close to starting any of them. I can remember plenty of times when I was stressed and kept saying to myself, “You can do this, you’re strong.” but I could never finish anything because I’d start crying because I can’t handle anything. I’ve gone to a psychiatrist and have had plenty of appointments with her, but she never made me feel better. Literally all she did was make me more sad. And on the rare days that I was happy, she would make me cry because she reminded me of all my problems and how pathetic I am. I’ve wasted so much of my parent’s money on useless crap. Like virtual items and things I never use. I’m such a fat, disgusting slob that when I tried to go a week without eating any sugar filled things, I didn’t even last an hour. My dad always reminds me of how much of a failure I am. I can’t count how many times he’s told me I was pathetic and a waste of time. He almost always verbally abuses me, my siblings and my mother. He’s been getting very violent lately and just today he yelled at my mother and threatened to get a divorce. My mother said he says that multiple times a year, but he hadn’t been that loud about it before. And he went up to my brother’s room and started screaming at him because he couldn’t pluck up the courage to call the place he planned to get a job at. He ripped the cables of my brother’s computer out of the wall and slammed the door. My mother says that if she wasn’t a stay at home mom and actually had enough money, she would get a divorce and take us all away from him. She says that when she and he were friends that my dad would always be friendly and sensitive, but now he’s always mean and angry. If she had known he was going to be like this, she wouldn’t have married him. I’m scared that he is going to hurt me or my siblings and mother. I don’t feel safe and just want to leave the world, but I can’t. When I say to my parents that I wish I wasn’t here and I wish I could die, they either roll their eyes and give me an un-amused face or they yell at me and tell me to shut up. I’ll never be able to hold a job, because I can’t stand stress and I absolutely hate everyone. Even my mother has started to see that. I have tons of symptoms for Autism, ADD and other mental illnesses and am going to get a diagnosis for a few of them soon. I just hope that the new psychiatrist I’m going to visit sees that I’m constantly in a state of depression and agrees to lock me away from the world or assist with my death. All I am is a burden, so why keep me alive?

    • Anonymous says:

      Do you like nature and are you able to walk. This would relax your mind by focusing on the trail the trees the sounds and wildlife. Remember that thinking when depressed is almost always never a good idea you never want to get in your head it makes it worse. Find a book get involved there’s got to be something your good at. Babysteps to a positive consistencies and try your best to avoid the negatives.

    • Anonymous says:

      I think I know what you mean when you say that you just cant stand being around anybody. I feel it everyday. Of course there are persons I tolerate a better than others but truth is that I have to make an effort to interact with most people. Yet there are a few with whom i do feel comfortable and enjoy being with, I guess that, sadly for me the people with whom I feel more comfortable are not always near and they are very very few. I do feel, like you this constant tension, and sometimes minor inconveniences make me want to punch people in their faces. I guess it is because throughout my life I had to face situations of constant stress. I was sexually molested as a child by my aunts husband. I remember I was around 5 years or so, and it lasted at least for a couple of years. My mother left me at that house where they were supposed to take care of me. Obviously I lived in constant vigilance and evidently didnt feel secure. On the top of that, my mother only went to visit me like 3 days a week or even less perhaps,and she was emotionally distant. Even though it was pretty clear I wasnt happy where I was (I cried a lot every time she went away because I was too little to express any other way the despair I felt in that house) she still would not even stop to try to figure out was going on because for her it was a lot more comfortable to think that all was ok. And so finally I moved out from there and started living with my older sisters ( they were like 18 years older than I was) and it was the same emotional neglect but at least I wasnt molested any more. Still my sisters used to abuse me emotionally and verbally. I was neglected in every possible way, the only difference between me and a totally abandoned child was that I was sleeping under a roof and went to school (until my mother decided that she wouldnt pay for my education anymore) and could eat a hot meal from time to time. That was all.
      Time passed and I started working when I was like 17 or 18 years old, finally I could eat well and dress nicely, and could enjoy life within my means. I took the time to educate myself and to become acquainted with people of better quality than my horrible family. I guess I could manage to find a little happiness and my life wasnt as crappy as it used to be when I was little. Still, I was naive and somehow I loved my family despite it all, now I think I just didnt want to face the true dimension of the damage they did in my life and how low and toxic they were.
      Some other time passed and I managed to marry a guy who seemed nice enough (even though I wasnt exactly in love) but I did love him deeply. At 29 he was the only person with whom I could feel I was being taken care. I could say I felt happy for some time during the marriage but mostly I felt more at peace, I thought I could finally relax a bit and enjoy companionship and all the things that you are supposed to enjoy when you get married. Then after 5 years of marriage and completely out of the blue ( I was returning from a 1 month vacation in another country!) he said that he wanted the divorce and that he would give 5 thousand dollars so I could “start my life”. I wont write here all the horrible things he did to me during that time because that would take pages and pages of painful memories but I can tell you that during that time I developed something like PTSD, started having sleeping problems because I was scared of nightmares I had every night and I was also scared that everyday I would wake up I would have to face all the pain of my situation. I was scared all the time, I couldnt understand anything that was happening, later, a few months after the divorce I found out he impregnated a lover he had (I wasnt aware of that) and that was the reason why he wanted to divorce me, still I could never understand why he had to be so mean to me especially if he was the one cheating!
      Well, after that I went to live with a girlfriend of mine whom I loved like a sister and she also let me down. What can I say, my life has been a disappointment after disappointment for the last 10 years. No matter how much I tried to get ahead, my efforts had been in vain and all that left me is this hopelesness, depression, bitterness, anguish and frustration. I feel like there is no positive feeling in my heart. After so much betrayals and failures I just dont have the energy to trust anyone or to try anymore. Im sick and tired of this existence, and dont want it anymore. As someone said “Too many things went wrong too many times.” So, it is only natural that I want to punch peoples faces as I ran out of patience to take any more crap. And yes, for about a year Ive been thinking about committing suicide and i dont think that is due to any “mental illness,” on the contrary, it is perfectly natural wanting to die when you just cant find any satisfaction whatsoever in any aspect of your life and at this point of my life and with my current circumstances I doubt I ever will. So, what is the point of perpetuating my suffering?

      You girl, I think you feel like that because you are not surrounded by people with whom you feel secure, loved, and identified, and sadly you probably will be feeling like that until you find some kindred souls with whom to connect on a real nurturing level. I sincerely hope that you find your bunch and that you find them soon. In the mean time, take your dog for a walk and realize that she might be the only one that doesnt judge you and loves you as you are.

    • Sean says:

      Woah, dude. You need to smoke some weed. Seriously.

    • Broken spirit sweetie says:

      Please, know that you brought tears to my eyes..
      I was your mom.. my daughters told me to leave get out, away from the madman.. their father ..But, it hasn’t been easy and unfortunately, very hard. Surely why your mom has stayed with your dad .. I know, been there..However, it’s not your fault at all. You will gain from that negative childhood..
      … it really will make you a better person . Understand nobody is fat forever, trust me!.. adulthood with someone who needs you by their side to support them will completely change you .You can walk away from that crazy family to someone else and then look back and say, thank God .. I’m out of there ..+ you will become a stronger person that will benefit.. and know how to raise your OWN children better…

      You can start a new Legacy..

    • Zee says:

      I agree with you, I have been suicidal since I was 7 years old, I am now 17, so I have been trying to do what people tell me to do to get better, for 10 years now, and nothing has changed. I was put in foster care when I was 7, and I was placed in my aunt’s home for about a year, she physically abused, and emotionally. I was moved around like a box that was ripped up and bruised, and because of that no one wanted me. I was placed in 3 rehab centers in the past year. I want to die, in my heart I know I do. People tell you that it will get better, it’s just a temporary problem, you have a lot of people in your life who love you, you’re just using suicide as an excuse to get out of things that you don’t like to do. People don’t understand that some of us won’t heal, we may look like we are getting better, but we do it to make others happy. I mean, if a person wants to die, then let them. It’s their life not yours.

  275. Justin says:

    i have schizophrenia, and it is a horrible hell to live with, doesn’t matter how positive you are, what pills you take, how hard you work.

    There is no getting rid of it, it ruins jobs, relationships, friendships. And often causes immense pain of every sort. Yes including physical as your brain misfires thinking your body is in pain when its not, but you still feel it.

    You end up jobless, alone, and poor, with very few exceptions. Not to mention it can cause you to do terrible things when you are not rational.

    Honestly i am doing ok, but nowhere near what my potential was before this happened.

    Its a miracle that people with this disease don’t kill themselves, and no one should blame them if they do.

    Ask yourself, could you live with torture forever? Death doesn’t scare me, life does.

    • Tinkerbell says:

      I have not been diagnosed with schizophrenia but I acknowledge exactly how you feel living with another fucked up situation that you’ve made resulting in a loss of friendships especially when you are lonely, no words can describe how that feels.

  276. Carter Fox says:

    No way in hell should suicide be prevented…

  277. Bill says:

    sydchic I hear you. This is not our planet anyway. I give up. I tried, believe me, but people like us are not welcome here. Somehow though, I want to stay around, to see how much I can torture these oppressors of humanity. Drop me a line.

    • Tom Hal says:

      One of my favorite comments anywhere (thank you): “This is not our planet anyway. I give up. I tried…but people like us are not welcome here.”

  278. www says:

    I don’t care if I wouldn’t have tried it again if I failed. What matters is that I want to die NOW. I can’t regret it if I’m dead.

  279. Marlena says:

    Bullshit. Rubbish. There is always euthanasia. However government and self righteous people chose to not allow it.

    • sydchic says:

      Usually because they are the ones who have caused you to exit your life, they do not want to see what they have done. Being forced to die gruesome deaths by suicide is a punishment.These are the people who say you took the cowards way out!!

      It is about themselves not wanting to face who they really are!!

      Real people who are left with no choice but to wind up their lives, will never be legally allowed to end it, far to confronting!! Really,not even medically induced deaths are not truely legal or humane.

      Their are a range of opiates,however these will of course be illegal.The closest to a ‘humane” death,that those already in horrific suffering deserve.

      If they want to get rid of those with more human traits,like being sensitive or caring ect,then have enough guts to allow them to end their lives without inflicting horrific pain!

    • Tom Hal says:

      Marlena, agreed. Sydchic, very, very well put: “If they want to get rid of those with more human traits,like being sensitive or caring ect,then have enough guts to allow them to end their lives without inflicting horrific pain!”

  280. Cd says:

    Let me die if that’s what I want,

  281. Anonymous says:

    No Suicide should not be prevented. I have lived with Severe Depression, Anxiety, Social Anxiety, OCD and DID to some extent or another, since I was 10 yrs old. That is 48 years. That is enough. I live alone, so as for someone finding me and saving my life… there is no one remotely interested in whether I live or die… It is really just a question of where, when and how…

    • sydchic says:

      I agree. If they offered the world Id give it away.Just want death cant live with so many attacks over decades from sum crzy doctor

  282. MOSU GOJI says:

    I always find it hilarious when some clown babbles that a suicidal person needs to get “help”. It never occurs to these know-it-alls that perhaps the suicidal person has or is receiving “help”. There are countless instances of suicidal people that are on meds and currently receiving counseling and have been in long term counseling yet it’s not “helping”. What then? Do you get “Help-Help”? It’s also true that some mass killings have been perpetrated by people that have tried suicide and had received the magical cure-all “help”. So if someone hadn’t stuck their nose in and allowed that person to kill themselves a mass killing could have been averted. Psychology is an inexact “science” at best and as for meds ask any doctor they aren’t exactly sure why some of the meds work or what other effects may manifest. And psychiatrists themselves commit suicide so that is very telling in how effective this magical “help” is. Feeling suicidal does not have a one size fits all treatment. Sigmund Freud himself died by physician assisted suicide. https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/fighting-fear/201309/are-psychiatrists-more-prone-suicide-pediatricians

    • Tom Hal says:

      Psychology is NOT a natural science, regardless how fervently psychologists argue otherwise. True, cognitive sciences are legitimate sciences, but this is not largely what professional psychologists practice–especially when they impose their value judgments on actions.

  283. Sachin says:

    I want to leave this planet for good….I am sick of my life being made miserable by thugs called “planets” in astrology. I am sick of guides…who won’t guide you when your life needs the guidance the most…and will only do their best to prevent you from dying….i am sick of money minded and corporate headed rotten people….I believe there exist many beautiful worlds where love is the basis of existence and where there is understanding of “Source” or “God”, “the one”…where entities are happy and don’t have to dance with misery all the time and can do whatever they want with complete freedom…

  284. sydchic says:

    I have gone to see the professionals and they have thought I’m best to kill myself.My last psychologist made that pretty clear from the second I meet this person. They abuse with violence and the only way I can describe(used when speaking about economics) but it’s like a trickle down affect.They ruin your life violently and criminally,then your life is miserable.Nothing to do with anything I do wrong,as they forced me to do it by using deprivation/violence/illicit incarceration ect ect ect(mainly threats to my children to control me and force me).I tell the truth,without them life is so wonderful until IT finds me and sets the authorities on me like packs of wild wolves.

  285. Arthur says:

    My life is like a prison right now. I’m unemployed for the 3rd time within a year due to anger management problems. I was diagnosed with clinical deprssion since November and once before when i was 16, I was even in the hospital for a suicide attempt for a 2nd time. Treatment is too expensive, and I can’t find a job that pays well enough to afford it. I’ve tried papplying for higher paying jobs with a solid resume’ but with no call backs and it’s been over 3 weeks. I’m broke, have hardly any food, my family is 175 miles away and I have next to NO friends. My bank account overdrawn by over 100 dollars… I try to reach out to others who claim to care, but I’moften ignored. It’s like I don’t exist. Even when things where much better I still had these thoughts of just guzzling down bleach, jumping off a bridge, electrocuting myself, or taking a lethal dosage of drugs. I’ve even tried to order cyanide capsules online. I’m trappeed, and those that do respond just tell me to ‘pray about it,” which is utterly useless since I am an atheist. The thoughts of offing myself has since then become more common. I live alone and no one even calls to checkup on me unless once in a blue moon so I doubt anyone would even know that I’m gone if i do decide to do it. Makes it all the more tempting. It feels like i have nothing to live for at this point. All I ask for is just someone to talk to. To at the least distract me, but even my best friend hardly acknowledges me. I hate my life…I hate being angry and bitter. I want help but I can’t get it. I’m just about out of options.

  286. Destiny says:

    What if you’ve tried everything and still want to die?! Then should suicide be prevented!?

  287. HollowLife says:

    The first cause of misery is life itself. The second cause of miseries are the religious men that insists in knowing god to have so much love for mankind and that god shows his mercies through sufferings alone and that we should not think of suicide but to endure until god is done with his experiment and finely when hi’s done he can then dump us ruthlessly and be satisfied to that. The only thing, as advised by the priest, we should go to church to donate and pray so god can have mercy on our souls, while this dog/face deity never shows his presence to the world but stays hidden and only sends mercies by prayer alone but his mercies are filled with many sorrows. We are nothing but an experiment that is being done to us by higher beings which they call themselves gods and we are nothing more than puppets for their game, that’s why they don’t want us to use our will and decide for ourselves whether to live with these conditions or to put an end to our lives. If for instance, people use their will and decide to take their own lives, what will be of the world and their gods? surely they will be left high and dry and will be holding on to their own dikks and buttocks cheeks. You see, it was not up to us to be born but now it should be our own decision to die and with dignity at that and not suffer because the experiment went wrong or it was meant to for their own amusement and purpose. There should be 100% our choice to die and neither man nor gods can have any saying over our death. Furthermore: there is nothing that belong to us or to anybody in this world, it’s only a manipulation which gods are playing through our senses and we are only their breeding stock as their game and species for their own amusement and also their sport and food. Once this realization awakens in our minds then death will be the greatest release from being slaves of the gods within this mess of conditions of suffering and optical illusions. Why the world doesn’t permit euthanasia? Because our suffering means business to gods and the world. You know something is very wrong, and the “official” story
    is always a lie.
    But Who is Really In Charge Of Mankind? What are Their Goals?
    What is the real cause of all the Wars, and
    Evil Throughout Man’s History?

    • Marlena says:

      I hope those dicks who did not approve euthanasia have a taste of their own medicine

    • sydchics says:

      none is in charge,thats the problem.One peace of human trash sticks its nose into my life when a child,then I’ve never been able to get it out of my life.suicide is the only way for it to leave me alone.

  288. sydchic says:

    yep have done all this,now it’s how to arrange funerals .I’m angry because i was forced against my will to be like this,until then loved life–god dam loved it! I’ve no hope because authorities want to cover up serious crimes so do things your thinking is not capable of being so low,except theirs.They tried to force me to kill myself and they got it–they made my life hell and I know they killed my child deliberately,on paper its made to look legal with proof!!Sick of it,I’ve had someone wanting me to support their every need since age 14yrs old–so had it!Wish me outa this life soon enough! I tell people hoping one day they don’t support child abuse/sexual abuse then murdering them and it all looks legal and the victims fault!

  289. Anonymous says:

    i want honest friends who know how sick it is to live with those who make domestic violence an option

  290. lisa says:

    I have tried to kill myself many time’s but have a very high tolerance to medication half my family have woke up in the middle of opperations they could tell the surgeons what was said at 9 I saw my Doctor who was about to operate on me next covered in blood because they could not knock me out,in 2009 My Surgeon had to block my view so I would not see someone being operated on the Doctor who was to knock me out kept saying how sorry he was to my Surgeon, then last yr I did stop breathing after being allergic to the anaesthetic & was brought back to life even tho I told the Doctor if anything went wrong fax my Doctor for a copy of my ADVANCED HEALTH CARE DIRECTIVE BUT THE Lawers had kept the orignal and it says you have to have the original at all times or the Doctor does not have to abide by the document, I have suffered chronic pain most my life I have a club foot smaller by 4 sizes I fell and twisted it last week,I never sleep now did get 3hrs sleep on sleeping aids but not now! I had a gallstone attack last night along with a Ulcerated OESAPHAGUS attack combined with a migraine that had me throwing up water my hips,knees,hands & Neck all have Arthritis, so do I think I have the right to end MY LIFE,the answer is yes I am tired of pain this is not living it is just being,I have no hope,I dont laugh I can not even take my poor little dog for a walk anymore to top it off I was in a major hit and run accident so could not prove to insurance company thats what happened so in pain from that too.MY Nana and Uncle died 24hrs apart in 2009 7yrs ago this month apart from my Mum they were my World and my late Pop,my cousin died 2010 3 days after turning 47 my Uncle was 56,I am allergic to so much that I am bloated or have red rash or both ever since a dentist put a synthetic bone graft into an infected gum with out my permission, I told him to wait for the post then I got very sick went back to him he said it was not the graft or the temporary denture but it turns out I am allergic to acrylic, silver,gold and so on.So I think we all have the right to say when enough is enough it is not an easy choice I worry about my dog and Cat my mum and other family members but I am so tired of lying in pain

    • sydchic says:

      Hey Girl,I’m so sorry you are suffering.Please do not take my advice as gospel. I’ve no idea how old you are, if you are young I can tell you many go through these things ( different ways and degrees of pain) and intolerable pain in their lives, eventually they find they had strengths they could never of imagined.
      I can say you will look back at your life one day and wish another persons story of pain would believe that so much good stuff is ahead of them and you may not forget, but be kinda proud and content with who it has made you.

      I’m old.I’m 45 yrs and female and do not have this to look forward to due intentional harm that I will never have protection from.It has caused me much suffering too,for me I have little choice,but you do!

      Please know their are people that care,perhaps you haven’t even meet them yet! Physical pain is shocking to live with,I hope you find people to support you through it.

      You are precious and I would be so upset if i heard you did any harm to yourself,I’m just a stranger and you sound so awesome. xx

    • lisa says:

      Hi Sydchic thankyou for taking the the time to reply and be so very kind ,I was having I feel bad for myself day that nite,with lack of sleep And the Pain from the fall and I twisted my bad foot,I dont always be such a wet blanket The only time,s ive tried to take my life was when I was on anti depressants which always has the opposite effect on me as normally i am a happy-go-lucky human,the pain on very bad days gets to me,but I have the best Doctor and every one who works at the practice, chemist & where they take so much care of you,I find myself blessed from the people who take your blood for test,to the Secretary ” at the Doctors ofice I have the best Doctor she never rushes and is kind and compassionate, as are the staff at the chemist I have only lived in this town sice 2013 but will never move after receiving such wonderful care and the hospital like most hospital ” is over worked under paid give 190% they are wonderful and kind they worked so hard to bring me back to life the care was amazing so I do have to stop being selfish n wanting to go be with my Nana I am needed hear so I will stay and get gall stones out,Thankyou so much for reading my griping I remind myself everyday that I can see,walk and hear.

  291. Catherine says:

    Each of us is an individual. As someone who has tried unsuccessfully twice to kill themselves, I have chosen to not try anymore. Not because life has gotten better, but because both attempts left me with physical problems that make life harder. I know that God did not want me to die, and that I cannot live with any more problems.
    This however, has never removed either the emotional pain that resurrects itself on a regular basis or the daily difficulties that I live. So I live with the constant daily desire to simply end this life. After 35 years of this, I would love a foolproof way out. I am simply not prepared to make what I have to face worse. I would truly love an option other than constant unending pain.

    • HollowLife says:

      I cannot agree that god does not want someone to die, I think it’s the individual self that has not reached to the final decision and still hankers around for a solution to the problem of life. Death will not happen unless someone has completely died to self, world, and others – to the point where nothing can hold you back – you must break all identifications with body and the world – you discard all knowledge and self appearance – you summarize the entire world as an illusion – you cut the silver cord of communication – you reduce personality to “0” – you encounter the unknown – and you remain as the unknowable… But mind has to be completely extinguished on the path for any one to reach the final liberation and get out of the MATRIX.

  292. Lostforever says:

    I’ve been to almost 2 dozen mental hospitals looking for “help” to prevent a actual suicide attempt. I’ve been on every medication on the market. None of which have helped, only made things worse. I don’t believe there is a medication out there that actually helps. It may blind you from the problems of your life for a while, as they did for me. But reality always comes back sooner or later to remind me how horrible things still are and always will be. I can’t find peace, no matter how hard I’ve tried. I’m not going to kill myself, unfortunately. However I’m passed sick and tired of being “alive” just to try and deal with all these emotions and pain daily alone. I have absolutely no one in my life anymore. I have managed to push everyone away with my behaviors while trying to deal with things. It never was intentional, but fact of the matter is, I never failed to destroy every relationship I’ve had. Relationships that I can never fix. This is the end for me, I’ve seen the end of the tunnel, there’s no light. Only more pain and suffering. So I will disappear into the woods, leaving all behind. Which fortunately is nothing but this cracked phone I’m write this on. I will stay there alone as I’ve been for a while, and die like an old dog does when it knows its time is up. Everything I’ve read here, I’ve heard before. None of it is helpful unless you have support, which I have none. So now that I think about it, sorry I wasted your time with this. Goodbye.

  293. Dolores says:

    I want to die….. I wish there was something like an exit button where you could just poof disappear instead of most messy suicide methods…. I am almost 40 and my life has been torture ever since I can remember….. I have borderline personality disorder and I know I will never live like everyone else..form relationships like everyone else. …I am tired….. Exhausted….I don’t care how many people tell me how great I am they don’t know what’s its like to live with constant anxiety, depression, self doubt, low self esteem…. I have tried almost every anti depressant, anti psychotic and everything in between….I even tried electroconvulsive therapy…..nothing works…the only reason I am still here is my family….I don’t want this to destroy their lives but I don’t know how much more I can take……

    • Ted N says:

      I feel exactly like you.

    • Teena says:

      I do know what it is like to struggle everyday with depression/anxiety and loneliness.Sometimes I get a breather and pray my sadness stays far from me.I believe it has something to do with self love and valuing yourself.No matter what our story is or what we have experienced in our life since birth.Looking for someone to love us and value us.We will never find it outside of ourselves.Others are living on a different frequency a bit like a radio station.We connect with some who are on our energy frequency.I have found for myself that, that only happens now and then when they pop up in our lives unexpectedly.Hence feeling alone.We are all alone and if people choose not to connect with us,that’s bad luck..Why do we need others approval.Humans keep longing and searching for this.When you discover in yourself you are the observer looking out ward into the world,you can find what your longing for.Love and acceptance from yourself.When we notice other people with lots of people around them in their lives.People with lots of facebook friends.It is an illusion really if you look deeper.They are there in good times and bad times but only until it wears thin.They run a mile on their friend if the troubled time gets too heavy or long.It’s part of human nature (survival).Yes they say we are social creatures and it is healthy for us to connect with others,so we can learn and grow.If they choose to reject us that is their loss remember.There is something wrong with them not you.That little nagging negative voice inside us keeps telling us,there must be something wrong with me.Start telling that little nagging voice to shut the f…. up and create a new positive voice in your head.Your journey is yours and you are meant to be here as the person you know and love.We never die we continue on and on.May as well see it through and have a few laughs at everyone trying to work it out.You’re not on your own.I would rather be on my own than have false friends or family.Stay strong and give yourself your own Christmas gift.I do and I always love what i get under my tree.

  294. Anonymous says:

    The autonomy of ending ones existence should not be a governmental decision but rather the decision as to ones own beliefs. Once my faithful friend, my dog I rescued, seemingly my only friend passes away, I am sure to follow him. I want to go home to my Mom, to a place where the sun shines with big puffy clouds, it’s about 70 degrees where the Fall foliage is at its height and the apples are crisp and crunchy, where my 3 dogs and I can run through the woods and swim in the cool water.
    I want to go home where Mom has a nice turkey dinner with real mashed potatoes and real butter waiting for me with a warm apple pie . . . this is my here after . . . to run free and to be free . . .

  295. Anonymous says:

    I have wished God would take me because of severe depression. Sometimes I wish doctors would find a terminal illness because it would be an end to constant highs and major lows of mood disorder. I have felt mad at God for allowing depression to continue with no end in sight.

  296. Randy B says:

    I am 56 years old. In the last 10 years I have lost my son and wife to death, I’m getting a divorce from the love of my life, I’m suffering from chronic failed back syndrome and will suffer with physical pain the rest of my life and be in abject poverty. I have absolutely nothing to look forward too and I hate waking up everyday. I have the means on hand to take my life this week and I’m going to pick a day that’s meaningful to me. You can only take so much pain and suffering before its time to go!

  297. Jacqueline Sweeney says:

    I hope no one on here will take your life!! I know how painful it can be because I been there. Depressed and so many health problems but I am still here because of the grace of God. He took away my depression although I’m still suffering with pain. It’s not that bad now because He reminds me of the “Comforter” He has placed on the inside of me, He takes care of me! I have joy in the place of depression. I embrace peace in my pain!! I know some of you don’t believe in Him but that’s your choice. I’m just telling you what He has done for me. I was a mess until I fell on my knees and asked Him to please take this pain from depression away! I couldn’t handle it anymore. I was suicidal but chose to go to Him instead! He removed the mental pain that years of going to mental doctors and being on meds.couldn’t. It’s not about me now but I live my life for Him and I feel so much better mentally even though I hurt physically at times!! He helps bare my pain and I go on with a smile knowing one day I will be totally at rest when He decides:)

    • anonymous says:

      God is the one i blame for the problems i have, he made me with brain chemistry so screwed up i can’t control my emotions or properly socialize with others. Screw that guy…

    • Barbara says:

      I have prayed many many times for God to take away my depression and the horrible pain issues I have because of fibromyalgia and arthritis. For years I have prayed for this and healing still hasn’t happened. Life in bed or sitting in recliner is no way to live and that is where I live my life from. When I do go visit someone It is so painful Im in a bad mood the whole time. I don’t want to live like this and don’t see it changing. Pain pills help but docs wont prescribe them much any more. That also should be my choice, not the docs, if I want to take pain pills to help. So since the medical profession refuses to allow us the choices of how to live I dont see how they should tell us how we can die

  298. kavitha says:

    i want to die because i am not getting any jobs y i dont no i searched alot of jobs at last i got a security job and parents sister brother they are feeling that they want to do marriage …………but my life i am not liking just i want to die thats it but not getting dareness…………..

  299. Anonymous says:

    We should always try to prevent suicide if possible

    • Anonymous says:

      I agree in MOST cases, however some people should be allowed to make this choice without being forced to end their lives so painfully.

  300. Rebweb says:

    I’ve tempted suicide many times. The last time I was almost successful. I don’t want to die and I never have. I have gone up therapist, into a psychiatric hospital twice and take a good number of the different kinds of medications. I’ve tried changing my life. I’ve tried everything I can think of. But it stays the same. I know it’s hard to believe but some people (at least i) have bad lives and nothing will ever get better. My life goes against logic. Why do I hang on? Because I want to be a good person. Because I’m still hopeful (is not a good thing, try always failing and everything going wrong, see how that hope feels to you after a while). Mainly because I don’t want to cause any pain. Life is pain, I know. You say if my death causes people pain then there must be people who love you. It’s way more complex than that.

  301. Anonymous says:

    I’d like to die. .because there’s no redemption on this earth for me..only God can redeem me and I can’t find peace or love in this world for me to continue to live.

  302. Tom Hal says:

    I’d like in advance to express gratitude for this site’s owner or allowing a dissenting opinion; I mean no disrespect in my comment to anyone. The author of this article, together with her professional associates, misses the salient points of self determination. Psychologists may draw associations among variables, like the links between divorce and suicidal ideation by gender, or to the extent they work with natural scientists they can help us understand how the physical process of the brain influence behavior and feelings. The problem arises when psychologists then try to impose moral arguments on fundamental biology and individual choice. While I agree that most of us want to live in a culture in which deeply depressed people have resources to explore how to cope with their problems, it would be far better to circumvent those problems in the first place–like unremitting poverty, childhood abuse, or persistent unemployment, as examples.

    Of course, no one can likely eliminate these problems. People have to deal with inevitable life difficulties, and some are not as well equipped as others–or even inclined–to do so. If psychology could offer people a guaranteed way out of their life pains, which seems exceedingly unlikely, then most sufferers would flock to psychologists and suicide rates would plummet. Obviously, what psychology can do is just not sufficient–for very many sufferers. But professional psychology, much like religion in ages past (still?), presumes to judge what decisions are “right” and “wrong.” In this, it oversteps its bounds. Only the individual can decide for her- or himself what life decisions are “right” for her/him, so long as they aren’t immediately endangering others’ survival.

    Worse, professional psychologists then lobby the courts for the power to enforce commitments of other adults, including physical restraining and forced drugging. All in the name of “saving” people–doing what is in others’ best interests. Much like religion in centuries past wielded control over others’ minds and bodies because religion as an institution assumed it knew what was in others’ best interests. In this regard, I think, psychology as a discipline has become the new secular-religion, its courting of the natural sciences and statistical models notwithstanding. It’s noteworthy that even in physical medicine, allopathy, at least, physicians are not the decision makers in life-or-death matters. Physicians provide expert opinions about physiological facts which patients then use to make their own decisions. Yet psychology begs for the power both to decide, based on patients’ beliefs, what constitutes an inability to make “the right” decision, and to act to prevent “wrong” decisions.

    Whether we agree with someone else’s choice to end her or his life ought not to translate into power over that human being where otherwise she/he demonstrates a consistent, clearly articulated will not to continue living. Science doesn’t hold “values.” Humans do. And psychologists abuse their affiliation with cognitive neurosciences to lend legitimacy to their official moral evaluative stance on an ultimately private decision, an egregious infringement on individual autonomy. Thankfully, more and more nations and citizens are recognizing this as a social wrong and are taking legislative steps to correct it.

    Sorry for the long comment. Again, I mean no disrespect to anyone.

    • Dale says:

      Somehow if we do not fit into what the rest of society says we should do or how to act,then we must be fixed. If we do no harm to others or any living thing then do not judge me. I have problems and i choose to live my life in a different way but i do no harm yet i am persecuted. People make my life so miserable that i want to die.

  303. Scott Mence says:

    “Even among people who wanted to die so strongly that they tried to end their life, most ultimately chose to live.”

    Begging the question. Result is not necessarily indicative of a poor initial choice.

    “Yet another important reason to prevent suicide is its obvious finality.”

    Not a reason.

    “Even if their external situation cannot change, their inner world can.”

    ‘Can’ is irrelevant. Without cause to think that it will, falling back on this line of thinking is, in and of itself, the irrational position. Which is how most people think about suicide. I appreciate why this is the case, but please don’t demean the option as irrational just because you don’t like it. Unsupported dogma isn’t going to help people very much.

    If you want to talk seriously about suicide, you could at least try being honest about it – or at least rational.

  304. Anonymous says:

    I too feel like I don’t belong in this world. My life is a mess. That won’t change because I don’t belong here.
    Nothing wrong with going through the exit door. We all die. Why can’t we chose when?

    • Anonymous says:

      I’m sorry you feel that way but if you didn’t belong in this world you wouldn’t be here

  305. Anonymous says:

    I feel sometimes depression has nothing to do with it. You just really seriously whole heartedly want to die. Sometimes with good rationale reasons. Why should I have to exist in a place I hate doing the things I hate doing being around people I hate. I think that’s cruel and inhumane. I truly hate living. There honestly is no reason for me to stick around. Too bad I am to scared to die painfully but I am not afraid of pain. That makes no sense. I guess if I kill myself in a painful way I want to make sure I die. It would be better than hating to wake up everyday. Then think I would be doing the government a favor.

  306. Miserable says:

    People often tell me that suicide is the coward’s way out. I used to hold that belief myself. However, that is not the case. It is not easy to end your own life. There are so many reasons for which people chose life, but for others, none of those reasons are worth living. Maybe some people aren’t just suited for life. Perhaps those people can never truly be happy, and for them, suicide is the only escape from their misery. In extreme cases, perhaps assisted suicide for mental illness would be a blessing. I’m thinking now, that I am one of those people.

    • Scott M says:

      Yeah, it annoys me when people fall back on that woefully deceptive adage. Suicide takes courage, and what’s worse, I actually feel even more worthless for not having the courage to bring it all to an end.

    • Anonymous says:

      I feel the same way. ..friend.

    • minworkshop says:

      Instead of sucide, why does God keep the people who are in so much pain alive when he let’s people who are doing great things in this world die? I want to believe in God and his watching over me, but I have been in emotional pain and now physical pain since I was a child. I have nothing to live for. Why am I still here? I dont want to commit sucide as I might fail and make the situation worse, so why doesn’t God see how I feel and let someone who is full of life live and let me go to wherever. Purgatory or heaven hopefully.

    • Anonymous says:

      I am certain I want to die life is unbearable I just want to be at rest

    • HollowLife says:

      To Scott M.(Yeah, it annoys me when people fall back on that woefully deceptive adage. Suicide takes courage, and what’s worse, I actually feel even more worthless for not having the courage to bring it all to an end.) >>> Life is sweet in it’s bitterness and the entire life is courageous in living, in being – not in dying. Mind belongs to life as god’s made conditions to sustain existence while life feeds on life. Mind can never develop courage to end itself and not even death can end it, it will rearrange itself back to conditions and still maintain it’s being, it’s personality. Mind is vision, being and becoming, and jumps from life to life and always caries the essence of life and the ME, the EGO. As to my understanding life is semi/conscious and mostly unconscious, but man has the conscious/capacity to deconstruct conditions and actually go beyond mind and god. Knowing the facts that I am a puppet to conditions to slave for life’s purpose and work myself out for the conditions of being and be a breeding stock, is very tiresome. All senses are life’s conditions for the purpose of reproduction while life maintains it’s beauties and charms to attract and distract the mind and slave to being a ‘mammy or a daddy,’ and think that I am somebody…this is actually the deception that unperceived forces impose on every being and keep them in shackles and slavery. You can see it out of your window or when you go to church, the sensual attraction steer the mind and keeps it in bondage just for a fleeting satisfaction that can also bring troubles and miseries. The facts of nature always tries to beautify itself and that death and ugliness are always being hidden beneath the beauties and charms. life and mind will not let me rest but knowing the facts of slavery will lift some of my burdens and as I contemplate over them daily, and seeing myself deteriorating, the grip of attraction will be loosen… also knowing that all of these have no basis but lead to suffering and death, mind will be dissatisfied and eventually will annihilate itself. Finally the mind will disintegrate from being and gain freedom from all conditions of being and becoming. Just making sure that there’s nothing left to hold me back and everything is thrown to the winds, then beyond doubt there’s no self in it, just conditions which have appeared by life and will disappear by death. When this becomes ingrained in me deeply, life and death looses their integration and personality and mind goes beyond thought. A spark of mind can blow off the entire existence and disappear from time altogether. This is meant that before time begun the timeless will reveal itself to all existence as eternity and that life and death are only shadows. Just a game that whosoever finds ways to stop, disappears beyond time into eternity. I haven’t wash now for a long time and start to stink and I perceive with mind the mind that is unwilling to find satisfaction anywhere, always outrageous and complains, and be sure that others will complain because of you and vice versa. This is the life’s miseries and also of death’s. How can this mind find peace in death? surely not even god’s are able to to find peace within themselves. This mind needs to be slapped upside the head or taken to the forest and tied it up with a rope and still wont remain there, how can it remain in the grave? Train it, kill it every day little by little until it’s visions knowledge and hopes blur up. Don’t listen to the doctors when they are telling you where the problem is…don’t listen to clergy for any stupid hopes, don’t listen to you family for kindness and lovey/dovey assistance…push god and all god’s aside and see if you can, what’s really happening with you. You are the source and also it’s cure. Think for yourself and by yourself until mind disappears. Get lost as far as you can and never look back. Extinguish yourself and dissolve into eternity – That’s the only purpose to being alive, to relocate eternity……..Why suffer for this conjured up and deteriorating life? Think and discard all you can discard until you are feather/light…..

    • Ted N says:

      I feel the same way you all do.

  307. Jason H says:

    I was infected with HIV at age 8 from dirty medical blood. My entire life I have had to come up with $28,000 a year for one pill. I’ve spent $500k out of pocket. More than anything.. I’m tired of being blamed for a nanovirus. I’m tired of people in Christian churches trying to kill me because of a nanovirus. I’m tired of being a slave to Big Pharma and our country because of a nanovirus. I will be ending my life not out of medical needs.. but simply to stop being made fun of by asshole Christians.

    • Jacqueline Sweeney says:

      I am a Christian and I will never make fun of you! A Christian church that makes fun of anyone is fake because we are no better then they are. Christ died for all of us and His love is for us all! You hang in there and don’t worry about what others has to say about you. You are beautiful and you are loved. Hold your head up and show all that you are somebody in the eyes of God! His eyes is the only ones that matters anyway, not man. Man will treat you wrong but God loves keeps you strong in the mist of your enemies! REMEMBER… Christian or not, you are somebody and loved by God!!!

    • sydchic says:

      IN my case I have dealt with a catholic mafia of police/doctors you name it-the do gooders I didn’t even invite or want anything to do with, wreck my life and put those i love in the ground the main stand over since 1985 ex church person was for money and young sex—it now had me diagnosed as crazy about the things done to us-the violence/deprivation psychological scars now have me wanting to die-i think it humane.Christians are controlled idiots keep away,they want genocide and to use up anything they think worthy or sinners-to them its your fault.

    • JannaG says:

      I am a Christian too, and I also would never make fun of you! I have high risk hpv – not from sleeping around – but from being physically intimate while married. I found out after being divorced for several years, during which time I was abstinent. Many women have this, but I was unfortunate enough to have my body not suppress the virus. This resulted in a complete hysterectomy to avoid cervical cancer. Some people are very ignorant, wanting to believe that doing the right things will always protect you from STDs and other forms of harm. That being said, I’ve met wonderful Christians who are more open minded. I have no doubt that Christ himself is very angry with the asshole Christians. I look forward to the day when He has a word or two or more to say to those people to put them in their place. I hope that you are able to meet nicer people in this world. We are out there.

  308. Alexis says:

    Saying “suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem” is misleading and wrong. Some people, such as myself, have depression built into our brains; no amount of therapy, medication, counseling, or intervention can keep the suffering at bay. It is a permanent problem, and we have no idea what specifically causes depression, or how to resolve it. Live with suicidal depression your entire adult life, receiving no benefit from any sort of treatment, and then tell me it’s a “temporary problem.”

  309. California says:

    As good as that sounds, it’s a bit of a fantasy

  310. Dipu says:

    Hi All, Those who are depressed in life and want to commit suicide but cant do so then lets meet and leave our cities and go somewhere else away where we can share and care.

  311. nor says:

    You know what I hate? “Call 911! Remove tools of suicide! Don’t let her/him die!” . Will you live a life for that person? Will you bear his/her pain for them? If this person suffered something that made him/her so in pain can you erase this happening? The answer is ‘no’ you wont, no you can’t. If somebody is in distress it’s right to help but lack of respect of somebodys will to die is not right. There are fates far worse than death itself. I wish everybody beautiful lives but I understand that sometimes its just too much.

  312. Junglebeat says:

    I’m
    The most miserable
    No friends and maybe became schizophrenia
    I don’t like my family as much as I love my friends and now I cannot make friends because I’m a piece of shit who cannot function in the real world
    No one will ever love me that I can love back
    I’m so fucked

  313. Missing jungle says:

    Once I entertained suicdal thoughts in my head it’s never left
    It made more sense to just quit this game called life
    I don’t see the reason because the society don’t give me reason
    It’s likely a miserable life because I’m having problems since a child
    Emotionally and very awkward
    I can’t flow with this society and corporate world. This madness insane life when I’m so different and see life in a different way
    I wish I never live in a city
    I would have been much happier to live with the primitive people in the mountains making my own food or starving
    But having a community
    Which is lacking in this society so much
    Ah life

    What a mess

  314. Anonymous says:

    This is not suicide this is something I want to do!!!!!

  315. Timbo says:

    I don’t understand the vehemence with which the law and “well meaning people” determine that suicide is wrong. What if every single person had an “opt out” button installed on their arm which gently and painlessly lead to their death? Would religion somehow hold us here on earth? What are the benefits to someone being forced to exist on a planet where they’ve decided they don’t want to live? The fact is that most people who experience mental illnesses don’t like the way they’re being treated and can’t understand why they’re blamed for the way they can’t help thinking. If this world was more accepting maybe people wouldn’t want to opt out due to being completely misunderstood but that’s not where things are at, and other people don’t have the right to hold people to compulsorily live on this plane. If a person wants to die they should be allowed to die, full stop, if that’s what they decide. It’s not like they haven’t thought about it, and it’s not like regret isn’t inherent in any attempt at dying.

    • Lucy says:

      Hi Timbo. I think if people had an opt out button they could press there would be two kinds of people, those who press it prematurely without thinking it through (impulsive act) and then those who continue to struggle but feel a sense of calm and peace because they know they have control to push that button anytime they want. Its not the option of an accessible, peaceful way to die that’s the issue but the feeling of control. When a person doesn’t feel in control it can make them feel stressed and frantic. I mean think about it what’s the rush to suicide if you can always press a button? It may give someone the courage to face another day, no rush and maybe the next day you won’t feel like pressing this button. I don’t think people think of suicide because they don’t like the world, they think of suicide because they don’t like their lives, themselves.

    • Tom Hal says:

      Nicely said. Agreed.

  316. Dan says:

    Yesterday was my birthday. I had dozens of calls and messages from well-wishers, and my wife decorated the whole house and cooked me an amazing meal. And I thought, “why do people have to make my life so difficult and create all this extra work on my birthday of all days?”

    I’ve felt this way for 20 years. Tell me again why suicide is not rational?

  317. R says:

    I am the R of the previous comment, and after hearing all of your pain, I just want to tell you that I love you all. I am sorry that the burdens you carry are so heavy. I wish I could take them away from each and every one of you. I know that many of you are to tired too try anymore, and believe me, I get that. Life can be so beautiful and so terrible at the same time, and the only thing that gives any of it meaning is love. Even if you have no one else who loves you, I do, and if you do decide that the pain is unbearable, know that there is at least one person out there who does not judge you.

    • Jacqueline Sweeney says:

      I agree with you “R”. Everyone here is loved by me but more by God! It grieves my heart to know they want to end their life. However, I have been there but I think God that He helped me to see that life is worth living if I live it for Him, not man or myself! Since I put Him in charge of my life, what once was ugly because of my depression is now beautiful because of God! I live my life for Him now and do that which is pleasing to Him. I am much happier because He gives me joy inside when times are hard. He let’s me know that everything will be alright because He has brought me out of darkness. I walk in the light now and peace follows me instead of the pain that use to. You see, years of mental hospitals wasn’t my answer, God was!!!

  318. Randeep says:

    Suicide is good…i also want to do suicide..but cant find any good easy way to kill my self…i want to die bcoz in my area I’m the only person who don’t have good house,i live in area there 80 house total and only my house is look like shit,bcoz its made of bamboos and shit of cow,its very old house…when rain comes there are water all over in my house…every where is water…i can’t sleep in night,bcoz of water and rain… I’m soo poor….all other 79 house owner and there child see me and my house always laugh at me…alwasy make joke of my house…i don’t have money to make new house…i fear of rain…why god sent me to this poor family…i wish my father sleep early that night …my father is havy drinker…i don’t like him…even my mother also don’t like me…nobody in the world care fore me,(and i dont want anyone to love me)i don’t no why a shit(u called god) send me to this earth

  319. Anonymous says:

    no because I am black in America I would much rather die than hear how everyone hates me to add insult to injury I am also bipolar2 what do I do in a city I can’t escape but won’t hire me and wants me dead lifes not awesome for A Black female in Milwaukee wisconsin I just want to die but the law doesn’t allow it but if I angered a cop he could kill me and not even lose his job I just don’t want to feel pain White people can have this world as far as I care.

  320. Anonymous says:

    You say that you wished you’d died as a child but now you have a family Jesus I am in actual pain 24/7 due to a condition I generated in my body whilst raising money for kids with cancer. You know everybody helps them young/old, but I’ve lost all my friends, I can’t work so I sit in my armchair & watch the television 24/7 knowing full well if I start anything I’ll end up in pain. Yes I am on morphine it does fuck all except makes me constipated & I can’t get it up I am covered in scars & taken endless overdose but I am still here

  321. Anonymous says:

    Eventually, my ability to tolerate my own pain and suffering will surpass my ability to tolerate my concern for leaving behind those who care for me.

    At 41, I have struggled with Major Depression since I was 17; the best explanation I am given is that this truly is a chemical imbalance. I’ve never experimented with drugs and I rarely drink, a few glasses of wine a year during dinner parties or special occasions.

    I am educated, high-functioning, and generally have a job that I enjoy. At five years, it’s a job I’ve been at for the longest time in a while. I have had success with medication and therapy, but severe episodes reoccur, lasting a few months, or up to two years.

    I am fully aware that things can and do get better for a time. However, it is a repeated traumatic experience to enter into a period of remission feeling strong, celebrating your strength and endurance but there is always (always!) concern of a potential and unexplained relapse into an acute episode.

    I am an advocate for treatment, but even during remission I consider how many more times can I handle feeling like everything is always at risk if/when another episode comes on.

    • Lucy says:

      No pleasure without pain, no success without any failure, no such thing as a constant state of pain nor a constant state of happiness.

    • FFSL says:

      No Lucy, pleasure is quite possible without pain, and happiness is quite possible without depressive episodes, as evidenced by the many people who go through life without depression. I assume you’re one of them, or you’d be showing more understanding and wouldn’t be handing out trite sayings to suffering people.

  322. Anonymous says:

    >an irrevocable act
    So what?
    I have made peace with my death.
    Once one embraces the inevitable, death seems trivial, a mere link in a huge chain of events that leads nowhere.